[RI] A Realism Invictus walkthrough

Walter, I don't know if it's something that can be done on your end - The AIs don't really know how to handle paganism.

The Roman's build the statue of Zeus, and then shortly afterwards switched into Civil religion. They don't even _have_ a religion. I have seen similar things happen several times.
 
Walter, I don't know if it's something that can be done on your end - The AIs don't really know how to handle paganism.

The Roman's build the statue of Zeus, and then shortly afterwards switched into Civil religion. They don't even _have_ a religion. I have seen similar things happen several times.

He didn't write "Civil religion", he wrote "Civil service", a different civic in a different category. While AI doesn't formulate long-term paganism-based strategies, they rarely do something that stupid. As a player, I always consider paganism a temporary measure anyway, and so should AI.
 
I forgot to include it in the writeup, but Augustus did do something that stupid.

He adopted civil religion in 1480BC, without a religion.

All he gets out of that without a religion is added espionage, so unless he has adjusted his slider, he actually took an espionage loss by doing the switch.
 
agreed, this mod looks fantastic. I wonder, is it still good on faster settings and smaller maps? I like my games to end in 2 hours or less.
 
What was the point of an early war with America? Since you couldn't afford to keep the cities wouldn't it have been better to let them serve as barb shields instead of creating an opening in your defenses?

Or was your choice dictated by your Immortals unit, use them while they are cutting edge because you might not be able to win later?
 
Abegweit & Mikehendi - thanks for the kind words

Keilah, I have played on smaller maps and they work fine. I have not personally played it on the faster settings, however, so I can't personally attest.

D666 -
I am primarily using this walkthrough to showcase the mod. That said, I did set out to have at least 1 war in each era (assuming the map works out that way). Lincoln was closest, so he was the lucky victim. If I were playing just to win, instead of doing a show-and-tell, I'm not sure if I would have attacked him quite so soon. That said - there were some tangible benefits out of the campaign.

1) Lincoln is industrious, and as was shown by my unsuccessful motions toward New York, he can pump out units and settlers like a madman. Crippling him early gives me breathing room.
2) The campaign gave me quite a bit of the way towards getting my first Great General, which have new benefits in this mod - the doctrines I have already mentioned. They also have traditions they can build, and they're one of the very few pre-industrial units with a medic promotion. One of the reasons I went out looking for barbs with my immortals was to get the one more great general point I need. Believe it or not, I wasn't able to find a single unit outside of a city.
3) The copper and the wine river are a ways away from my capitol. I want to get access to both of them. The copper so I can build some better boats (iron won't work - not sure why it was made so) and also don't need to roll the dice on having iron in my borders to get cataphracts. My elephants may be able to be the backbone of my military once the opponents start fielding axemen, but they're really expensive - 160h each. The wine is very close to where Washington was. I was pretty worried that Lincoln was going to settle there as his first city. The wine will give each city that builds a tavern an extra :)
5) The cash from razing the cities fueled my 100% research for almost 20 turns.
6) Like you said - the immortals aren't going to be immortal forever. Once the AIs start fielding axemen, they lose a significant punch. Couple that with my own axemen who are bad against archers, and I'm going to have a lull in heavy unit support capability until I get some iron hooked up. If I don't have iron, I'm going to need to push towards armor and the next heavy cavalry unit.

I'm going to try to play the next round tonight, but won't have time to do a writeup.

My plan is to push the aztec back before they field too many of their Jaguars. They just got priesthood in the last few turns, giving them access to them. I'm pretty sure my elephants can take them, but my immortals are going to be fodder.
 
I played the turnset last night. I'll try to get the write-up done in a day or two.

I took out the Aztecs. For whatever reason, they didn't build any Jaguars. I have been having serious problems with barbarian galleys cutting traderoutes, but I ended the set in a good position to correct that.

More later.
 
Pretty cool mod, downloaded last night. Does the mod have bug included in it? Because I uninstalled bug and it still shows up using invictus.

Anyway, seems like there is a lot to learn with this mod. The way that growth is stifled early is what really challenges me. Seems very realistic.

Also like the tech trading mechanics though it seems impossible to maintain a great tech lead with them! But I guess that is the point, it's rare that two superpowers (and all the played civs in civ are superpowers, not minor nations) are that different in technology.
 
Indeed a very cool mod, I too downloaded it last night, and having tons of fun.

Thanks for the walkthough, and thanks for the modders great work!

Edit: Spell mistake, thanks Jwitti - ofc credit to all the modders !
 
