Replay #4 Slow and steady wins the race

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Why is HoF so unpopular?
I wouldn't say that. However, since you can't shadow HoF games and they aren't public, these type of games really don't attract the kind of people who frequent the S&T forums...ie those who want to play the same map and compare the results (arguing about the optimal strategy to win the map) with other players.

In HoF, you really don't compete *directly* with other players (every map is different). In S&T forum games, since the map is *exactly* the same, everyone who plays the map, in essence (excluding RNG garbage), is competing directly vs other players. If player A finishes the map sooner than player B, the case can be made that player A either had a better strategy or is in fact a bettter player. In HoF, if player A had triple gems/double wet corn and player B had double plains cow, just because player A scored higher doesn't necessarily mean player A is better than player B. There is just no realistic way to compare skills (and the strategy used to win the map) when the maps (and starts/opponents) are different.

HoF focuses more on the highest score possible for a given victory condition whereas S&T forum games focus more on the best strategy to win a particular map.
 
enjoying the read Ser...even if not commenting...

continue please :).

Of course the whole thing (huge, marathon, 200 hours) would be too stressful for me to play (mostly because 90% of my games are played <6 hours :-D), doesn't mean you don't offer great insight into civ world...

The Freddy gift was absolutely brilliant.

As for the HOF thing... well you have to consider that
1) you need to install mod
2) you can't use your own mods (for example my BULL CvGameCore.dll is in conflict with BUFFY so I have to usually switch the dll to original = more work)
3) you can't run shadows, since you usually don't post original save ;-)
4) and of course another one is we can't comment parts of game based on saves and even if we could it would be completely irrelevant

Typical live forum game is for readers more involving since you can directly influence decisions of the "driver" and even then there is a lot less live forum games now then it was.
So it's not about you, but overall traffic in S&T over last 6 months is much lower then it was.
 
Great story, and it's really teaching me about the power of all-out chopping. Also, never thought War Chariots would be THAT powerful, I definitely have to play Hatshepsut more (I'm addicted to Creative leaders).
 
Great story, and it's really teaching me about the power of all-out chopping. Also, never thought War Chariots would be THAT powerful, I definitely have to play Hatshepsut more (I'm addicted to Creative leaders).

War Chariots are one of the best if not the best UU in the game. @.@
 
FW is slightly better imo (they are non resource and valuable longer time), but loving WC's for sure ;-).
Oh and Quecha is probably slightly better then WC too.

Mm the FW is strong, but the WC and QQnoob are just a little better. WC, and QQnoob are tied for first for me. But there are lots of situations where a WC is going to be much better than a QQnoob, but the same goes for the QQnoob over the WC. Which of the three that is best really depends on the map.
 
Well, I've come back and read through this a few times just to see the way you play things. I'm so far really impressed and the game is really intense because of all the AI. I personally have been slightly busy lately though :p (too busy for Civ :o ) with starting a business and the end of school etc...

But what I'm really looking for is how you continue this game so it can also help me learn as well :) Like I played this game on Emperor and play fairly well in the beginning but then my game drops afterwards. Like in this specific game, I could only get as far as Metal Casting with the Oracle whilst expanding my cities at the same time. Had marble, stone so I went for the mids and oracle. How on earth did you get to Feudalism? Is it because of marathon which makes it slightly easier?
 
I wouldn't say that. However, since you can't shadow HoF games and they aren't public, these type of games really don't attract the kind of people who frequent the S&T forums...ie those who want to play the same map and compare the results (arguing about the optimal strategy to win the map) with other players.

I already thought about posting my Writeups in the HoF Forum instead of S&T Forum, but was afraid, that most people would overlook it there, as most games (however they're played) are posted in S&T.

In HoF, you really don't compete *directly* with other players (every map is different). In S&T forum games, since the map is *exactly* the same, everyone who plays the map, in essence (excluding RNG garbage), is competing directly vs other players. If player A finishes the map sooner than player B, the case can be made that player A either had a better strategy or is in fact a bettter player. In HoF, if player A had triple gems/double wet corn and player B had double plains cow, just because player A scored higher doesn't necessarily mean player A is better than player B. There is just no realistic way to compare skills (and the strategy used to win the map) when the maps (and starts/opponents) are different.

Hmm. I think, that in the normal shadows that are played in this game, also a lot of random factors influence the game, it's impossible to say A is better than B because he finished 200y earlier, when B got a stupid random-DoW before Alpha i. e. And the competeition between HoF players is also very close imo, as we all only play very good maps. Of course, one cannot compete against a game where someone pops HBR in T5 of the game :D . But I think I understand what you mean, problem of this game is mostly, that it's finished but more so, that it has very unusual settings. I used to use savegames, but nobody ever shadowed me, 18 Civs on a Huge map with Marathon speed is too much too adapt to for most I think, as the game takes more time than the normal 10 games the players play here as coanda said.

HoF focuses more on the highest score possible for a given victory condition whereas S&T forum games focus more on the best strategy to win a particular map.

HoF is also about the best way to win a map because the best way implies the best score normally! So I don't see that difference tbh.

enjoying the read Ser...even if not commenting...

continue please :).

Of course the whole thing (huge, marathon, 200 hours) would be too stressful for me to play (mostly because 90% of my games are played <6 hours :-D), doesn't mean you don't offer great insight into civ world...

The Freddy gift was absolutely brilliant.

As for the HOF thing... well you have to consider that
1) you need to install mod
2) you can't use your own mods (for example my BULL CvGameCore.dll is in conflict with BUFFY so I have to usually switch the dll to original = more work)
3) you can't run shadows, since you usually don't post original save ;-)
4) and of course another one is we can't comment parts of game based on saves and even if we could it would be completely irrelevant

Typical live forum game is for readers more involving since you can directly influence decisions of the "driver" and even then there is a lot less live forum games now then it was.
So it's not about you, but overall traffic in S&T over last 6 months is much lower then it was.

Vranasm, I posted the saves in all my earlier Replays, TMIT was the only one who even offered once to shadow me, but even he didn't because "the time between turns was too much" for him. And I know, the game is over / has been played till the end, but I'd love to get some suggestions to what I could have done differently. Even though they don't matter for this game, they could play a great part in the next one, so please do post suggestions, say what you would have done differently!

And if the traffic is down here, it's time that we revive the forum with some really good threads :) .

Great story, and it's really teaching me about the power of all-out chopping. Also, never thought War Chariots would be THAT powerful, I definitely have to play Hatshepsut more (I'm addicted to Creative leaders).

