[Religion and Revolution]: Mod Development

[raystuttgart]

I will fix it.

Thanks.

 

[Schmiddie]

I changed:

Denmark from middle_green into white
Portugal from white into dark_green
Tupi from dark_green into middle_green

Flags from Denmark and the Danish King improved.

 

[raystuttgart]

@Schmiddie:

I have checked it and it is all looking good.

Except one bug I found:

You deleted the new button for Oppussoquionuske (and put the graphic into the atlas).
But you did not change the Leaderhead-ArtDefine to point to the button in the atlas.
(It is still pointing to the now deleted button.)

 

[Schmiddie]

Ups, I forgot to copy the new file into the upload folder.

And correct, I had already deleted the file as I red your post. I will copy it back next time. But I don't know why...we don't need this file...

 

[raystuttgart]

Ups, I forgot to copy the new file into the upload folder.

And correct, I had already deleted the file as I red your post. I will copy it back next time. But I don't know why...we don't need this file...

You misunderstand me.
The file is not needed, but the reference in ArtDefine for the Leader must be corrected to point at the button in the atlas.
(Last time I looked it was still pointing at the now deleted graphic ...)

 

[raystuttgart]

European Latecomers

Hi guys, this was already discussed a little in other posts and threads,
so I would like to take up that topic again.

Basic thought is, that we have some Nations that were of almost no importance for the scenario our mod is based on.
They arrived very late in the New World and never held big posession.
However, they were there.

To name the ones we have been talking about:

* Brandenburg
* Sweden
* Russia
* Courland


Introducing them as Major European Nation would simply feel wrong to most of us.

Thus the idea was to introduce them as Latecomers / Minor European Nations.

This is the general concept I would suggest:

1. We generally try to keep them simple.

-> They cannot be played by human
-> Only one colonial leader (+ king)
-> We do not introduce a 3rd Religion (Orthodox) for Russia
-> Traits of other Civs are reused
-> Graphics of other Civs are reused
...

Catholic: Russia (although actually Orthodox), Courland
Protestant: Sweden, Brandenburg

2. From a certain point of time (game turn), there will be a chance every round, that one of the Latecomers will arrive in the New World.

-> Feature fully balanceable in XML (min_game_turn, chance_per_turn, num_latecomers_for_mapsize, ...)
-> There is some randomness in there, when they will actually arrive
-> The amount of latecomers will be defined at mapsize

3. They can arrive on every possible Europe-Travel-Plot

-> Thus chances are given, that they will actually find a spot to settle.

4. Otherwise they would work like every other European Nation.

--------------------

Comments:

This feature will be a lot of work and I would really like to limit further efforts for it.

The Latecomers would never be a real competition to the player.
They would actually be more like "Victims".

However, this feature might add a little bit of atmosphere to the game.

This is definitely no topic for Release 1 from my side.
The question is, if we should put it on our "list of planned features" or not.

--------------------

Feedback ?

 

[Schmiddie]

Hi ray,

I really like these thoughts!

In general it sounds very interesting.

I agree that this is not a topic for our Release no. 1. But we should keep this “feature” in mind for a later release and for discussion after we have finished all work for Release no. 1.
I don’t know how much there is to do with regard to the programming part, but I know there would be a lot of work regarding the graphic part, because we need a lot of unit and building graphics for every new nation (and also flags and buttons).

But yes, let’s put it on the “list of planned features".

 

[agaro]

Portugal -> (Dark) Green (a color that fits to the flag)
England -> Red (as it is)
Denmark -> White (would also fit, to my opinion)

The changes work well. It is a toss up between Denmark and England as to who goes red and who goes white - but Schmiddie's doing such a good job with graphics it is fair that he gets the choice he wants.

They both look good now, and all the units wandering around with their banners and flags look great. I am zooming in to look at all the individual units much more than I ever used to.

One thing that still needs to be changed are the little crosses for missions that get added to native villages when a European nation has a mission there.

Denmark's is still 2 shades of green, and I presume Portugal's would be white with some trim color (although I haven't actually seen one in this update).

 

[agaro]

They should be able to do that.

Confirming that wagons can walk on and off galleons to the land same as other mobile units. Excellent.

 

[orlanth]

European Latecomers

Yes, that sounds like a cool idea. I agree that effort spent on it should be limited and it could be added at a late stage; implementing and improving main features such as Economy, Tech and Religion are much more important. The existing standard graphics could be completely reused for this, needing just flags and buttons.

 

[Schmiddie]

Denmark's is still 2 shades of green, and I presume Portugal's would be white with some trim color (although I haven't actually seen one in this update).

Thank you and interesting to hear that! I will try to find the source of that mistake...

 

[raystuttgart]

Thank you and interesting to hear that! I will try to find the source of that mistake...

It is in the Gamefonts.

You could either change the Gamefont or the XML-Entry.
(Changing XML-Entry is probably easier.)

It is this entry in CIV4ArtDefines_Civilization.xml :

<iFontButtonIndex>

I can take care of it at the weekend.

 

[Robert Surcouf]

Hi everyone,

I like the idea of the change of colors. I also liked the Aztecs old color. Unfortunately I think it was light_green or middle_green, which we are actually using... Actual color seems a little dark to me...

I like the idea of late coming European nations...

