RFC Classical World

[srpt]

not yet, hopefully tonight

 

[CrossRFC]

@srpt: suggestion: put a notice on the first post that people should post their earliest completion of the "by XXX" UHV's, to get an idea of difficulty.

 

[srpt]

well my first attempt to test Kalinka through the Satavahana spawn with the AIs new 20% production bonus has ended in defeat at the hands of the mighty Asoka. I'll be more cautious this time, no need to fight them at all really if I am just testing the popup. I would like part of the challenge of playing Kalinka to be needing to fight constantly to get the great generals and that being fighting civs more powerful than you at the start.

 

[CrossRFC]

Yes, fighting is good for them. A landslide victory does not provide enough GG's.

Edit: disregard previous edit, I made a silly mistake.

Edit2: Roman Rebellion lasting a really long time. Are they supposed to vanish after XX turns, or was that removed, or something else etc?

 

[Tigranes]

sprt, how it was decided that Tarsus will be Antigonid's capital? Antigon was initially satrap of Phrygia, which capital is Dascylium. He would rule Phrygia from Celaenae for one decade, helping to keep open Alexander’s supply lines back to Macedonia.He was building his new capital in Syria, named after himself, but his defeat stopped that. All the maps I have seen so far do not show Tarsus as anything resembling the capital. So I am really not sure if Tarsus is a good choice.

 

[srpt]

its actually supposed to end if Rome captures just 1 of the rebels cities or if they make peace. do you have python exceptions enabled?

out of the 3 choices available for Antigonid cities Tarsus seemed best. Ephesus would be fine too but they very often lose Tyre right away so it's not so good. if Ephesus is better thats fine with me. they start with a settler and usually found Antioch with it.

I played Kalinka up to the Satavahana spawn and I got the "do you want to switch civs" popup but then they just flipped my cites without a popup but no war.

 

[CrossRFC]

There were no python exceptions. They didn't capture any rebel cities though, because the rebels happened to be in hard to reach places, like Egypt, Anatolia and Greece (not Pella). Rome hasn't been fairing well since the 20% prod bonus, perhaps because its "cheating" has not been adjusted. Parthians doing okay, India doing well as far as I've seen, Han China still having trouble (and collapsing).

Ephesos is "probably" a better choice, because Asia is more core to the Antigonids than Cappadocia.

 

[Tigranes]

At least Ephesus can better represent Antigonus' core -- Phrygia. Unless you want to create a new city Gordium, or Celaenae, or Dascylium Gordium reminds us about Alexander, and can be nice in-land city. Until the founding of Ankira Asia looks quite empty.

 

[Cetrix]

And how the AI will settle Antioch if the Antigonid capital is far away from this spot ? :/

[edit] Oh, OK Crossphazer. Sounds better this way then.

 

[CrossRFC]

@cetrix The units can (and will, since we're all in agreement here) stay where they are. We're only talking about the placement of the palace building.

 

[Lansa]

Something else, what I observe in my Axum UHV victory(won in ~ 250ad).

Why give the Romans for a gold ressource only 1 monetary unit? They had +27income per round, but they do not want to spend it.
But the Chinese gave for 1 sheep incredible 6 monetary units plus rice, olives and pigs! And for 1 Incense they gave me also 7 monetary units.

 

[Tigranes]

Had a strange Byzantine start: not a single city flipped to me! Western Rome was holding their core, the rest was in rebel's hands. So when the flip time came only few units outside of Rebel's culture flipped to me. Hoping this is not intentional?

 

[srpt]

how does everyone feel about additional pre-placed or spawning cities in Anatolia/Middle East? I feel like Arbela should be in almost from the start. if we were going to add 1 more to Anatolia, what's the best city?

 

[CrossRFC]

The best city in Anatolia beside the pre-placed ones already present is Ankyra, on the hill inside of Cappadocia. The salt is inaccessible from there, but that's because we want to make room for Perge. Arbela shouldn't need a spawn since the Parthians found it when they spawn, unless you're planning to have it pre-placed, which is fine, but remember that it won't flip to Parthians on spawn and will make life harder for them, and things are already pretty hard for the Parthians...

Edit: Eastern Cappadocia/South-Western Armenia is pretty desolate. Maybe a pre-placed city there and a minor buff. I have no idea what that'd do to balance though.

 

[srpt]

@Tigranes: we're in the process of balancing the Byzantine start. my experience lately is that most of the time Roman stays intact and leaves you most of the eastern empire minus whatever the Sassanids have taken, which is usually 1 or 2 levant cities. sometimes the Romans are just unlucky and I'm happy if more than 3/4 of Byzantine starts are reasonable and some of the others are challenging but maybe doable.

to be clear about the flip: you flip all Roman cities and units in your core and border regions, but you don't flip anything non-Roman.

I suppose you could flip independent cities as well, but maybe not all of them.

but ideally I'd like Rome to be able to make it through the 110 years from the start of the scenario to the Byzantine spawn without collapsing, and I don't think that's impossible.

 

[Cetrix]

I would say a celtic galatian city around ~270BC in Capaddocia.

 

[CrossRFC]

I suppose you could flip independent cities as well, but maybe not all of them.

All independents in Greece, Thrace (if necessary) and Asia, as an emergency measure to make the game possible in case of Roman failure.

I would say a celtic galatian city around ~270BC in Capaddocia.

Yeah, pretty much that spot on the mountain in the corner of Cappadocia (Ankyra). It could be slightly more east but that spot minimizes overlap with the other cities.

 

[srpt]

about the Japanese goal: its Steel Working not the Stirrup. I know it said the Stirrup in the text but I don't know why.

 

[Tigranes]

All independents in Greece, Thrace (if necessary) and Asia, as an emergency measure to make the game possible in case of Roman failure.



Yeah, pretty much that spot on the mountain in the corner of Cappadocia (Ankyra). It could be slightly more east but that spot minimizes overlap with the other cities.

The city (Ancyra) grew significantly in size and importance under the Phrygians starting around 1000 BC, and experienced a large expansion following the mass migration from Gordion, (the capital of Phrygia), after an earthquake which severely damaged that city around that time. In Phrygian tradition, King Midas was venerated as the founder of Ancyra.

So yes, Ancyra can represent a lot of regional history. That Settler can still be staying near future Antioch.

And I second remark about the rebels (adding Syria and Egypt): I tried hard to play Byzantines without any flip, and it was simply impossible to defend from Huns AND recover Eastern Empire. I don't know why would you tie it so much to Western Rome... Rebels can represent Roman rebels (many cities had Legionnaires) -- then Constantine came, and united the entire East. If West is in disarray -- human player could try to expand West right away, like super early Justinian.

 

[Jusos2108]

that stupid bug about vacating the capital! hmmmm...

If you are preferring to the empty capital on turn one bug, my theory about that bug is that the just spawned AI moves its troops in the order that they are stacked. Thus founding the city with the last unit of the stack, when all the other units have no movement left to come back and defend the capital. Would it be possible to force the AI to move the settler first?