Role Play Challenge: Return of the Great Khan, An open RPC game

[huerfanista]

UPDATE 2: 1300 AD

Spoiler :

Since my last post I've been building up for the Big Push. In contrast to the first half millennium AD, I haven't been DOWed once. I think the AIs are a bit scared of my power numbers.

Anyway, I decided to go up the Liberalism path after all. I easily won it around 1100AD, taking steel as my free tech. In the meantime, I had traded for feudalism/guilds/banking and piles o' cash, so now I'm heading towards rifling. I built lots of trebs and converted them all to cannon as soon as I got steel (the best upgrade bargain in the game, IMO). Once I get rifling (I'll easily be the first one to it) it will be time to launch the Great Mongol Invasion of the World. I've got 6000 saved up to convert as much of my military as I can to rifles. I'll tech to MilTrad for cavalry (my keshiks are already knights) so the horse-boys can join the party (and hopefully speed things up a bit).

The reason I've waited so long is because I'm not sure how this will all play out vis-a-vis the rule that says only enemy capitals or wonder cities may be kept. I didn't want to leave huge areas of developed land for the AI's to resettle once I've wiped out a civ. Anyway, I'm the score and power leader and am halfway thru Rep Parts. With rifles/cannon I should be unstoppable (nobody else even has chemistry yet - they're all teching Nationalism). I'm building lots of spies to speed things up, and I have good EP's on all the AI's that count (2 settled GSpies + Scotland Yard in Karakorum).

 

[Bleys]

I am really struggling with the adjustment to Marathon speed. I play far too much Epic, I guess, its all I play, in fact. I cant work the math as quickly on Marathon, and thus I end up spending even longer.

I may World Builder the save and play it at Epic. I can tell this game will require some effort and I have already made far too many blunders with chop/whip/tech timing. If anyone else wants to have variable speed/difficulty (and madscientist doesnt mind, of course) I could upload a ZIP of the WB Save.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I already worldbuildered it to epic but I never picked up on how to hide the leaders like rolo does, so I just clicked next quickly so that I didn't see the other civs. Epic does reduce the time for keshik usefulness but I'm more used to it, and a huge map will take me a year otherwise .

I said it in the spoiler but I'll say it outside of it also (perhaps a bit more calmly!): The forced city razing rule sucks. Hard. It is very hammer inefficient and has been hampering me all game. None of the other rules are that bad but having to build settlers and being unable to whip courthouses in new cities is extremely damaging.

 

[Diamondeye]

This is my first time playing the Great Khan, so I'd appreciate any advice on the use (and mis-use) of keshiks. That being said, I'm doing alright at 450AD (monarch/marathon):

Use: Rush. Kill. Gore. Blood. Fire. Death.

Misuse:

I am really struggling with the adjustment to Marathon speed. I play far too much Epic, I guess, its all I play, in fact. I cant work the math as quickly on Marathon, and thus I end up spending even longer.

I may World Builder the save and play it at Epic. I can tell this game will require some effort and I have already made far too many blunders with chop/whip/tech timing. If anyone else wants to have variable speed/difficulty (and madscientist doesnt mind, of course) I could upload a ZIP of the WB Save.

I am too comfortable at Epic aswell, might have to try this one. Enjoyed the first Khan game although I did not shadow it (I wasn't comfortable anywhere near Monarch at the time).

I plan on settling 1SW.

 

[madscientist]

UPdate and restart

Spoiler :

The first game ended is a sloggining stalemate with Sittingbull and vassals starting to overwhelm the mighty KHAN.

Rather than watch the Mighty KHAN die is disgrace, I restated the game!!!

Sure I know the map, so what. THis one id about fun and I'll replay it until I win!!!!

I did settle a little more agressively, still took Shaka out (actually took longer as he took Washington from Washington which I ended up razing mush to Washington's horror), Liberated Thebes from the moronic Egyptians and looking to finish them off.

Current game finds Sitting Bull getting dogpiled although still very competant.

The first game I amde the mistake of risking liberalism which failed. THis time I am thinking as KHAN should, only military techs

Regarding stepping up to marathon, I understand as I have the same problem when I try and shadow one of Sis's ALCs.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

What's the need for military techs when one has KESHIKS?! Used properly they can cut through 3-5 civs IMO. That is, if we didn't HAVE to raze cities.

 

[madscientist]

What's the need for military techs when one has KESHIKS?! Used properly they can cut through 3-5 civs IMO. That is, if we didn't HAVE to raze cities.

Ah!!!! But that is the challenge!!!

Spoiler :

I am preferring knights since by the time they are arround when

1) I have the HE in the capital with at least 2-3 settled GGs.
2) The GER
3) Running Bureacracy and theocracy.

 

[Bleys]

I already worldbuildered it to epic but I never picked up on how to hide the leaders like rolo does, so I just clicked next quickly so that I didn't see the other civs.

This game is WILD, LOL. To answer your question about hiding the other civs, here is what you do.