I learned the power of chopping after having failed Prince (once) , then I came to this forum, and after that instantly won. Chopping is probably the most overpowered thing in whole Civ, I even changed the climate of my maps from Tropical to Temperate, because those maps have more Forrests! Of course, Tropical maps allows for higher population, but one has to whip too much of the infra, therefor, has a lower population than on a Temperate map, funny, not?

War Chariots are one of the best if not the best UU in the game. @.@

Quechua is better, but I agree that it's the 2nd best unit in the game. It's higher base-STR and FS-Immunity makes it almost 50% stronger than the normal Chariot, but remember, Quechua is 100% stronger than the normal Warrior :)

FW is slightly better imo (they are non resource and valuable longer time), but loving WC's for sure ;-).
Oh and Quecha is probably slightly better then WC too.

The FW is only good with normal / fast speed imo, but TMIT will for sure say I'm wrong with that.

Mm the FW is strong, but the WC and QQnoob are just a little better. WC, and QQnoob are tied for first for me. But there are lots of situations where a WC is going to be much better than a QQnoob, but the same goes for the QQnoob over the WC. Which of the three that is best really depends on the map.

I see the main advantage of the WC over the QQ there, that War Chariots last longer / can beat anything up until Longbows. Anyhow, with Checkers, one has 10 cities by the time one doesn't even have the 2nd one with War Chariots. War Chariots take more cities later, but at that time, the Mids and the GLH are already gone, those wonders are only able to be gotten with Incans without sacrificing something, and that's the next big advantage. I think the snowball of HC is just not beatable, though I came closer to it in this game, than most would imagine.

Well, I've come back and read through this a few times just to see the way you play things. I'm so far really impressed and the game is really intense because of all the AI. I personally have been slightly busy lately though :p (too busy for Civ :o ) with starting a business and the end of school etc...

But what I'm really looking for is how you continue this game so it can also help me learn as well :) Like I played this game on Emperor and play fairly well in the beginning but then my game drops afterwards. Like in this specific game, I could only get as far as Metal Casting with the Oracle whilst expanding my cities at the same time. Had marble, stone so I went for the mids and oracle. How on earth did you get to Feudalism? Is it because of marathon which makes it slightly easier?

It's not Marathon that makes it more easy here, it actually makes it more difficult, because Oracle goes earlier on Marathon / Techs go later. The main difference are the 3 Golds, the dual Wet Corn, staying at 2 cities, and Deity (being able to trade for Writing and everything before Oracle) , and luck. Oracle in T162 was extremely late, the latest Oracle I've seen from AI on Huge Marathon Deity was 1800 BC, so it really was a lot of luck combined with skill and unbelievably good starting position.
 
It's not Marathon that makes it more easy here, it actually makes it more difficult, because Oracle goes earlier on Marathon / Techs go later. The main difference are the 3 Golds, the dual Wet Corn, staying at 2 cities, and Deity (being able to trade for Writing and everything before Oracle) , and luck. Oracle in T162 was extremely late, the latest Oracle I've seen from AI on Huge Marathon Deity was 1800 BC, so it really was a lot of luck combined with skill and unbelievably good starting position.

Well, I'd love to shadow a game you play but at the moment, I'm not good enough ;) Maybe in the next 10 years :p
But that makes much more sense haha. I'd love to see someone shadow a game that I play but I don't think this forum has many monarch players that still play :p Still REALLY impressive :eek: And by the way, I just tried out a WC rush on a deity game :lol: I actually pulled it off almost :p Got the WC quest whilst I was building them like mad. You did 12 of them, so to be extra safe, I built 15 haha whipping and chopping and one city was a high production, horse, cows and two hills being worked. I ended up taking 4 (!!!! THAT MANY) of his cities and then he got spears :p and and even though he had 3 cities left chariots got nothing against spears haha. Couldn't even pillage because I didn't have IW and he had iron somewhere I think (or was getting copper from trade). This was against Justin btw. So how you did it just completely is crazy :p Nice one. Learning a lot from you :D
 
Well, I'd love to shadow a game you play but at the moment, I'm not good enough ;) Maybe in the next 10 years :p
But that makes much more sense haha. I'd love to see someone shadow a game that I play but I don't think this forum has many monarch players that still play :p Still REALLY impressive :eek: And by the way, I just tried out a WC rush on a deity game :lol: I actually pulled it off almost :p Got the WC quest whilst I was building them like mad. You did 12 of them, so to be extra safe, I built 15 haha whipping and chopping and one city was a high production, horse, cows and two hills being worked. I ended up taking 4 (!!!! THAT MANY) of his cities and then he got spears :p and and even though he had 3 cities left chariots got nothing against spears haha. Couldn't even pillage because I didn't have IW and he had iron somewhere I think (or was getting copper from trade). This was against Justin btw. So how you did it just completely is crazy :p Nice one. Learning a lot from you :D

2 things for you:

You can see where his iron is and pillage the road to it, unless he founded a city on it. Click "display yields" and there will be a field giving an unusual amount of yields, i. e. a plains-hill giving 6 :hammers: . Then you know where the iron is. If he get's it through trade, you can see that in the diplomacy tab, try to negotiate an embargo. If the game is already advanced, you can also pillage the ressource he gets with spies, or you can pillage what he trades for it, both cancels the deal :)

And concerning your rush with War Chariots on Deity: Taking 4 cities with 15 War Chariots isn't too bad, you say you even had some left and lost them to spears later, so I assume you had about 3 losses at each city, that's ok. The important lesson for you to learn is, to conquer someone still having Forrests, so you can chop / whip reinforcements from the newly conquered cities. I don't know if that became clear in my Writeup, but from the 12 War Chariots I had against Ghandi in the beginning (or 20 against Tokugawa) there also weren't any left after conquering 4-5 cities, it's really important to keep building troops, losses are inevitable in a war.