Indeed a very cool mod, I too downloaded it last night, and having tons of fun.

Thanks for the walkthough, and thanks for the modders great work!

I'm not one of them but it was a team.. such a colossal project that is really quite wonderful!
 
Pretty cool mod, downloaded last night. Does the mod have bug included in it? Because I uninstalled bug and it still shows up using invictus.

Anyway, seems like there is a lot to learn with this mod. The way that growth is stifled early is what really challenges me. Seems very realistic.

Also like the tech trading mechanics though it seems impossible to maintain a great tech lead with them! But I guess that is the point, it's rare that two superpowers (and all the played civs in civ are superpowers, not minor nations) are that different in technology.

Yes, BUG is integrated into RI. And it is actually possible to maintain a very decent tech lead if you can crank out great amounts of research by yourself and close borders with all the relatively advanced civs - but it is certainly harder than in vanilla BtS.
 
I'm playing the mod and having a little trouble figuring out where some stuff comes from. For example I see improvements gatherer's camp and hunter's camp and they have no prereq techs. They also grant +1c in tribialism which I am in, yet I can't build them on my spices. Can anyone shed a little light on what's going on with those?

Great mod, just massive in scope- trying to get a handle on everything!
 
I'm pretty sure they're only for the minor civs in the Earth scenario grouped in the mod.
 
1470BC to 960BC
Welcome back!
When last we left off, our mighty army was preparing to take back the southern pass from the Aztec, and claim the copper which was rightfully ours, enabling the future construction of every warship up to frigates and privateers, as well as allowing spearmen, axemen, and cataphracts. Our economy was running at +25g/t when at 0% and -24g/t when at 100%.

My goals for this round (in more or less this order) were the following:
- Knock back the Aztec to claim the pass to the south
- Claim the source of copper and build a bronzesmith
- I decided in between turnsets that I would try to get mysticism and Buddhism for reasons I will explain later.
- Win the race to the first world unit, the Helepolis
- Start expanding my economy past the gold and silver tiles near my capital
- Work on getting the techs to allow the first jumps into classical era civics
- Explore the continent to the NE, the Roman and Zulu territories, and if I can the Incas
As you will soon see, some of these goals were successful, and some were not.

Before I start with the turnset, let me talk about the classical units. I mentioned in the last turnset how powerful the Persian elephants are.
- Elephants: Strength 8. Buildable with Elephant Taming, ivory, and construction of a large stable. +50% vs. melee units, +50% vs. mounted units. -25% in cities and -20% defense vs. archers. Cause up to 30% collateral damage. They cause all mounted units in adjacent squares to operate at -15% strength, and flank attack all classical and medieval siege units. These are limited build (qty 4) units for anyone with the prereqs.
- Persian national elephants: You are allowed to build these in addition to the standard ones, bringing your max roster to 8. They do not need to be built in large stables, and they do not need ivory (although they build faster if you have it). Their stats are similar with the following modifications: they are not at -25% in cities or defending against archers. They start with cover 1, and inflict fear which removes 1 first strike from adjacent units. They are classical era tanks. While the standard elephants only have a slight advantage attacking city defenders due to their base strength, these tear through defenders. Their only downside is their cost; They run 160h – over three times as much as any standard defender unit, and 1/3 more than the standard elephant.
- Swordsmen: Strength 6. Buildable with iron and iron working. +10% city attack and +25% against melee. Persian swordsmen are actually a phalanx-like unit, also gaining +25% against mounted and +25% defending in hills while suffering from -25% defending in forest. They upgrade to pikemen instead of foot knights as well.
- Cataphracts: Stength 7, speed 2. Buildable with armor crafting, horseback riding, and iron or bronze. Slightly weaker on defense in all terrain. Weak in cities, but have bonuses against huntsmen, melee and additional bonuses when attacking melee. They get a first strike and cause collateral damage, but don’t get defense bonuses. The Persian units are tougher than the standard, losing the terrain weakness and have extra bonuses against melee. The Persians also have a national Cataphract which is the same except they start with march and inspire troops in the stack, giving +5% strength.
- For naval units, the galley is the same as BTS except it’s faster (move 4). The triremes are available with ship building and need bronze. They are strength 3. They’re needed to take on barbarian galleys which show up somewhere between turn 200 to 250. If you have coastal assets or trade routes, you had better do what you can to find some copper. Beg, borrow, or steal.

