Sad Irony in History

[IceBlaZe]

After the greek exilation, the romic crusades, the spanish inquisition, the holocaust, A world that sealed its doors to the jews who tried to escape from the Nazi's and the jewish slaughter now thinks its RACISM and FASCISM that they try to have a country of their own.

Maybe its ironic, but it sucks.

 

[Eli]

Cool. Another Israeli.

 

[Simon Darkshade]

Indeed. I have noted the comments of some...individuals with a mixture of bemusement and disgust. Perhaps a little study on what fascism really is would be in order.

 

[amadeus]

I'm very pro-Isreal, myself...but the thing I don't understand is this:

When Isreal is organized as a Jewish state, it is called "racism" (despite many non-Jews are welcomed in Isreal)

But when other Middle Eastern states follow Islamic fundamentalism, it's simply dismissed.

And the declaration of "racism" by the United Nations only shows how truly ignorant they are. Of course, George Bush is smart enough not to follow that UN crap.

 

[Maj]

And the declaration of "racism" by the United Nations only shows how truly ignorant they are. Of course, George Bush is smart enough not to follow that UN crap

*slaps forhead*

-Maj

 

[CurtSibling]

The cure for racism is knowledge about your fellow man.

Eradicate ignorance and you halt racism.

Otherwise there will never be an end to the middle eastern bloodshed.

I wouldn't say any side of the Israeli / Arab conflict have a more valid claim. They both have blood on their hands...

But they also have the power to stop this madness...

Maybe hate is easier.

 

[IceBlaZe]

for ****s saks curt sibling, cant you put the situation in the middle east out of one lousy thraed about israel?
sorry, but it really upsets me each time someone says 'Israel' someone must say 'middle east situation'. its just upsetting. when it comes to the middle east everyone suddenly becomes politicians and they suddenly forget the deep racism in europe, or the discrimination of all other religions than islam in muslim countries like iran, or syria.
calling Israel racist is just hypocritism (spelling :/).
you forget that in Israel Arabs, Jews, Muslims, Druize, Blacks, Yellows, Whites, Europeans, Americans, Australians all leave under one government with the same rights and the same chances.
so what if its called a jewish country, maybe its because we were slaughtered in any other place we ever been into? ever thought about that?

 

[Blackadder]

Edward the First of England had an early 'holocaust' of the Jewish race, as well as the Welsh (and later the Scots). Yet note that many of these countries (e.g. Spain) began to be hurt economically because of these loses.

Out of interest, would you say William Shakespeare was racist with 'The Merchant Of Venice'? Shylock did get the best lines......

I don't quite know how to put this but what would the 'Zealot' Jews of Masada be classified as. The ones who commited mass suicide as opposed to being slaves of the Romans? The ones who probably gave us the word Zealot (don't know much more)


Oddly enough, I think the people who said Isreal isn't a country and that it is racist also said it was racist to call someone 'British'.

 

[jon78]

com'n listen to yourself...

I know that orthodox jews in israel thinks that the the palestinians didn't live there until after the state of Israel was founded. this is really the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

I am not going into a debate in whoever has the "proper right" to the land itself. who cares? why can't you live in israel unless you're jewish? isn't that so? isn't THAT racist?

I have jewish relatives so I have nothing against you ppl, it's just that your treatment of the palestinian ppl aggrevates me. why don't give them 10% of their original land back and end the entire conflict.

 

[IceBlaZe]

jon78, its not true that someone who is not jewish cant live in Israel!
Its a myth!
Actually its not even a myth, its something that people with no knowledge about Israel say.
Israel is full of arab villages and arab-jewish cities such as Tel-aviv-yafo, haifa and acer (akko) which are between the biggest cities of Israel.
Stop saying things you dont know about! dont call Israel racist just because you dont know we have arabs and druize and beduins that live here aswell!

'I know that orthodox jews in israel thinks that the the palestinians didn't live there until after the state of Israel was founded. this is really the stupidest thing I have ever heard'

No offense, but from what I hear from you you know absolutely nothing about Israel, the palestiniens, the arabs or even the opinions of the orthodox jews. I dont think you even know what is the orthodox wave in judaism =/

And actually, we already offered them 97% of the territories but Arafat chose no and chose terror.
But PLEASE lets not go into this again, you cant argue facts. go read some history and post a rephormed comment, its pointless posting things that are a complete lie and based on some brain-wash the european media done to you...

 

[PinkyGen]

I'm very pro-Israel, but why is this thread here? Don't we have a bunch of threads on the Israeli-Arab conflict.

 

[CurtSibling]

Well sorry, Iceblaze, If I had the nerve to open my mouth.

Cursing and abusive language isn't going to silence anyone around here, so back off.

You may have noticed I didn't say I was a politician (perish the thought).

I merely made my statement to say that racism ANYWHERE ON EARTH has
To be combated, and doing so would solve a lot of problems.

I think the situation in your part of the world was a good example of how
Some ignorance could be removed…and not from Israel alone,

But this also applies to:

India and Pakistan,
Northern Ireland,
Middle East and the Western Nations,
Albania and Serbia,
The list goes on and on…

So I apologise for mentioning the conflict, I meant it in a different context.