Sera
 
Ok, here is the next part of the Writeup. I have read again what I wrote in the last part, so I can give you a short summary of what has happened:

  • The last date was 1040 BC, where I made peace with Tokugawa after a very fast war (only 15 turns) with 20+ War Chariots conquering 5 cities cities, of which most were really good. I've lost almost my complete Stack (again)y because I didn't wait for Catapults, probably the biggest error I made in this round. Anyhow, it's almost impossible to to judge how severe this error was, because it got me the cities earlier, I would have had losses anyway and with slow moving Catapults, Toku would have whipped a lot more, so the cities would not have been so large after getting them.
  • I've won the Musicrace and got the Great Artist from it, I got Philosphy through trade, only thing that's missing before starting a Golden Age is the National Epic. The Great Person Farm Pataliputra got a Library first, because I could not get Code of Laws and simply run Caste, it is constructing a Forge, which had the second highest priority (first being the Libarary) , because I need as many Great Engineers as possible (at least 1 to found Mining Inc, but instant constructing the Kremlin / Wall Street / Statue of Liberty would also be very nice) . The NE will follow directly after the Forge.
  • I began the GP production at about 1200 BC, with the priority being a great Scientist to found an Academy, because that would really rock, especially with upcoming Civil Service / Burocracy.
  • Another huge focus of mine was the Research, which I doubled in only 20 turns, more in the upcoming clearview.
  • I had a lot of bad luck with Slave Revolts in Thebes, they costed me unbelievable three population points, the city could now already be size 11 instead of size 8. Growing the cities was another priority I had, because I was far behind in population after the inital Rush of Gandhi.
  • The only wonder I really need besides the Oracle for my games, is the Mausoleum of Maussollos, an incredibly powerful Wonder. I pushed as hard to it as I could, but Frederick got a GE from the Mids. Luckily, I could prevent him from constructing the MoM by gifting him Music, which made him construct the sixtine which is a Wonder with very high priority / value to the AI.
  • I've skipped / missed all other Wonders. If you ask yourself what wonders will become important in the future: I want to have the Taj Mahal, I need the Kremlin, and I will do everything to get the SoL. I underestimated the power of the Eiffel Tower, that one's also on my list for the next game.
  • I did a lot of tech-trading. Of course, I already have "WFYABTA" from most AIs, but my good diplomatic relations (I got 5 or 6 AIs on friendly already) help me to continue and trade my way to Sushi. Current Target of Research: Paper -> Education -> Liberalism.
  • The world is in war, basically, Civs have gangbanged up on the meatshields Brennus and Peter. I hope they will kill lots of the attackers of the 5 Civs that are in war with each of them -> will weaken them -> give me a better position because they burn themselves out in their wars.


Now you're again informed what happened in the last post, I promised you another clearview of the egyptian empire at 1000 BC, because I conquered a lot cities that would play an important role in the round, and the last clearview is already some time ago. Result of the last clearview was: I'm not yet in a good position, my Research is too low, my cities are too small, my production also has to be improved, I need to grow the cities, I need to focus on Research and developement, I need to conquer more land and get a vassal asap.


First, let's have a look at the cities, because those are the backbone of the empire:


The Capital: Thebes



This city has grown to size 9, and is currently working its best tiles (the 2 Corns, the 3 Golds, and the riverside grassland Cottages) . If all the Slave Revolts wouldn't have happened, this city could also work the two non riverside grassland Cottages and make them grow already, which would make a good number of Beakers once it has an Academy / get's the bonuses from Burocracy / has Oxford. It's well developed having a Library and a Forge and is not only the main source of Research atm, but also the biggest producer of troops.
The last thing is about to change, Universities will become available soon, then comes Oxford, later Observatories... I tell this, because the city is at the breakpoint from being everything but the GP Farm to the empire, to being a highly specialized Research city.


The GP Farm, Pataliputra:



A lot has happened in this city since the last clearview. The city is still quite small for a GP Farm, having only a size of 6, but it has all buildings that it needs atm. and is already constructing a Courthouse because it will become large and therefor cause a high amount of maintenance in near future. All buildings? Yes, not having to produce the Great Library and having a decent amount of Forrests, this city already has got the National Epic! It was actually constructed just in the time between the summary and 1000 BC, the time which I chose for the clearview.

So let's start a GA you say, don't you? No I say.

Things speaking for a GA:
  • I've lost a lot of my Forces, the higher production would come in real handy right now.
  • I need a great Scientist, it would get fastened up by a good amount of time.

Things speaking against a GA:
  • The city is still too small. If I'd start a GA now, I could only work 4 Specialists in it. If I let it grow to size 9, I could work nearly twice as many.
  • The time of War Chariots is as good as over, Toku as good as finished, I don't need the higher production atm. , I might find it really nice though once Universities and Cuirrassiers have become available. By then, then general population count / the worked tiles would also be a lot higher so the benefits from the GA would be greater.
  • I might get Nationalism late, because I don't plan on researching it myself, and want the production boost for the construction of the Taj Mahal.
  • This round is going to take a long time still, and the way to Sushi is very very long, I'm going to need as many GSs on it as I can get, therefor, a larger city would be of greater use and especially if the other cities would also be larger, I could run multiple GP Farms!
One thing that really annoys me on that picture though, is that I'm neither running Pacifism, nor Theocracy. Pacifism would have made a great deal for the GS, which is already late, and Theocracy could have gotten me the "crazy Philosopher Event" (= free Academy in the Capital in exchange for 2 Unhappiness) . This is, because I still wanted to spread Religion and hadn't built a Monestary in the Capital to take over Missionary production, and it is because I still wasn't used to the Spiritual trait. Another flaw in my round, but don't worry, it's not gonna be long until I notice and finally get it / switch to Pacifism.


Gandhi's former Capital, Bombay:



This city is very simlar to the Capital. It's working it's best tiles (the Floodplain-Cottages, the special Ressources, the Food) and has grown to a decent size since the last update, it's size 7 atm, and it's well developed. It doesn't have the 3 Golds that the capital has, that is, why this city only has less than half the output of Research than Thebes has, but, it has about the same production (don't get confused by the 22 Hammers, those are actually only 11 that get doubled because of the Industrial Forge) and has donated greatly to the production of troops until now. Notice the minor difference, that this city has a whip-timer, while the Capital didn't have one, this is because the Capital really had the largest focus on Growth for the upcoming Academy and Burocracy, while this city had its focus on production and developement.
A nice thing that you can see in all 3 Screens that I've posted until now is, that all cities have more developed tiles than they actually work, which is proof of the good Worker Management I had during the whole round (I really payed a lot attention to that, as it's probably the 2nd most important thing, after Macro, and before Micro) .
Again, this city is at a breakpoint from being everything to a specialized Research-city.