One more thing I want to go through before I start the turn set is the classical religions
- Buddhism. Available with meditation. Their temples are mediocre, healing your units slightly faster. Their cathedrals provide extra happiness from marble and stone. Their great temple gives a huge +2 :) from gold and further heals your units, and their holy place makes your priests give an extra :hammers:. Their special unit, buildable in cathedrals, is the only unit outside of unattached great generals which have the medic promotion before the late renaissance. This, due to all of the wars I’m going to be waging this game, and coupled with the +2 happy from gold is why I picked Buddhism as my religion of choice for the game.

- Taoism. Available with Ritual. Taoists get no happiness from gems, gold, silver, or pearls, voiding the main reason to build jewelers. To compensate for this, their temples provide +2 :) instead of the standard 1, and they give an extra happy from hemp, as well as +1 :health:. Their cathedrals provide +1 :health: from hemp. Their great temple gives +25% GPP globally and +25% GPP to the city it was constructed. Their holy place gives +1 :hammers: to scientists. Their units, the chi savant, are expensive (480 hammers), but can get burnt in any city for a building which provides +1 happy, +1 health, +4 culture, and +1 GPP. It spreads pretty quickly as well.

- Judaism. Available with Monotheism. I can personally attest from my last big game that Judaism is the most powerful religion, while simultaneously having the biggest drawbacks. Firstly, it spreads the slowest of all of the religions. I had the great temple, the temple of Solomon, and the holy place from about 1000BC up through the early industrial era when I converted to free religion. I think I had a single city convert by itself in that entire time. Their Rabbis are available the latest of any of the early missionary units, and they can only have 1 built or in queue at a time. Jewish civs get no :health: from crabs, clams, or pigs. This is a huge deal later in the game, as you get additional :yuck: every era you enter. The fish resources are the only resources which give health without needing a building to convert it. It is partially countered by the synagogues which provide an extra health from cows, wheat, and fish, but you still need to get a missionary into the city before you can build it. Every new city you build from the renaissance on is going to have health problems from pop 1 until you drop a lot of hammers into infrastructure. That’s it for the drawbacks, and they’re pretty brutal. What’s the upside? Their synagogues give a lot of health bonuses as I mentioned. They also provide +25% to the city’s trade routes. Their cathedrals (great synagogues) give an extra +1 :) for gems. Their holy place gives +1 :hammers: to scientists. Their cathedrals let them build the diaspora merchants which acts as mini- great merchants. Then, there is their great temple –Qumran. Qumran not only proves +1 :) to every city for every 20% of your research rate, but it also automatically puts a Yeshiva in every city which gives +1 and +5% research. If the drawbacks for this religion weren’t so oppressive, I’d say that the religion is overpowered due to this wonder.

- Solar Cult: Available with Calendar. This religion is best suited for large, sprawling civs and warmongers. Their temples reduce city maintenance by 10%. Their great temples further reduce city maintenance by 10% and provide an extra happy from gold. Their great temple cuts war weariness by 25%, increases enemy war weariness by 25% and increases military production by 25% (I’m not positive if this is only in the city it’s built or global – the civopedia is a little ambiguous). Their holy place gives +1 :hammers: to engineers. The only downside to the solar cult is that they have no religion-based unit.


OK – aaaaall that being said, let’s get on with the game, shall we?
Turn 203 / 1470BC: Since there are several civs who could feasibly research it very soon, I switch my research from metal casting to meditation to get Buddhism, and end the turn.

Turn 204: I declare war on the Aztec. I attack his archers with my elephant at 99% odds, to keep my infantry fresh for the attack on the hill city. I complete the attack with my chariots. No losses. Somewhere, Lincoln founds Philadelphia. I get my first great general. I could burn him to get a buff to my melee units, but since I’ve built all my immortals already, I decide to save him for either the nomadic lifestyle tradition or a later doctrine. Imperial Glory is one that I have typically shot for in the past, but holy war or chivalry may also be fun. I do have a lot of research due to the gold, so things which will expire quickly are not going to have much oomph. Looking at the map, taking Doctrine – Fireships may also be useful this game. In the meantime, I bring him up to the front to help heal my stack.
Spoiler :

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Turn 205: My immortals make short work of the militias guarding the hill city. I park my galley near my clams in case a barb galley shows up.
Spoiler :

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Turn 206: My second elephant is done in Pasargadae. I start on a caravan house next.

Turn 207: My hunters cabin finishes in Susa, giving me an extra point of food there. I will now be able to get the city working the silver, horse, and marble before it stagnates. It will have some tools to improve more once I get into the industrial era, but for now it’ll just be stagnated and keeping the horses as a strategic resource. I start my assault on Texcoco.