First, take the file into Notepad. To change the speed, set GAMESPEED=NONE and MAX_TURNS=NONE. This allows the speed to be set in the Scenario menu.

To hide the civs, use FIND --> REPLACE, and type in PLAYABLECIV=1, changed to PLAYABLECIV=0. It will change all 18 civs, including Genghis, so just scroll down to the very first AI, which will be GK, since the player is always Team 0, and manually change PLAYABLECIV=0 back to PLAYABLECIV=1. Thats that. Its super simple. I will attach my WB Save here, but be warned, if you wish to go DOWN a level, to Prince, it will be "Prince Plus" because I did not edit out the AI's bonus tech of Archery. If you want to do that, once again, FIND --> REPLACE, find TECH=ARCHERY and replace it with a <space>, it will remove all the AIs knowledge of archery.

My first report, Through 625 AD: (editing done)

Spoiler :

First off, sorry for the lack of screenies of my early turns, I tend to get absorbed, heh.

I moved onto the Plains Hill 1W, thinking I would still be on fresh water, but would get another FP. My scout promptly popped a hut with . . . ANOTHER SCOUT! WOO WOO! I also built a Scout first, since it was the exact build-time to grow to 2 pop. Tech order was Mining, BW (which I saved 5 turns of research from another hut), Ag, Masonry, AH, Pottery, then I traded some techs to HC, who is still the only AI I have met with Alpha. I teched HBR myself, and traded it to HC for Archery and Med. I also traded him some other techs early, so my tech situation is solid. 2nd city was on the 2nd Copper to the NW, with the 1 of the gold. 5th city has the other gold, with Marble, Rice, and Elephants.

I got yet another scout off a hut, and a map, and some cash. I had 3 scouts out scoping the situation, so I got a lot of land exposed. Shaka was my first target, and once I got the Copper hooked up, I started pumping out Axes. 3rd city claimed the Horses, and soon I had 3 cities with 4 workers chopping out Axes and Chariots. Shaka had settled on the Copper to his NE, so that was the first city to go. After that, he didnt put up much of a fight. My axes were all strong. I built the Wall after hooking up the stone, using Unit whip overflow to put lots of hammers into it. This served a dual purpose, I think the Barbs have a city in the tundra to the south, because it started cranking out archers and warriors. Since I had the GW, they went right for Shaka, LOL, so he had lots of enemy troops to deal with.

I actually started the Mids, thinking I could whip-overflow and get those too, but check this out:



750 BC!! Before the Oracle even! My 4th city claimed the Marble-Gold up NE, and I kept Shaka's cap, so I have 5 cities now. Heres a few screenies of them:

Capitol:



2nd city:



3rd City:



And Shaka's Capitol:



Ramesses is next, here is my army . . .



and after that, I think Pacal. To the far east are 2 PRO leaders, Sitting Bull and Saladin, so I may hold off on them. I have plenty of land around to settle, but my economy is going to require near-constant war, with LOTS of Keshik Pillaging. I foolishly (well maybe not, its still strong) attached my first GG to a Chariot. I have a 2nd GG parked in my cap waiting for my first Keshik. 2 healer GGs, since I am planning 2 stacks of attackers.

 

[Bleys]

Ah!!!! But that is the challenge!!!

I agree! City Razing is an AWESOME condition, and GK is perfect for it. Want the solution? Leverage that IMP trait, and send settlers with your Stacks!! I did that when I whacked my first victem, but decided NOT to re-settle any of his other spots, see my report in the post above for why, spoilered for obvious reasons.

Gotta tell ya MS, this is one of your best ones yet, and really showing me the power of the Mongols, I already have 2 GGs, and as soon as I get my Ger's up, its game-over for my opponents.

Regarding stepping up to marathon, I understand as I have the same problem when I try and shadow one of Sis's ALCs.

Anytime you need some WB Editing done, just PM me, bro. I can fix em up for you just dandy, you wont see the other AIs, and you can play Marathon. I know how hard it is to change what your accustomed too, I abandoned 3 or 4 of your other RPCs because of it (sorry heh), but this one was SO fun out of the gate I had to re-do it.

That goes for anyone, BTW. Just PM me a link to the game you wish me to "adjust", I am so used to it now that it only takes about 2 minutes, seriously. I will attach the ZIP right back into that thread, too, so please kind of "request" it publicly. If you want to do your own RPCs and have a ZIP for them, just let me know as well. Start the thread, attach a save, tell folks the ZIP is coming if they wish to change speed/difficulty from your save's settings, and I will fix it and link it right back. Its no bother, and I REALLY think these RPC/Series games are the single best way to learn this game. Seeing what other people did/didnt do, and how that worked out, has taught me more than actually playing offline games. I never even play offline games anymore, other than to test starts, and play til 1 AD or something (takes like an hour for me to test a starting strat)

 

[madscientist]

I agree! City Razing is an AWESOME condition, and GK is perfect for it. Want the solution? Leverage that IMP trait, and send settlers with your Stacks!! I did that when I whacked my first victem, but decided NOT to re-settle any of his other spots, see my report in the post above for why, spoilered for obvious reasons.

