Robot vs Automaton

[Kyriakos]

As far as i know the term "robot" is czech, although i am not aware from which text it originates. The term "automaton" is greek, and means the same thing, it originates in ancient Greece, in myths about automata like Talos, the machine-giant that protected the island of Crete.

My question is why the term automaton, which is used for such a thing in literature and probably science as well, up until the 19th century, got replaced with the term robot. Anyone know?

You can also discuss which of the two terms you prefer.
I don't know of the etymology of the term robot, but automaton is a word that breaks up to auto (it) and maio (will), and means "that (object) which has a will of its own".

 

[PiMan]

My guess is because robot has half the syllables.

 

[Winner]

Our term is cooler It was invented as a term for human-like slave worker for a theatrical play by Karel Čapek (the actual word came from his brother Josef).

It is derived (by means of clipping) from a Czech word 'robota', denoting a kind of forced labour the peasants were required to provide to their liege lord (I think the 'English' term for that is corvee, but I am not sure).

 

[PiMan]

I'd never heard of 'corvee' before, so I looked it up. The term appears to be more for the French, while 'indenture' would probably be the more common English term.

 

[Kyriakos]

Our term is cooler It was invented as a term for human-like slave worker for a theatrical play by Karel Čapek (the actual word came from his brother Josef).

It is derived (by means of clipping) from a Czech word 'robota', denoting a kind of forced labour the peasants were required to provide to their liege lord (I think the 'English' term for that is corvee, but I am not sure).

Very interesting So robot etymologically includes the meaning that the machine is a slave. Automaton does not include that, since it can be, theoretically, free

 

[Cheetah]

The Czech Robot denotes machines that rebel and attacks humans, which is far more interesting and cooler to the imagination than simple machines that have their own wills...

Just like the Terminators and Bender are cooler than C-3PO and Mr. Data.

Things that want to kill us are far more interesting than things that want to be our friends!

 

[Kyriakos]

I agree with this sentiment, but im not sure if that is actually what robot means (perhaps Winner can comment ), and i am pretty sure that automaton does not negate the possibility that it rebels (in fact it could have been created as a free entity in the first place)
To me it seemed, ont he contrary, that robot meant something bound to its master, like a golem, whereas automaton could have a life of its own, etymologically.

 

[Winner]

Well, there is really not much more to it than what I already explained. Perhaps I should add that "robota" is now (in the modern era, I mean) also used for other kinds of hard labour/work you are not very happy about. Like "Hey honey, I am home. You won't believe what we had to do all day, it was terrible robota." But it isn't a word we use very often.

I think the current meaning of the now international word robot is simply a machine that is capable of doing human work for us. It doesn't have to be intelligent (robots in car factories certainly aren't). If this is the correct meaning, than it more or less corresponds with the etymological meaning in Czech, perhaps without the negative connotations.

BTW, isn't "android" the common term for "human-like intelligent machine"?

 

[holy king]

roboten even became a rarely used german verb for working via slavic construction workers.

 

[Winner]

roboten even became a rarely used german verb for working via slavic construction workers.

"Roboten verboten"

 

[Kyriakos]

BTW, isn't "android" the common term for "human-like intelligent machine"?

Android comes from the greek Andras (male person) and Eidos (kind, type), so it means something that is similar to a man, but still is an object, which is why it is in neutral form in greek

 

[warpus]

Our term is cooler It was invented as a term for human-like slave worker for a theatrical play by Karel Čapek (the actual word came from his brother Josef).

It is derived (by means of clipping) from a Czech word 'robota', denoting a kind of forced labour the peasants were required to provide to their liege lord (I think the 'English' term for that is corvee, but I am not sure).

In Polish "robota" just means "work". I assumed that that's what it meant in Czech too.

You learn something new every day

 

[Winner]

In Polish "robota" just means "work". I assumed that that's what it meant in Czech too.

You learn something new every day

That's the principal trouble when I try understanding Polish - it seems that many words you use in "neutral" sense have (very) negative connotations in Czech. For example, Polish word for scent (pleasant smell) is "zapach" - which means foul smell in Czech

It is almost as if we have taken all our negative words from Polish, or as if the original old Slavic words gradually turned negative in Czech. Interesting

 

[MobBoss]

Domo Arigato Mr. Roboto

 

[El_Machinae]

In legal usage "automaton" very much connotes a lack of will. There are a series of defense strategies that can use automaton to remove mens rea

 

[Kyriakos]

Nothing surprising there, since obviously it is compared to a real human, and has less will

 

[warpus]

That's the principal trouble when I try understanding Polish - it seems that many words you use in "neutral" sense have (very) negative connotations in Czech. For example, Polish word for scent (pleasant smell) is "zapach" - which means foul smell in Czech

It is almost as if we have taken all our negative words from Polish, or as if the original old Slavic words gradually turned negative in Czech. Interesting

Hey, there's hilarity of meaning going both ways

Nothing surprising there, since obviously it is compared to a real human, and has less will

Technically robots could have free will while automatons couldn't. I mean, based on what the words imply in English.

 

[sophie]

Funny. I always thought Robot was an acronym, much in the same way that LASER or SCUBA was...Learn something new every day!

 

[Kyriakos]

Hey, there's hilarity of meaning going both ways



Technically robots could have free will while automatons couldn't. I mean, based on what the words imply in English.

No, since automaton literrally means "it that has a will of its own". Moreover, at least in german, i have read about it being clearly something that has a free will, to a degree.
Perhaps it is just in legal jargon that it means having no will, although Machinae's example did not convince me that it meant that, since it seems it meant simply that it has a diminished capacity of free will in relation to a regular human (and that obviously is the case with automaton anyway)

 

[holy king]

in german?

we call vending machine's automaten. i dont see them having a lot of free will...