Turn 208 / 1420BC: Texcoco burnt to the ground. The two workers I have captured already start roading a path back to my territory.
Spoiler :

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Turn 209: My trade deal with the Inca cancelled. I can see blockade hexes near the Aztec territory, but it’s likely a barbarian galley causing trouble. I send my galley out to interdict. I have a heavily wounded chariot (10% health) that I pull back to Pasargadae to rest and then send off to scout the NE.

Turn 210: I lost a chariot attacking an archer out in the open. With the retreat odds it was a coinflip. I didn’t want him to retreat back to Tenoctitlan, though.

Turn 211: I spot Teotihuacan with 1 archer defending.
Spoiler :

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Turn 212: My galley barely survives against a barb galley. I move him back to heal as another barb shows up right next to it. I found Buddhism. I set up some more trade routes with the Inca and then convert. Stone for Gold, Rice for Ivory. I start research on Metal Casting again. I found Ecbatana to claim the copper. Building a monument first. My army pillages tiles outside of Tenochtitlan.
Spoiler :

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Turn 213 / 1370BC: I raze Tenochtitlan, losing no attackers. The elephants are overpowered. I was expecting to lose some units in this assault and then declare peace. I’m only down two chariots (one killed, one retreated), so I push onwards. War loot lets me turn my research back to 100%.
Spoiler :

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Turn 215: My galley is sunk by barbs. I connect the copper (I had 4 workers on it). Pasargadae finishes the caravan house, giving me another 2c trade route and another happy. I start on my bronze smith. The chariot is healed and heads off into the jungle to the NE.

A note about the industrial buildings: They do not “consume” the resource. You can have your cake and eat it too. For every copper resource you have hooked up, you can build one bronze smith to turn it into bronze. Similarly, for every coal resource you have, you can make a brickworks. It doesn’t destroy the coal – you can use the same coal to also make ironworks, for example, but your total number of any one building is limited by the total quantity.

Turn 216: Barb galleys eat my clam ships.
Spoiler :

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Turn 217: One of the barbs kill the trade routes again by blockading. No point building galleys when it’ll just be a coinflip if they will win. I just have to suck it up until I can divert my research to shipbuilding.

Turn 218: I start attacking Tlatelolco. Take no losses, but do take some damage.

Turn 219: I research Metal Casting and start on Alphabet next. I’m working my way to get the Helepolis. I take Tlatelolco, collect 154c and raze it.

Spoiler :

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Turn 221: I send my chariots out to explore a bit and move the rest of my army to take out the Aztec entirely. Wasn’t necessarily going for it, but might as well. The elephants are just that OP. I don’t need to keep two people who hate me on my borders.

Turn 222: I find a barbarian city at the base of the peninsula. He sends out a light horseman and kills my chariot the next turn.
Spoiler :

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Turn 223: I discover alphabet. Mathematics is next. Taoism is founded. I think the southern “ocean” is actually a huge lake.
Spoiler :

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A quick note on alphabet - I tend to delay this tech a lot more than I would the comparable BTS tech (writing for the libraries). I don't know if it's best to do so or not, but my gut tells me it is. Storytellers circles are really cheap, and provide easy culture and research. The school which is the SC's upgrade is much more expensive, and you need two other techs after alphabet before you can build it. Whether the access to libraries is better than access to SCs is up to the game's situations, but usually by this time, my happy cap and surplus food don't accommodate working scientists until I've developed the top trade line, city planning, or a religion.

Turn 224: I connect my marble. Still moving my army up.

Turn 225: Robert the Bruce converts to Taoism, but he didn’t found it – I check the research trade tab and find that it was Nelson Mandela who did, and he probably sent his missionary to Robert. No idea what the reason for that was, as Mandela is still Hindu. I am ready to attack Teotihuacan and remove the Aztec. I have a pandemic in Pasargadae.
Spoiler :

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Turn 226: The pandemic kills a point of population – any city bigger than 4 will lose pop to them. I need to prioritize iron working fairly soon as well to cut down the jungle. In the meantime, granaries, smokehouses, and wells all will improve my odds. If I had extra happy, I could build walls and a pandemic colony as well. My elephants have their worst odds against the fortified, heavily promoted, hill archer. 84%. He wins the fight, and the other defenders topple. I win 152c and 2 workers. I raze the city, wiping out the Aztec. I split my troops into two squads to hunt barb cities. I send one west to explore and the other east to take out the city on the other side of the lake.

