RFC Europe map development thread

[jessiecat]

Yeah, go for it. That's a good way of killing two birds with one stone.

OK, here it is. I'm glad you agree it will do double duty so I've just called it the Arab settler map. I've covered as far as Toulouse and Massilia in France, all the Med islands and up to Constantinople in the east. There are probably some inconsistences in Iberia with what's been done but the Spain settler map is no longer available in excel, only in array which I can't read. If somebody wants to check it over and fix anything, please feel free then repost your revised version here so we can save it in the wiki files.

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

Since they seem to have been lost in the depts of time, I thought I'd repost a few of those useful resources of yore.

First is the WorldBuilder map of all the major cities. This is a good starting point for whatever settler map you may be doing among other things.

Next is the WoldBuilder with all of the fill-in cities placed in Spain, Portugal, and the Islands they'd care about. Not as useful, but if you want to see it physically as opposed to an excel, voilà.

Finally is the excel settler map for Spain and Portugal. Hopefully that'll help jessiecat!

Good luck,
Джереми Завоеватель

Edit: Removed Spain (& Portugal) files. See ahead for latest version

 

[st.lucifer]

Since they seem to have been lost in the depts of time, I thought I'd repost a few of those useful resources of yore.

First is the WorldBuilder map of all the major cities. This is a good starting point for whatever settler map you may be doing among other things.

Next is the WoldBuilder with all of the fill-in cities placed in Spain, Portugal, and the Islands they'd care about. Not as useful, but if you want to see it physically as opposed to an excel, voilà.

Finally is the excel settler map for Spain and Portugal. Hopefully that'll help jessiecat!

Good luck,
Джереми Завоеватель

Thanks, Jeremy! Do you want to weigh in on the tech tree issue, or focus on maps?

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

Thanks, Jeremy! Do you want to weigh in on the tech tree issue, or focus on maps?

To tell you the truth, I don't really know much about the technological aspect of history. And I definitely don't have an Ahnung about the relevant game mechanics. Maps, though, I've got down.

Do we still need France/Burgundy and England? I've got some time on my hands

 

[jessiecat]

To tell you the truth, I don't really know much about the technological aspect of history. And I definitely don't have an Ahnung about the relevant game mechanics. Maps, though, I've got down.

Do we still need France/Burgundy and England? I've got some time on my hands

Thanks for the maps Jeremy. I'll try to coordinate yours with mine where possible. If I spot any ahistorical ones can I suggest possible changes to yours or mine whigh will make them compatible? Not that it matters too much in gameplay but it's nice to be consistent. And I'll post your excel map to the files on the wiki as well.
If you could carry on with France, Burgundy and England I'd appreciate it.
I might start looking at units and weaponry next as I've still got a lot of research material from my days as a tabletop wargamer and modeller.

@ st. lucifer. If I start researching units should I just start with the basic RFC unit list, make it civ. specific as possible and add unique units where possible? And how many new units do we have room for?

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

Here we go! France and Burgundy settler maps are done!
The worldbuilder file is the map with all of the cities placed (don't worry about errors, they are corrected in the actual)
The actual settler map is the .txt file.

Maybe England & Italy tomorrow?

-Джереми Завоеватель

 

[jessiecat]

Here we go! France and Burgundy settler maps are done!
The worldbuilder file is the map with all of the cities placed (don't worry about errors, they are corrected in the actual)
The actual settler map is the .txt file.

Maybe England & Italy tomorrow?

-Джереми Завоеватель

Have made a couple of minor changes to the Spain and Portugal map, partic. to coincide with st. lucifer's city placements. Also added Oviedo to the north of Leon. Little else as our maps largely overlap. So I've posted yours to the wiki files. If you're looking at my Arab map could you fix the 2 tiles in the middle of Spain that I somehow deleted? My knowledge of excel is nil.