Ahmedabad, the future main Military-city:



Yes, you see that right, this city has the Heroic Epic! It's still very small with a size of 4, but will grow large in near future. Things that costed pop were the 2pop-barracks- and 2pop-forge-whip of which I let the Overflow go into the HE, that is, why it has been constructed so fast and that is why this city has got Forrests left, which are already being pre-chopped for the time Cuirrassiers become available (it would be a waste using them now, because WCs are so cheap, that 1 chop would generate more Hammers than could be saved -> generate gold which I don't need) .
Atm. , the city is producing the last Warriors for Military Police, after those, it shall get a Courthouse because it lies at the eastern edge of the empire -> causes high maintenance and then, it'll be all set up and rdy to pump troops without further interruptions.


A newly conquered city, the future home of the Globe Theater, the city of Osaka:



You may have noticed already, that the cities aren't listed in the order in which I got them, but in the order of current / future importance / research - hammer output / size. This city isn't that important atm, but it'll have very high importance in the future. It has 2 good sources of Food and some grasslands which can also be farmed, it has 3 plains-Elephants, so 5 good tiles and.. No, I won't tell that, you'll see :> Just a hint: It has 50 turns of whipping anger, make a guess, how high will that number grow?
As all cities, this city has a Granary and will get a Forge (IND-Forges are a musthave building imo) . After that, it'll get a theater to unlock the GT, a Lighthouse which can be discussed if it's needed, and then? Yes, nothing. This city will stay small until the very end of the round, it's close to the palace, therefor it doesn't even need a Courthouse in near future.


Another newly conquered city of great value, the former Capital of Tokugawa, Kyoto:



This city still is in revolution, but as another Capital site, it's going to become one of the best cities and one having a very important role as it's coastal: It'll become the shipyard! It has borders with Hatty whom I cannot conquer before Cuirrassiers, it's large and will become even larger, therefor a theater is planned. As all cities, it has a Granary and will get a Forge, later, it'll be the only city getting a Drydock, but that's already in far future. The production of a naval fleet is very important on Big & Small mapscript and it's of major importance when playing a Sushi game, this city had high production and a settled GG, it'd be perfect for this role.


Missed the horses city already? Here is Alexandria:



I nearly feel guilty that this city is listed at a 6th place, as it was one of the most important cities in the past, but this post is about the now and the future. One thing you can see very good in this city, is, that it's again only working it's best tiles, and that it has a high whip-timer. This is following the rule to "only work your best tiles" and "produce troops whenever possible" . The city is currently under border-pressure, therefor it's also building a Theater, one of the buildings I learned to find most useful, just because the GT is so ueber-powerful, and because an early Theater secures the Borders for the whole game, while if not building one, the city would get crushed.
The library in this city would be of use, as it's working 2 Luxury Ressources, but it got delayed over and over because troops had higher importance than Libraries.
Again, this is changing right in this moment, as the HE-City is set up, so I have a superior source of troop-production, and need more cities being able to construct a Theater / University to unlock the National Wonders.


Those were 6 cities, here is Number 7, the future home of Ironworks, the city of Bangalore:



Like Alexandria, a city under the rule of "work your best tiles only" . High whip timer to get the necessary Infrastructure, under Border-pressure -> Theater. In hindsight I now notice, that the Obelisk in it was a waste of hammers, and the hired Engineer would also never play a role. Anyhow, it did play a role at that time, because I wanted to have a city that would produce a GE with 100% of safety, and once the city would have gotten IW, it would also be able to hire more mid-game Engineers so this had some kind of synergy for me. The city is getting a Courthouse atm because it's not that near to the palace, and as a city that would grow large, cause high maintenance in the future. Plans for it are to use it for anything that's needed, it'd get a University just because it was one of the few cities being able to build one, it would serve as a Settler-pump, it did build some Warriors for MP and will produce units later again, and it should grow to get powerful by the time of Steampower / Steel, but that's in the far future again.


City Number 9, another old city, Calcutta:



If you see that city, and remember the last ones, you should have gotten a feel for what "work your best tiles only" means. This city is size 4, works 2 lighthouse lakes, the Spices, the Cows, and everytime it wanted to grow to size 5, I whipped something in it (mostly Missionaries) . Nothing more to say about it, but, that it would be one of the cities constructing a University which I found astonishing, because this city looks weak to me having no real source of Food, it didn't even have a Library at that point of the game so it really wasn't planned for a task of that size (the construction of a University) .


The home of the Mausoleum of Maussollos, "Hieraconpolis" :



Yes, you got that right, I managed to get the Mausoleum of Maussollos :> . This city is pretty crappy with all it's plains, but not so crappy as it sounds at first, because it has more production then one would think, having been founded on a plains-Stone-hill and working plains-Cows. Work your best tiles in this case means, that the city has reached it's optimal size, the size of 2. This city is great for producing Workers and Missionaries, working the plains really isn't worth it, nor is a grassland farm a good tile imo, so this city would stay small until Sushi feeded it. Can you believe it that this city would be able to construct a University? I could not, but really underestimated the power of the Stone-hill and the plains-Cow.


Three to go, here comes Kagoshima:



A decent city having Copper and Clams, but too many coastal tiles for my taste. Anyhow, that won't matter until a size of 7, therefor, good city, especially because I have to few coastal cities yet.


Hang on, we're almost through, here is the city of Lisht:



This city is in a superb place. It was founded only a few years ago, that's why it still lacks underdeveloped, but it'll soon catch up and will become a high production coastal city, that would first construct the Kremlin, and after that become the home of the Spies. This is in far future again though.
One thing: I'll leave the city ruins untouched for as long as possible, because those always get you some free Beakers via the random-event. I think this round it were 1500 Beakers towards Printing Press.


And the last city, a ctiy without Food yet, Tokyo:



This is actually the only "bad" city that I have. It's bad, because it doesn't have any Food (yet) . Luckily enough though, it still has a Forrest left, a Forrest that I'm going to invest in a Theater. I'll also make sure that it'll get the Religion asap, and it'll then produce 4 Culture, which will be enough to steal the Pigs from Hatty. Yes, I could not believe that myself, but this city later stole the Pigs from a CRE-Leader and a city that was at least 1000y older than it, I just say that, to show the power of theaters and Religion-spread.


Puh, that really was some work, here is a short summary for the tl;dr people:


  • 13 cities.
  • Heroic and National Epic set up.
  • All cities working their best tiles only but further growth is planned.
  • Land is well improved, as most cities are. The newly conquered ones of course need some developement.
  • I got the Mausoleum of Maussollos (not how I write Mausoleum of Maussollos and not MoM? Although, if it'd be Stifflers MoM... XD)
  • Most cities are really good, except that I don't have a real GP Farm with 3-5 sources of Food, all I got is a GP Farm that's medicore at best, but it'll do...
  • Cities are on the way to getting specialized cities, like Research-cities, Military cities, Coastal-production-cities, etc.