Obviously I am aware that Israel has many different people living there,
(Bedouin, Jews, Muslims, Druize, etc.)

I never at any point said Israel, as a whole was racist!

How the hell can anyone judge a whole nation?

 

[Archbob]

I see it from both viewpoints.

Yes, they should have their own country, however, it is carved out of what was Arab land. I bet people are just tired of the conflict in the middle east.

Isreal would not be a country today if the U.N. had not agreed that they should cut a piece of arab land and make it into isreal, and the country wouldn't last long without U.S. protection. I think people here are just wanting the U.S. to let isreal to fend for itself. These people are drunk, because its obvious that isreal would be gone within 10 years if it were left on its own.

 

[Eli]

Israel can survive even without US support. Nuclear detterence is enough.
But the economy will be pretty sucky.

 

[allan]

"Out of interest, would you say William Shakespeare was racist with 'The Merchant Of Venice'? Shylock did get the best lines......"

Not to diminish the man's literary genious (very influential to the English language itself)--I LOVE Shakespeare's plays--but yes, he was reflecting the racist views of many of his English and European contemporaries about the Jews.

None of our heroes are perfect....

 

[G-Man]

Originally posted by jon78
com'n listen to yourself...

I know that orthodox jews in israel thinks that the the palestinians didn't live there until after the state of Israel was founded. this is really the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

I am not going into a debate in whoever has the "proper right" to the land itself. who cares? why can't you live in israel unless you're jewish? isn't that so? isn't THAT racist?

I have jewish relatives so I have nothing against you ppl, it's just that your treatment of the palestinian ppl aggrevates me. why don't give them 10% of their original land back and end the entire conflict.

It's not the opinion of orthodox jews at all.

I have many muslim and christian arabs friends. I never noticed any form of descrimination towards them, not from the goverment nor from the citizens.

What is the Palestinian's original land? There are Palestinians in any country between Libya and Iraq. It doesn't mean they own this land. They gave up their original land in order to kill us. When we offered them a lot of it back they took it and used these ares as bases for terrorists.

Isreal would not be a country today if the U.N. had not agreed that they should cut a piece of arab land and make it into isreal, and the country wouldn't last long without U.S. protection. I think people here are just wanting the U.S. to let isreal to fend for itself. These people are drunk, because its obvious that isreal would be gone within 10 years if it were left on its own.

The UN didn't help Israel the slightest in it's entire history. They can say whatever they want, but the fact is that the arabs attacked us, we won, therefore we have a country.
Israel survived it's toughest wars without US support. We can create supperior planes (Lavi, Arye) hand guns (Tavor) and anything else our army needs. The American goverment gives Israel support that can be used only in order to buy American productes and in return Israel supports US interests. Didn't we give up the Falcon sale to China? Didn't Israel give the US a captured Mig-21, that allowed your airforce to check it out and save many American lives? Didn't Israel give you the captured soviet radar from Egypt? During the gulf war, did Israel retaliated to the Iraqi attacks or did we allowed the US to keep it's coalition intact?

 

[VoodooAce]

Originally posted by rmsharpe
Of course, George Bush is smart enough not to follow that UN crap.

Bet you wish you'd have phrased that one differently.

Or did you actually MEAN to write that?

 

[LaRo]

I think it's the wrong place to talk about it.
Or maybe later, you could build a scenario based on this.

 

[CrayonX]

Anyhow, getting back on topic...

I remember reading about something similar happen when the Black Plague was spreading all over centuries ago, and several ruling parties (religious and political) claimed it was the Jews that were spreading it and issued edicts to 'shut their borders' and 'kill them all'.

Pretty sad how things still haven't changed. Countries end up shutting doors to protect their own interests, political, religious, economical, or otherwise. (think Pakistan shutting borders to Afghan refugees).

If a Taliban-like regime suddenly took power in, say, Mexico, how fast would the U.S. shut their doors to immigrants?

 

[jon78]

you deny it even though you say it yourself.

you really think there was no ppl living in Israel before the sionistic movement?

I know several orthodox jews in Israel who claims the Palestinian ppl is a hoax. they say that they are arabs from other countries claiming to have lived in Israel and only claim their palestinian nationality because they hate jews.

however, according to several orthodox schools in New York, the jews should stay the hell out of Israel. according to them, Israel doesn't belong to the jews anymore.

now, I have no problem with either. the problem I have is that the Israelis think that the land belongs to THEM. that _IS_ racist.
if a swede told a serb or turk that sweden belongs to the swedes everybody would say that he / she is racist. and I would agree. if a JEW says Israel belongs to the JEWS everybody seem to agree, just because the jews have had a hard time throughout history. say that to the native american indians and they'll probably scalp you.

or the gypsies which had a much larger percentage of their population killed during hitlers european tour than the jews. or the ukrainians which still has the world number number one serial killer percentage as a result of the nazi 20 million slaughter of their ppl.

and it was NO international decision that the state of Israel should exist. it was a result of a jewish terrorist group called the grey wolves (filled with nazi collaborators, working under support from Hitler during WW2 in moving jews to Israel, away from Europe). after WW2, Britain was broke and on the brink of communistic revolution. as a result most brittish colonies went soverign, and the state of Israel was claimed in the ruins of the former brittish colony, funded by different sionistic movements.