On your other city map on WB, where did you get those civs? Do I need to download a mod or something, or is it playable like it is?
BTW Could you put your France/Burgundy map on excel and load it on the wiki files as well?
Thanks for all your hard work.

@ 3miro. Could you load your revised Balkan excel maps on the wiki files, please? We're starting to get a collection there for Umarth et all to rework into code. Thanks.

@ ijnavy. How's you Russian and Kievan maps coming? Could you put them on an excel map (one
should be OK for both I think) and log it on the wiki file as well. Thanks.

 

[3Miro]

Very sorry for the delay, I only have the WB map for right now. I am very busy this and next week and I had to try and find Bulgarian cities north of Danube. All I need to do is add the cities to the Excel for Byzantium, Bulgaria and some for Turkey.

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

Have made a couple of minor changes to the Spain and Portugal map, partic. to coincide with st. lucifer's city placements. Also added Oviedo to the north of Leon.

I hate to be trivial, but most of the cities you've added are on mountain tiles. In fact, except for the ones in North Africa, I think they all are. Of course, that does absolutely no harm since nobody's ever going to found a city there, but neither does it do much good for the same reason. I'm thinking we should add peaks to the excel map?

Also, where are St. Lucifer's city placements? I had thought the "Major Cities" file was the latest. Has someone posted a new one since the last time I was here?

If you're looking at my Arab map could you fix the 2 tiles in the middle of Spain that I somehow deleted? My knowledge of excel is nil.

Mine is equally lacking, however, all you need to do is copy & paste a tile that does work!

On your other city map on WB, where did you get those civs? Do I need to download a mod or something, or is it playable like it is?

I simply kept the version we were working on in January. I don't know if it is still downloadable, that's why I uploaded it again: "Major Cities." I think I have one without cities, too, if you're interested

BTW Could you put your France/Burgundy map on excel and load it on the wiki files as well?

It would be no trouble at all, however, I can't help asking why we want these excel maps. The settler maps for Spain, Portugal, France, and Burgundy have already been converted to the actual code using Úmarth's generator. Of course, they can still be changed and updated using the same generator. Is there some other game mechanic that we're making the excels for?

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

Very sorry for the delay, I only have the WB map for right now. I am very busy this and next week and I had to try and find Bulgarian cities north of Danube. All I need to do is add the cities to the Excel for Byzantium, Bulgaria and some for Turkey.

If you upload the worldbuilder it would be rather simple to convert it to code. I or someone else could surely do it for you.

 

[Disenfrancised]

I hate to be trivial, but most of the cities you've added are on mountain tiles. In fact, except for the ones in North Africa, I think they all are. Of course, that does absolutely no harm since nobody's ever going to found a city there, but neither does it do much good for the same reason. I'm thinking we should add peaks to the excel map?

Whilst the land tiles are pretty much set, the peaks and other terrain is still in flux so might as well give a whole naming map.

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

Whilst the land tiles are pretty much set, the peaks and other terrain is still in flux so might as well give a whole naming map.

Ah. Naturally.

Here is the England stuff.

Edit: Removed Map & Excel files. See ahead for latest versions

 

[jessiecat]

Ah. Naturally.

Here is the England stuff.

My understanding was that Umarth wanted all the settler maps put into excel and posted here for people to view, then post them to the wiki. If it's easier to convert WB to code then I'm sorry. I didn't know that.

As far as filling in all the tiles on the map, I thought that was required as the terrain features have not all been decided, as Disenfranchised has said. Like on your England map, which is fine, but there are quite a few blank tiles even on productive squares. The snow tiles are, of course placeholders till more appropriate art can be found for moorland, as st. lucifer has explained.

My question about your map is that there are lots of cities already built and civs in place, some like the Almorhavids, Abbasids etc. which are not even in our mod. I wondered where you got them from. I just thought you transferred it from another mod or something and wondered whether it was playable.

Sorry I couldn't fix those two squares on the Arab map. Believe it not, I've never even seen excel before, let alone use it. So if somebody could alter them for me I'd be really grateful.