Now that you know the cities in detail, I'll zoom out and give you a picture of where they're lying again:



That's a nicely, medium sized empire with empire. I'll zoom out further, because the research of Paper has been completed and I can show you the first Screens of the complete Worldmap!



Some things you can see:
  • Peter (as hoped) has a city at a choke-point, that is the entrance to his Empire. With a city like this, he can hold back any attackers for a long time.
  • He, Willem and Pericles got blocked very early, they will never be of any threat at all.
  • The largest empire is still the one of Victoria, but, I'm on 2nd place already!
  • Wang Kon has no access to the coast, therefor will never be able to expand to dozens of islands on this map.
  • Hammurabi's empire is also huge, he's only 4th because he lacks a lot of techs, but he's strong and close to Brennus, whom he is in war with, it's likely that he'll vassal him soon.
  • Lincoln has lost a lot of positions, why, I don't know. Maybe because he's simply on of the weakest AIs.
  • Lizzy has canceled her Vassal-agreement with Hatty.
  • Toku has some cities on islands, I have to build Galleys before I can conquer him completely.
  • There is a huge black (undiscovered) area on the map, islands that will become reachable with Astronomy. I was very happy about this, because on some maps, many islands are reachable earlier already -> get settled by AI. On this map, I can conquer Toku, then Hatty, and after that expand peacefully onto the islands.


Now that you got a clearview of the empires, let's have a quick look at the demographics at the end of this post and see how I compare to the others 500y after the last clearview, where I was last in almost all disciplines:


The Demographics:



That's even better than I expected it to be. I still have to do a lot about the GNP, but those will go up tremendously once I have the Academy / run Burocracy. Production and Food looks very good, and I'm number 1 in owned land area! It's not good that I've lost so many soldiers, and I have to let my cities grow further, but it's enough to call this round "won" already imo.


A direct comparison between Hatty, Darius, Mansa, Hammurabi and me:



Again, these graphs look a lot better than the demographics, where I'm compared to insane Viccy. In direct comparison to these 4, I can compete in any way, maybe my troops are a little low after having been decimated by Toku's PRO-Archers / AGG-Spears, but with a production that high, I can build them up again in no time. The developement since the last clearview can be seen exellently, graphs go straight upwards, this is, because cities have grown and the land has been improved. Only graph that doesn't go straight upwards is the power-graph, where one can easily see the 2 wars.


With this screen, I'll finish this post and leave you alone and this game up for discussion again. Next episode is called: "The education of the Egyptians!" Till then, cya.

Seraiel
 
I'm displeased with my last post, because nothing really has happened, and therefor will directly write the next episode:

The Education of the Egyptians!


Here are the plans for the future:

  • Create a great Scientist to build an Academy in Thebes.
  • Create a great Engineer for Mining Inc.
  • Grow all cities, especially the GP Farm for the upcoming golden Age.
  • Get the Taj Mahal.
  • Completely annihilate Tokugawa so that his cities aren't unhappy because they yearn to join their motherland.
  • Get up 8 Theaters, 8 Universities, construct the Globe Theater and Oxford University.
  • Construct Courthouses in all cities that cause high maintenance.
  • Start a GA and create as many GSs as possible, to bulb my way to Sushi.
  • Win Liberalism and take something useful with it, most likely Military Tradition.
  • Build up a large Stack of Cuirrassiers.
  • Conquer Hattys Shrine and vassalize her.


Let's see how those plans work out:


1000 BC: I've joined the war on Brennus. Of course, I'm not really going to send units to him, this is only because Hammu was asking and 1/3 of the Civs are in war with him, nice to get some Diplo-points with them.

980 BC: I constantly switch to Serfdom for as long as possible, as it fits perfectly with my plans to grow the cities and improve the land. Still no Pacifism though, because I still need some Missionaries in the newly conquered cities I got from Toku.

970 BC, Hammurabi is the first to take a city of Brennus. This means, that Brennus Forces have been defeated by the bunch of attackers that has gangbanged up on him. Hammurabi, having the highest War success, a huge military and a large empire is going to vassalize him soon. It's ok for me, because Hammurabi will draw hate to himself by having Brennus as a Vassal, and once Brennus is the Vassal, I can trade techs to him and repair some of the dmg I've done to the diplomacy by i. e. gifting him Monotheism which will give me the favourite Civic bonus.

930 BC: Viccy builds the Chicken Pizza. Same turn, I revolute to Slavery again to whip a Theater in Alexandria (the city wanted to grow on an unimproved or bad tile) , and a Missionary in Calcutta (same reason) . I use that chance to also whip a Forge in Kyoto (again, IND-Forges are musthave-buildings) and to complete a Theater in Tokyo. I use the whip-Overflow in Kyoto to construct a Galley, which I need to conquer Tokus island cities. I also whip a Trireme to protect the Galley, at least it's transporting Lord of Ultima, and another Galley to fasten up the Conquest. 1 turn later, I declare war on Toku again, having made sure that he has wrecked his Stack on Hattys Longbows!

910 BC: I trade Feudalism + Music vs Machinery with Darius. Not that important. More important is, that Civil Service has become available, Lizzy has got it, but only tech I could trade to her would be Paper, and I don#t want to give that away for 2 reasons: 1. It's still a monopoly tech 2. I want to complete Education first, so that AI has a lower priority on it as it's already known to someone, because I'm not 100% sure if I don't want to use Liberalism for something bigger than MT. Anyhow, here is the trade:



And also important: The capture of Satsuna!



The city falls without losses, and it's again really nice, Toku really had strong land! Sheep and Weed, aehm, I mean Wheat XD . 2 rare Health ressources, one even giving 2 Health easily, and the city is even size 5... 2 Chariots instantly pull back to Kyoto again to get on board of the next Galley.

900 BC: Lincoln constructs the Church of Nativity (christian Shrine) . Christianity is the 2nd largest Religion on this map after Buddhism, man, how I'd like to have one of those Shrines...

I also trade Machinery against Compass with Hatty. I made her make peace with Toku in the same trade, because I didn't want her to build too many troops, which AI does when it's in war, even if it cannot reach its target / is incapable of performing overseas invasions.