Spoiler :

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Turn 229: My bronze smith completes and I start on a granary next.

Turn 232: A great artist is born. I think it’s in Rome from the Statue of Zeus.

Turn 236: I start on a settler for the wine site. Caravan houses are built in all of my cities. My finances are +31c at 0% and -30c at 100%. This is one one of the off turns when I have connection to the Inca lands through the barbarian galleys. I find Taoism’s home city and destroy the first barbarian city.

Spoiler :

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Turn 239: I research Mathematics. I divert my granary construction for the Helepolis. My next research target is Shipbuilding to take out the barb galleys and secure the coasts.
Spoiler :

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Turn 240: I finish mapping the Zulu lands. He’s tiny. 3 cities. He’s probably decided to go for a cultural victory already.
Spoiler :

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Turn 243: One of my immortals dies attacking a barb city. My elephant is critically wounded attacking the city, so I pull the remaining units back to heal. Rome converts to Taoism.
Spoiler :

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Turn 244: Lincoln was kind enough to build the Parthenon for me in New York. I build the Helepolis. Robert the Bruce extorts me for sheep – needing two resources for one. I do the trade, just to get the relations boost.
Spoiler :

civ4screenshot0025.jpg


The Helepolis is a new type of unit for RI – the world unit. It’s basically a mobile world wonder. They are basically overpowered siege machines. Helepolis is strength 3, move 1. It does a max of 80% damage to enemies, does 25% collateral damage, has +100% vs cities, +50% vs. archers, and can bombard better than any unit until Trebuchets. It also causes fear which removes 1 first strike from adjacent units. The downside to it and other world units is that they cannot move into swamps, forests, or jungles. You are basically forced to bring along workers if you want to assault a city behind a forest with it. They can go on boats, however. I have used that to move them around jungle filled enemy territory in a previous game.

Turn 249: Shipbuilding is complete. I research priesthood next to get temples

Turn 251: Lincoln converts to Buddhism and I build the settler. Lincoln is also moving his army pretty threateningly. He will likely decide to “end” me. I am pretty undergarrisoned, however, so I start moving some archers around. I captured the barb city with the elephant and immortal. Although I’m pretty sure it was originally a barbarian city, I get the interface to return it to the Celts. I make a mistake and give it outright instead of trying to get some cash for it.

Turn 252: Lincoln declares war. I lose a worker or two that were roading up the wine and river. Wasn’t expecting him to attack this turn. Live and learn. His army consists of a whopping 5 archers and 4 militia. It must have been dragging down his economy or something. I get a second archer into Ecbatana – sweating a little. Half of my army is about 10-15 turns away and the other half is wounded about 10 turns out, but will need to pass near American lands. The Oracle is built somewhere.

Turn 253: For whatever reason, Lincoln didn’t attack Ecbatana. I think that he would have been able to take and raze it with the army he had next to it. Only one of my archers had any fortify bonus.
Spoiler :

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Turn 254 / 960BC: Robert demands 70g in tribute. I accept, but put a note in the back of my mind who will be the Medieval age victim. I just gifted the ungrateful git a city. I research Priesthood and start on City planning next. Robert has researched iron working. At this point I realized that I probably played enough for a turnset, and take a break. My settler is parked away from the front lines with the Helepolis. I switched all production from making Triremes into making Immortals, Elephants, and Archers.

My preliminary plan for the next round is the following:
- Destroy Lincoln. If the Parthenon survives my assault, I will keep New York. If not, I’ll raze it because I like 1NE better (with a city on the other side of the lake, will allow a sea bridge to the other side of the continent. Coastal will also let each of the lake tiles give an extra food and commerce with fishing docks and a lighthouse). If I don’t raze, I’ll need to put a fort canal instead.
- Get city planning and dynastism and revolt into: Monarchy/Civil Service/Civil Religion. I will go over the various classical age civics.
- Build a navy. Clear the traderoutes to the Incas of barbs.
- Use the navy to explore East and West
- Raze the barb city on the other side of the mountain range and build a commerce city there.
- Get iron working and chop down the jungle to the east.
- I will then work on economy techs. I will go over the various techs and buildings which help stabilize commerce in an expanding empire.
- Expand into a few more city sites.
- Smoothly move into the late classical / early medieval era.

Thanks for watching! Let me know what you think -
 

Attachments

nice writeup. i especially likethe descriptions of techs/buildings/etc and the comparable options. shorter turnsets would be nice.
 
Next round is played through 720BC/turn 276. Will need a little time for the writeup.
 
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