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

double post

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

My understanding was that Umarth wanted all the settler maps put into excel and posted here for people to view, then post them to the wiki. If it's easier to convert WB to code then I'm sorry. I didn't know that.

Well if that's what Úmarth wants these days, that's very well easily done! I didn't mean to sound rude or anything like that, I simply didn't understand why we were making excel sheets. Of course, it is very much more time consuming to make the actual code things, but I had believed they were what was desired. That is, of course, why I asked!

As far as filling in all the tiles on the map, I thought that was required as the terrain features have not all been decided, as Disenfranchised has said. Like on your England map, which is fine, but there are quite a few blank tiles even on productive squares. The snow tiles are, of course placeholders till more appropriate art can be found for moorland, as st. lucifer has explained.

It is again true, that I have not kept up with the times. I do remember us being told back when not to place cities on certain resources or peaks and the like. Of course, if the finality of the map is no longer set, it makes a good deal of sense to place them on every available land square.

My question about your map is that there are lots of cities already built and civs in place, some like the Almorhavids, Abbasids etc. which are not even in our mod. I wondered where you got them from. I just thought you transferred it from another mod or something and wondered whether it was playable.

Ah, that is a reasonable question. The civs in the map were those that were in the mod back in January when I was last working on it. The cities are the ones we had agreed were in the right places (after all sorts of arguments especially in Germany) upon which to base the specific settler maps.

Sorry I couldn't fix those two squares on the Arab map. Believe it not, I've never even seen excel before, let alone use it. So if somebody could alter them for me I'd be really grateful.

Here you go

Anyway, I'm almost done with Italy (Venice&Genoa). Once I finish with that I'll get to converting F&B, E, and G&V to excels where we can fill in the blanks and discuss accuracy.

Sorry for the silliness, and cheers

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

Here is the Italy stuff. Excels are coming!

-Джереми Завоеватель

 

[Úmarth]

Please don't feel you have to make excel maps! I simply made that spreadsheet because some people said they found using the WBS+citymap utility cumbersome.

I really don't mind either way but if anything the code/array format is more convenient for me because that's the format I'll eventually be converting the spreadsheets into any way. Sorry for any confusion.

Oh and its great to have you back on board Jeremy. Excellent work so far.

 

[Úmarth]

I took a quick look over the British map since that's the only one I can claim to have any knowledge about. Other than a few typos the only error I can see is Liverpool which is an industrial town. I would suggest Chester as a historic town in the same general area (Merseyside/Cheshire)

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

they found using the WBS+citymap utility cumbersome.

I really don't mind either way but if anything the code/array format is more convenient for me because that's the format I'll eventually be converting the spreadsheets into any way

The utility is in no way cumbersome to use, the problem is it is almost entirely impossible to look at what it produces. Excel, on the other hand, it very easy to look at (although still not as good as worldbuilder) as it visibly represents the locations.
Changes in the excel are also very easy to move to the utility, but it is impossible to go the other way around.

For this reason, it makes sense to make excels until everything is perfect at which point it should be converted into the utility (a word which I realize I have been using a bit strangely for lack of better terminology).
Therefore, I present the France/Burgundy settler map excel!

Oh and its great to have you back on board Jeremy. Excellent work so far.

Thank you!

 

[D. Zavoevatell]

I took a quick look over the British map since that's the only one I can claim to have any knowledge about. Other than a few typos the only error I can see is Liverpool which is an industrial town. I would suggest Chester as a historic town in the same general area (Merseyside/Cheshire)

I'll take that advice right away! And don't worry about the typ-oes, none of those persist in the settlermap file. Of course, I will correct them to prevent confusion and to save my reputation.
Also, I'm thinking Lancaster instead of another Chester? Your call.

Edit: Okay, I've totally updated England. Every tile now has a city, and there is an excel.
Edit2: Removed files. See ahead for latest version