It becomes more and more evident btw. that the christians are the stronger faction on this map, almost all of them already have Civil Service and Engineering, which is a pity, as I really like to have Notre Dame in Sushi games. When cities reach sizes of over 30, every possible point of Happiness is important, Notre Dame gives 2. Well, what can I do...

890 BC, I conduct a very important trade that costs me a tech and 2000 gold O_O :



I offered Lizzy a Banana, but she threatened me by saying that she'd tell the Civ-God, so the gold is actually hush-money *lol* (running gag from Replay #3 that's not 100% easy to fully get) .

Regarding the trade, 2k of Gold are a huge sum, and more than missing it myself, I don't like AI to have it, because that fastens up their research like crazy. Anyhow, giving away Paper was no choice, getting CS of highest priority, so I don't think about it.

880 BC: 5 turns have passed again, so I switch to Burocracy and finally to Caste + Pacifism! Amazing fact: Research went from 220 Beakers per turn to 260 BPT which I find quite amazing for that time, as it's without an Academy yet!

You may ask yourself why Caste + Pacifism now, because it's also the turn, where the great Scientist was born. Wait, great Scientist? NOEZ, I GOT A GREAT ARTIST! Chances were like 5%, you know that the National Epic creates stupid GA points, now that I got CS, I really need that GS yesterday, thank God Ramesses is SPI and that I can revolute so much, if he wasn't, I would have had to use the GA now to start a GA, but like this, I can save him and still wait for the time of Universities / Cuirrassiers / the TM.

Btw, you may ask yourself, at what price those 260 BPT come: Here is a screen of the financial advisor which should have been in the last post already:



With having 15 cities, maintenance is growing large.
I still have some money left from tech-trades and especially map-trades, so I can still run 100% Research (something I do for a Millenium now already! ) but I have to get a Shrine and some Courthouses, otherwise, this will soon be over, and reducing the tech rate would suck extremely hard.

Some things are interessting: Traderoutes are taking over as the main source of Commerce, the trade of Ressources sums up to 54 Gold per turn which I find amazing, but wait, 15 cities? 13+1 makes 14, what has happened?

I founded the city of Edfu!



It's a city that I call "Quetschstadt" in german ("squeeze-city" or "squeezed city" in english) . It's not really necessary and in a normal round, nobody would found this city, but in a Sushi-game, one has to found as many cities as possible on as little space as possible, otherwise the highscore won't be good enough. This city is even one of the better "squeeze cities" because at least, it has a source of Food. I still remember though, that it took forever to be set up with even the most necessary buildings, maybe that's because it lacks any really good tiles or because it was founded so late, or time was just passing extremely slow at that moment.


Big jump to 830 BC: Brennus vassalizes to Hammurabi.

820 BC: Willem constructs the Apostolic Palace! That's nice, as he's a Buddhist, and I'm nominated and have awesome diplomatic relationships unlike him! I become the religious leader and queue the cheap SPI buddhist-Temples in all cities. In the following turns I'm even gonna whip lots of them though I had the plan to not whip and let my cities grow, but SPI-AP-Temples are just really awesome. Here is a Graph proving it:



And a screen proving my excellent diplomatic relations:



At least Peter voted for Willem, otherwise, he would have been the ridiculous guy that is the only one voting for himself XD .

Same turn I attack Toku's next city "Nara" :



City falls with the loss of 1 Catapult that I had to suicide, because it had a Spearman in it. I raze it, because it has no source of Food.

Wang Kon has also completed the research of Paper, my monopoly is gone, and I was neither able to accomplish Circumnavigation by now, nor have I completed Education. No question if I'm going to be the first to Liberalism, but what tech can I get with it? And will I be the first to get the Circumnavigation-bonus, while the christians (again) are the ones to have the necessary tech (Optics) first?

780 BC: Tokus next city falls and autorazes. He's down to 1 city now.

770 BC: Viccy also researched Paper, now not only my monopoly is gone, Paper is available on the open Market, and that only few turns after I payed 2k of Gold to Lizzy... Well, those things are really unpredictable, I cannot spy on everyone yet.

Same turn, Hammurabi constructs the Hagia Sophia and Hatty constructs the Angkor Wat. The last would prove out to be really nice, as AW-Priests would be a main source of Hammers for the 200 island-cities that I would found during this round.

750 BC, the bad news is, that Viccy constructs Notre Dame. I still held my hopes up to the last moment, but there was no chance to get Engineering from the christians as they all were trying to construct it.

Good news is though, that finally, a GS is born!

At last, I can build an Academy in Thebes, which gives back amazing 40 BPT, hightening my research from now 290 to 330!



And I'm able to trade Engineering from Mansa in exchange for Paper and CS:




In the meantime, Education is reaching completition. I've chosen 8 cities to get Libraries which were constructed with the use of Slavery + OR by the time Education actually finishes, which is in 680 BC, a time by that Tokugawa has been annihilated already:

The cities that I chose to get a University are Thebes, Bombay, Kyoto, Alexandria, Bangalore, Hieraconpolis, Calcutta and Kagoshima (look at the screens in the last post to get detailed info on those) . Important thing is, that not all of these cities are Commerce cities, but that these cities have been chosen simply by how fast they would be able to construct a University. Note that Universities are a huge Hammer-investement, and Oxford is a tremendous gain of Beakers, so if you ever plan on building it (often I don't, because one can win the game earlier without it) , build it fast, otherwise, it won't be of any use!

This is like what I experienced in Replay #3 with the Globe Theater, one doesn't have to take optimal cities for a specific task, like "only Commerce-cities for Libraries / Universities, only Border-cities for Theaters, the city having the 2nd highest Food for the Globe, etc. " . It's much more important to get things asap and by that benefit a longer time from them. Of course, if one can choose, but most times one can't. Take the cities having high pop, high production, still some Forrests, that don't construct something of greater importance, don't play beautiful, play effective! This also means, not getting more than the needed Universities, because Universities as a building in general, suck! And, if you build them, run OR, this can make the difference of a whole population point when whipping them.


Back to the round: Now that I have Education, I could start a GA, but I know, that AI pushes the TM quite harshly, so I again decide against it at this time. What's also of importance are 2 trades:



And:



Guilds is of importance, because it unlocks Banking which leads to Economics (a high priority tech because Free Market is an awesome Civic, the extra TR often is about 15% additional Commerce! ) and Divine Right is an awesome tech to trade, because it's absolutely useless XD . In the next following turns, I'm going to get a few thousands of gold + Banking for it:



And not enough of trades, DR also gets me the highly wanted Optics:



I instantly upgrade my Trireme to a Caravel, and send it on the way to circumnavigate the world!