I also vote in favor of the new huge size maps. However I must say, I will probably have to buy a new computer to be able to play with such large maps...
(By the way, you were talking about mod's loading time in another thread. I takes usually two minutes or even more to load our mod... Never less than one minute! But it does load every time. )

 

[Schmiddie]

I tried to adjust the color of the aztec.

The problem is, that - if we brighten the color up, the color of the aztec is very similar to Portugal and is no longer easy to keep them apart.

It is in the Gamefonts.

You could either change the Gamefont or the XML-Entry.
(Changing XML-Entry is probably easier.)

It is this entry in CIV4ArtDefines_Civilization.xml :

<iFontButtonIndex>

I can take care of it at the weekend.

Fixed

 

[colonialfan]

European Latecomers

Hi guys, this was already discussed a little in other posts and threads,
so I would like to take up that topic again.

Glad you opened this up again for discussion.

European LatecomersBasic thought is, that we have some Nations that were of almost no importance for the scenario our mod is based on.
They arrived very late in the New World and never held big posession.
However, they were there.

To name the ones we have been talking about:

* Brandenburg
* Sweden
* Russia
* Courland

I've been thinking about the European Civs selected and here are my thoughts.

Sweden:
They had colonies in North America, in the New Jersey/Pennsylvania/Deleware area, but only from 1638-1655, and a colony in the Caribbean from 1785-1878. Despite their European status, their presence in North America was limited and very short, and their possesion within the Caribbean was gained after the WOI.

Courland:
Few people have ever heard of it and it their colony was tenious and shortlived - 1654-1659, a year break, then 1660-1666. After that any remaining colonial presence they had on Tobago was ruled by either the Dutch, Spanish or British.

Russia: Their colonial presence starts in 1732, and their first colony in Alaska was not founded until 1784, a year after the WOI ended.

Prussia/Brandenburg: Held two colonial possessions in the Caribbean. One was leased from 1685-1780 from the Danish West India Company, the other was annexed from 1689-93, then returned to the Danes.

If I had to pick one it would be between, Sweden and Prussia/Brandenburg. Courland is very much a nonentity, and Russia historically just gets involved way too late in the game. Personally I'd opt for Sweden, at least they owned their colonies, and did not lease them from another European power. Besides the Swedes did give us the log cabin.

European Latecomers
Introducing them as Major European Nation would simply feel wrong to most of us.

Absolutely.

European Latecomers
Thus the idea was to introduce them as Latecomers / Minor European Nations.

This is the general concept I would suggest:

1. We generally try to keep them simple.

-> They cannot be played by human
-> Only one colonial leader (+ king)
-> We do not introduce a 3rd Religion (Orthodox) for Russia
-> Traits of other Civs are reused
-> Graphics of other Civs are reused
...

Catholic: Russia (although actually Orthodox), Courland
Protestant: Sweden, Brandenburg

2. From a certain point of time (game turn), there will be a chance every round, that one of the Latecomers will arrive in the New World.

-> Feature fully balanceable in XML (min_game_turn, chance_per_turn, num_latecomers_for_mapsize, ...)
-> There is some randomness in there, when they will actually arrive
-> The amount of latecomers will be defined at mapsize

3. They can arrive on every possible Europe-Travel-Plot

-> Thus chances are given, that they will actually find a spot to settle.

4. Otherwise they would work like every other European Nation.


The Latecomers would never be a real competition to the player.
They would actually be more like "Victims".

However, this feature might add a little bit of atmosphere to the game.

I think it would add something to the game. Might I suggest an additional feature. The minor European nation at some point cedes all of its colonial possesions to the closest or most dominent major European rival, like you get in the original colonization.

European LatecomersThis is definitely no topic for Release 1 from my side.
The question is, if we should put it on our "list of planned features" or not.

Why not.

 

[raystuttgart]

Fixed

Great.

I will check.
(I was gone for the last 2 days.)

 

[raystuttgart]

Might I suggest an additional feature. The minor European nation at some point cedes all of its colonial possesions to the closest or most dominent major European rival, like you get in the original colonization.

I don't like that for several reasons:

A) It is additional effort and I really want to limit further efforts for this feature.
B) You might get a city you don't even want to have.
C) It is not necessary, because these nations will probably be conquered by their close European neighbours anyways.

Edit:

Since there are no objections, I have put European Latecomers on our list (for later releases).

 

[Karl-Heinz]

Please give them not only the graphics from the other civs. We had tried in TAC to give the Civs unique graphics.

Russia for instance could have an unique Russian-city-artstyle. If its possible Russia could start from pacific.

 

[raystuttgart]

@team:

I have fixed, improved and balanced Native Raids.
(DLL and XML changed. It is uploaded to SVN.)

Fixing:
I had forgotten to merge some XML-changes when we had our big merge with TAC 2.02d.

Improving:
There are addititional XML entries for balancing.
Logic has been improved a little, too.

Balancing:
General balancing of course.
But also specific balancing for Native Leaders. (attitude thresholds and random chances for raids)

-------------

Would be great, if somebody could do a (longer) test game sometime and give me some feedback.

 

[colonialfan]

I don't like that for several reasons:

A) It is additional effort and I really want to limit further efforts for this feature.
B) You might get a city you don't even want to have.
C) It is not necessary, because these nations will probably be conquered by their close European neighbours anyways.

Fair point.