Gotta tell ya MS, this is one of your best ones yet, and really showing me the power of the Mongols, I already have 2 GGs, and as soon as I get my Ger's up, its game-over for my opponents.

That's what I wanted to here, Praise for the Great KHAN!!!!

I don't care if I lose, as long as someone comes arround appreciates Ghangis Khan in this game more!

 

[Bleys]

I never played GK, because I love KK so much, CRE is the bomb with a warmonger, conquering AI, but in this game, its not as strong as the IMP trait because of the RPC conditions. Dont need that fast border pop in a captured city, LOL, each AI only has 1 I can even keep.

BTW bro, I edited the post above a bit for you, so look it over. Offer stands and is open to all, I will edit WB files so folks can play their own preferred speed, MOD, and even have some flexibility in the didifficulty.

 

[madscientist]

Gooed eal BLEYs. I understand half finished games perfectly.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Got it, thanks Bleys. I didn't realize it was as simple as changing the playableciv line.

Also, you can use 0's for game speed and for difficulty, it functions the same as NONE.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

That's what I wanted to here, Praise for the Great KHAN!!!!

I don't care if I lose, as long as someone comes arround appreciates Ghangis Khan in this game more!

I think I'm doing well enough to win anyway (you can get an idea by my 1000AD save), but the city razing is so frustrating . I like both Khans, though I prefer KK. The GG's are a nice touch too though so I may rethink that. I'm making some nasty keshiks by settling them.

I hate knights when I play this way. With a passion. They never withdraw. I usually skip them in my all-mounted games, or use them minimally (exceptions: arabia and byzantines). Curies @ mil tradition and gunpowder are also more compatible with the lib path, as are cavalry. In my eyes keshiks can cover for a long time as they're extremely versatile, so I like extending their use because I can get away with bum rush horse archers into the 1000's AD...only with mongolia (ok, or maybe with a lot of civs ). It's easiest with Mongolia though. Keshiks = prats IMO, you just have to play slightly differently to see it.

Now, if I can settle enough land where I'm pushing domination, then razing won't feel so bad anymore. In fact, I'll relish it . If all goes well cavalry will be the best unit I ever make.

 

[semirami]

I agree! City Razing is an AWESOME condition, and GK is perfect for it. Want the solution? Leverage that IMP trait, and send settlers with your Stacks!!

Thas an excellent idea, but you'll win domination victory at some point. That is the hardest thing in this RPC, how to win conquest without vassals. My game is already won, if I want domination, culture, or space victory.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Thas an excellent idea, but you'll win domination victory at some point. That is the hardest thing in this RPC, how to win conquest without vassals. My game is already won, if I want domination, culture, or space victory.

Just spam military and systematically raze opponents once you have about 40% of the land/pop. Recommended civics are police state, state property, and whatever else you want (probably theocracy/caste too unless emancipation anger gets bad).

 

[Diamondeye]

Spoiler The Reason I Quit :

The Great Khan next to who? Pacal (spears!) and Shaka (spears!). And Marathon speed. I can't cope Marathon, I ain't used to it. I rushed to HBR, only to get my butt kicked by 7 nations (I hadn't even adopted a religion); England, Vikings, Egypt, Zulu, Korea, etc. I was bloody wiped of the map! I took Shakas capi, yet he refused peace and just kept attacking. Finally England took my capital and I decided that this game could blow. By that time it was just before the ADs, and I was pathetically behind (lacking Math, CoL, Monarchy).

 

[madscientist]

Spoiler The Reason I Quit :

The Great Khan next to who? Pacal (spears!) and Shaka (spears!). And Marathon speed. I can't cope Marathon, I ain't used to it. I rushed to HBR, only to get my butt kicked by 7 nations (I hadn't even adopted a religion); England, Vikings, Egypt, Zulu, Korea, etc. I was bloody wiped of the map! I took Shakas capi, yet he refused peace and just kept attacking. Finally England took my capital and I decided that this game could blow. By that time it was just before the ADs, and I was pathetically behind (lacking Math, CoL, Monarchy).

Spoiler :

GK is also agressive. I used axes and chariots against Shaka early (both times. Keshiks were great against War Chariots. Pacal I left alone figuring the never attacks during his UU time and will be easier later.

 

[huerfanista]

Keshiks = prats IMO, you just have to play slightly differently to see it.

Care to elaborate? I have no experience using keshiks (or HAs) that late into the game, and the idea of going up against spears with nothing but horses seems like suicide to me. I only used them defensively in this game - I just didn't have the confidence to go for an all-out offensive war with them. So I'd appreciate any tips you might give regarding their use in that way. My initial guess would be that you promote half C1/shock/c2 and half flanking1/fl2/c1.

 

[Bleys]

Quick rules thing, if I give another AI peace after taking his capitol, can I keep his NEW capitol once I take it?

Heh, a bit of a loophole, I know. I am not going to do it, just wanted to point it out.

Oh, and whats the rule on Barb cities? They dont have a capitol, and I have one south of me.