---------------------

This is the end of post 1 of "The Education of the Egyptians" ! Hope you liked it. Read next about the GA, the TM and the military buildup to conquer Hatty, going online soon! Cya,

Seraiel
 
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Hi Seraiel!

Haven't read the two recent posts, but since you're sad that you're not getting enough replies I figured I'd reply.

I enjoy reading your writeups, even though the score-focused, insane-start-requiring playing is not my cup of tea. Nevertheless, you show some pretty neat strategies and impressive dedication. I'm probably responsible for 40 or so of the views myself, so keep it up. It's good reading, and even though my lowly "play the map" monarch/emperor skill cannot understand everything, I learn some things and I'm entertained and impressed by reading.

I'd like to address one comment you made though, with which I disagree:
HoF is also about the best way to win a map because the best way implies the best score normally! So I don't see that difference tbh.
I'm not sure that high score implies "the best way", to be honest. As you've shown very very clearly, the way to high score is large map, lots of turns, lots of sushi, lots of towns and dragging the game out as long as humanly possible. I think that's very different from the best way to win. It's *a* way to win, and it's *the* way to win for the highest score... But if you can win hundreds of years earlier, with hundreds less hours invested, I'd say that's perhaps a better way to win, for most people. You've found your niche, and you're providing good reads, but you're doing it in a way that very few people would be interested in doing themselves. So I'd be wary of calling your method "the best way to win".

Again, though - I've spent a lot of time reading your stuff and enjoyed it, so I'm glad that you're willing to sacrifice time and sanity providing nice content for the rest of us. Keep up the good work!
 
So the forum didn't eat my post after all. So I'll remove the frustrated summary.
 
Nice writing Seraiel.
I hope you beat the record.

I have some questions about worker micromanagement as I've never played this game with as much thought of each turn as you obviously have here.
I saw your latest screenshots of your cities.

When I play I have some guidelines for my workers (when the warfare starts, obviously you want to cottage the capital) :
1. Connect your cities with roads.
2. Improve resourcetiles.
3. Chop down all forrests.
4. Farm/mine everything.

Are you doing it in the same order?
You screenshots looked like mine use to do with alot of unimproved land at this stage.
But I say there was still cottages left at the indian cities, perhaps you didn't have enough troops to pillage them before you took the city ? Will they be farmed later ?
 
Hi Seraiel!

Haven't read the two recent posts, but since you're sad that you're not getting enough replies I figured I'd reply.

I enjoy reading your writeups, even though the score-focused, insane-start-requiring playing is not my cup of tea. Nevertheless, you show some pretty neat strategies and impressive dedication. I'm probably responsible for 40 or so of the views myself, so keep it up. It's good reading, and even though my lowly "play the map" monarch/emperor skill cannot understand everything, I learn some things and I'm entertained and impressed by reading.

Hope you will read the last two posts, and also give feedback on them :) I was very tired when writing them, so I don't know if they're readable at all. I think they are getting better in the end, when I don't stick to the timeline so tightly anymore but report more openly about what I was doing and planning.

And other than that, a big thank you for the big compliment :) . If you don't understand things, ask, I'm here to explain everything, sometimes I don't write everything, because I don't wanna write longish WoTs.

I'd like to address one comment you made though, with which I disagree:

I'm not sure that high score implies "the best way", to be honest. As you've shown very very clearly, the way to high score is large map, lots of turns, lots of sushi, lots of towns and dragging the game out as long as humanly possible. I think that's very different from the best way to win. It's *a* way to win, and it's *the* way to win for the highest score... But if you can win hundreds of years earlier, with hundreds less hours invested, I'd say that's perhaps a better way to win, for most people. You've found your niche, and you're providing good reads, but you're doing it in a way that very few people would be interested in doing themselves. So I'd be wary of calling your method "the best way to win".

Again, though - I've spent a lot of time reading your stuff and enjoyed it, so I'm glad that you're willing to sacrifice time and sanity providing nice content for the rest of us. Keep up the good work!

You're right about the "playing for highest score" argument, and I get your point. Anyhow, you misunderstood what I ment with "HoF is also about the best way to play" , which it is. To understand that, you have to know, that HoF is sorted by the fastest finish time, Score is only a minor discipline in which I compete, because I love epic games that go for the full length, well, that's my insanity atm, founding and microing 200+ cities while there is no need to do that. Anyhow, this is only me, and that's only the endgame of this round, before that, I follow the same rules as any other player, play effective, play to win. The first part is interessting and exciting, because one doesn't know if anything will work out, after that comes a lot hard work, and finally in the end, the great relief when having achieved something nobody ever has, I promise you, you'll love the screens and the insanity at the end :) .

Nice writing Seraiel.
I hope you beat the record.

I spoilered that already, maybe you overlooked it in the huge length each post has or didn't read the in between discussions, I managed to beat the highest non-Incan score, I also managed to beat my personal record (even though that one was set up with Incans, this is because I really worked on my game and improved it tremendously) , but beating WastinTime's record put up with Incans on a smaller map with a non-Incan-Civ on Huge, no way, that's impossible :D . I will make a try at it with Incans again, and, I won something else by surprise, but I'm not going to spoiler that already :) .

I have some questions about worker micromanagement as I've never played this game with as much thought of each turn as you obviously have here.
I saw your latest screenshots of your cities.

When I play I have some guidelines for my workers (when the warfare starts, obviously you want to cottage the capital) :
1. Connect your cities with roads.
2. Improve resourcetiles.
3. Chop down all forrests.
4. Farm/mine everything.

Are you doing it in the same order?
You screenshots looked like mine use to do with alot of unimproved land at this stage.
But I say there was still cottages left at the indian cities, perhaps you didn't have enough troops to pillage them before you took the city ? Will they be farmed later ?

I have a totally different worker-management than you. Here are the rules that I go by:

  • First, I try not to have static rules.
  • As a basic rule, I want to have 1 Worker per city (improving it's tiles so it can grow) and the 0.5 workers on plus of that (you know, you should have 1.5 Workers for every city) are somehow free and roam between the cities and help where most focus is needed, i. e. chop a Wonder, etc.
    This is a very loose rule though, but believe me, it helps having a fixed worker for each city. Anyhow, sometimes I let the worker improve the neighbouring city, so that one will have 2, if it has got more good tiles than the first one, then, new techs / ressources become available, and I'll move both workers back to the first city so that one has 2 and the other zero, point of this is: Reduce the turns lost to movement of your workers by having a good clearview at what is needed / will come up next. Make plans, adapt to most important techts like Calendar or MC, Machinery, Guilds, etc. .
  • I then improve the fields in the order of quality, improving the fields has the highest priority. Anyhow, the best fields can change and chopping can become a greater priority than improving the land. A rule is, to always improve the Food first, then improve the special ressources, and once the city has 2-4 good tiles, you can become more flexible, whip the city down to the best tiles again and let the Workers chop. Note, that there is no bigger bonus to construction than chopping, whipping a city multiple times at a breakpoint where it's working it's Food and the special Resources and after that when the workers are free again improve the land and let the city grow, provides a tremendous production in the beginning and afterwards a tremendous research, which is of high effectiveness if going to war early and wanting to develop a tech-lead later.
  • Roads have lowest priority with me, as long as a city is connected to the Trade-Network, which is most often done by the Tech of Sailing and the city being at a river / being coastal. I build roads very late in the game and only to connect the trade-network, in some games I even don't research The Wheel and simply found my cities coastal or at rivers and research Sailing, which can be traded with the AI / also gives foreign Traderoutes with open Borders. I don't mind about the movement bonus from roads until very late in the game, maybe between 1500 - 1000 BC.
  • Same is for Cottages. Cottages are not as important as Food or special ressources, so they get constructed between 2000 BC and 500 BC in my games. Cottages in the Capital are morely constructed at 2000 BC (after having jumped on the tech-trade-train after oracling) while cottages in other cities often are constructed later.

You're right, mines are very important, but Cottages and Farms are something totally different. A Farm gives production (via Slavery) and is more like a mined Hill, a Cottage though, gives Commerce which is Research / Gold / Culture / Espionage, however you set the slider.

Bombay i. e. was planned to be a Research-city getting a Library and a University, and later would become a mixed Research / Gold city having also a Bank, a Market and a Grocer. Those are the Commerce-multiplier buildings.

In contrast to that, Ahmedabad is a production city (Hammer city, Military city, call it what you like) . It get's farms, Mines, Workshops, and Hammer-multiplier-buildings (a Forge, a Factory, a Power-Plant, but as it has no Cottages, it doesn't have high Commerce, therefor, no Library, University... got it? )

The example is not 100% perfect for the case of Ramesses, because Ramesses is IND and get's cheap Forges by that, and it's not perfect, because a Sushi-round goes very long, the cities grow tremendously large -> one has to build more buildings than normally. In a normal game, I would follow the example above, and build Commerce-Multipliers in Commerce-cities, and Hammer-multipliers in Hammer-cities, and not both in both. As a rule of a thumb you can take, that a Forge pays for itself, if the city has to produce buildings / units that count up to more than 1000 :hammers: .

Now count, a Granary (180 Hammers) , does the city need a Library? Not really if you go for domination, than you'll actually only need a granary, not even a barracks is needed, therefor, no Forge in Commerce-cities because the game is over before it could pay for itself. Anyhow, if the game lasts longer, up until the time where you get Banks (600 Hammers) Markets and Grocers (450 Hammers each) , if you plan to go for Space Race and build Universities + Oxford, than you'll want even non-IND-Forges in those cities, but again not in all cities, because only 8 (6 for standart sized map) cities need a University, and after that, it's always better to go for Failgold (if one has the Ressources) , Missionaries (if one has a Shrine) or simple Wealth / Research (giving instant benefit) .

I hope that you now understand, that pillaging the Cottages in Bombay and farming them would have been a horrible idea :)

Thx for your answers, hth, Seraiel
 
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Quechua is better, but I agree that it's the 2nd best unit in the game. It's higher base-STR and FS-Immunity makes it almost 50% stronger than the normal Chariot, but remember, Quechua is 100% stronger than the normal Warrior :)

I see the main advantage of the WC over the QQ there, that War Chariots last longer / can beat anything up until Longbows. Anyhow, with Checkers, one has 10 cities by the time one doesn't even have the 2nd one with War Chariots. War Chariots take more cities later, but at that time, the Mids and the GLH are already gone, those wonders are only able to be gotten with Incans without sacrificing something, and that's the next big advantage. I think the snowball of HC is just not beatable, though I came closer to it in this game, than most would imagine.

I think WC get a whole lot strong on Standard/Normal because of their 2 move, while QQnoobs on Marathon allow you to start with 10 capitols. Also I think WC allow for a little bit of a different play style.
 
I've been reading this since yesterday, and WOW... you play a great game, but also have a wonderful way of writing it up that is both entertaining and educational. I'm learning a lot about diplomacy - I had no idea it was possible to get so many people up to Pleased/Friendly!
 
I think WC get a whole lot strong on Standard/Normal because of their 2 move, while QQnoobs on Marathon allow you to start with 10 capitols. Also I think WC allow for a little bit of a different play style.

You're right, I always forget about faster game-speeds because I'm still playing Marathon exclusively. I have a decent feeling what faster movement speed means on normal, after remembering this game, where my War Chariots nearly didn't have the time to heal between the wars. On normal, both wars would not even have been possible in the same time. Think I get it now.

I've been reading this since yesterday, and WOW... you play a great game, but also have a wonderful way of writing it up that is both entertaining and educational. I'm learning a lot about diplomacy - I had no idea it was possible to get so many people up to Pleased/Friendly!

Thx for the compliment :) Having a good diplomacy is something that I learned especially well when playing the Sushi-games, because one has to ensure, to get all the ressources in the end, therefor needs most AIs at least on cautious. Of course, having them on pleased / friendly is a lot better, as it prevents any wars against onesself and opens up a lot of otherwise impossible tech-trades. Keys are to share religion, have +4 bonus for fairtrade and sometimes, to share their favorite civic. Last thing will become more important in the future of this round and already had its importancy when choosing the opponents. Joining wars on the meatshields is almost an exploit imho, as it gives so many diplo-points in exchange for only a few lost to the hate-target itself.

Here is a picture of the Diplomacy at 500 BC btw, as a bridge to get back to the Writeup again, next part going online in the next hours. Till then, cya,



Seraiel
 
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I'm sorry, i know English is probably not your first language, but this is killing me.

Lose= not winning. "the horse archer is going to lose that fight".

Loose = the opposite of tight. "your mother is very loose".
 
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