Scenario Idea: Renaissance Italy

[chomsky]

Hi. I'm want to make a scenario about the competing city-states of renaissance Italy. I'm posting to this gauge interest and to get some input.

The scenario will be set in the 14th-15th centuries

Here's a list of city-states I'd like to include:
The Patrimony of St. Peter
Siena
Florence
Ferrara
Modena
Lucca
Genoa
Milan
Mantua
Venice
Savoy
Kingdom of the Two Sicilies

Monterrat, Asti, and Saluzzo could be included too. Would it be better to have Naples and Sicily as two separate powers? Any thoughts? Thanks.

 

[GRM7584]

I'd certainly be interested in it, if only for the immense amount of cultural importance packed into the area and time period; there are quite a few 'renaissance' style cities that would look perfect for it as well, I think one of them even has a little Cathedral Dome of Florence.

 

[MaisseArsouye]

You could add Piemonte, Bologna, Parma. If you have a free place, you might add Sardegna.

Historically, it would be better to let Sicilia and Napoli together, but its gonna be a monster compared to small northern civs ! That's a choice between history and gameplay.

 

[Rufus T. Firefly]

The problem with the idea is that Italy was formed by cities-states in this period, then it will be more difficult to do a good game with civilization with 2-3 cities.

 

[Plotinus]

Certainly could be interesting.

You might like to have a look at the Merchant of Venice scenario that's somewhere in the Scenarios forum.

 

[Neonanocyborgasm]

I actually made a scenario of this some time ago, but never uploaded it because it was never finished. I'd be happy to hand it over to you, as long as you give me credit.

My scenario had 9 factions, including Milan, Venice, Papal States, Florence, Siena, Genoa, Ferrara, Savoy, and the Kingdom of the Two Sicilies.

I finished the city placement, created the factions, set up the leader names, most of the military and scientific great leaders. The tech tree isn't altered and the units are the same as generic C3C. I imagine they should be changed, but I didn't know anything about Italian Renaissance units.

Let me know if you're interested.

 

[Kubz]

I thought of this scenario a long time ago. Ther would be some cool wonders- The Staue of David, The Mona Lisa, ect.

 

[GRM7584]

Bump. Rather than making a new thread:
I am starting work on a new scenario along these lines, since it suddenly seemed interesting to me. Starting in 1284 immediately after the ceding of Sicily to Aragon (and a smattering of other events)...and going until 1527 with the sack of Rome.
Unplayable civs:
-Holy Roman Empire (Unconquerable cities, locked alliance against the Papal States)
-The Papal States (Tough, locked alliance against HRE)
-France/Dauphine (not sure which one to call it; mostly unconquerable cities/nuisance)
-The Ottoman Empire (late-game invader, will make appearance in Balkans)
-Aragon (controlling all of Sicily, general nuisance)
-Switzerland (Unconquerable cities, source for tradeable 'swiss mercs' resource)
-Bosnia (fodder)
-Croatia (fodder)
-Epirus (fodder)
-Hungary (Unconquerable cities, nuisance for Venice)

The playable 'Italian' city-states:
-Florence (Medici)
-Mantua
-Savoy
-Venice
-Verona
-Genoa
-Pisa
-Naples
-Corsica
-Sardinia
-Milan
-Siena
-Lucca
-Este (Modena and Ferraro)

I will probably use artists as resources for building cultural works, where the artists become available at reasonable points in time by the tech tree. To control tech progression and remove the possibility of absurd player tech-profiting I will likely make most/all techs non-tradeable.
I would like to have mercenaries recruitable by resource, but I only know about Landsknechts and Swiss Mercenaries; any suggestions as to other groups of mercenaries I could make available?
Also: I don't look forward terribly much to making the necessary map of Italy and surroundings for this, although I probably will anyway. Is there a good-looking one sitting around?

 

[lifeaquatic]

I would be willing to help with this since it interests me as well. However only on the condition that there will be no terrain mod posted with the game. I say if people like terrain mods they can add them to the default.

 

[Gagliaudo]

Hi. I'm want to make a scenario about the competing city-states of renaissance Italy. The scenario will be set in the 14th-15th centuries

I am starting work on a new scenario along these lines, since it suddenly seemed interesting to me. Starting in 1284 immediately after the ceding of Sicily to Aragon (and a smattering of other events)...and going until 1527 with the sack of Rome.

Godd idea, guys!
1284 is a good start year, even for battle of Meloria (Genova ends the Pisa's naval greatness), and for early development of "Vespro" war in Sicilia between Aragona and Anjou...

STANGERS: (some could be playable, IMHO)
-Holy Roman Empire (not yet absburgic in 1284...)
-Provence (family of Anjou)
-The Ottoman Empire (late-game invader, will make appearance in Balkans)
-Swiss Cantons
-Croatia (to Hungary?)
-Epirus (Byzantine)
-Hungary
-Austria (family of Hapsburg)

ITALIAN STATES ("SIGNORIE") AND CITY-STATES ("COMUNI")
-Patrimonium Sancti Petri (Patrimonio di San Pietro)
-Firenze (f. of Medici)
-Mantova (Gonzaga)
-Piemonte (Savoia)
-Venezia
-Verona (Della Scala)
-Genova
-Pisa
-Lucca
-Siena
-Napoli (Anjou/Angiò)
-Sicilia (Aragòn/Aragona): in 1284 they could start with Palermo, Messina and some other Sicilian island.
-Corsica (to Genova)
-Sardegna (first divided Pisa/Genova, then divided in 4 free "giudicati")
-Milano (Visconti, from 1450 Sforza)
-Ferrara (Este)
-Urbino (Montefeltro)
-Monferrato
-Saluzzo (very little)
-Padova (Da Carrara)

Landsknechts and Swiss Mercenaries: good, I'd add the "Compagnie di ventura" leaded by the "Condottieri".

 

[GRM7584]

Its good to see someone with perhaps a bit more knowledge agrees with most of my choices; I will try to use more appropriate spellings for the Italian States, but I'm only familiar with the Modern English variations.
I have done a little more investigation, and I've decided to divide up mercenaries into 6 categories:
-Italian Mercenaries, consisting of the vast majority of available types, and used herein as the "base/generic" unit.
-French Mercenaries, one unit
-Greek Mercenaries, one unit and dromon (to reflect byzantine heritage, as these will only be present in Epirus and perhaps Bosnia)
-Spanish Mercenaries, Almogavares
-Swiss Mercenaries, one unit and "advanced" type, Swiss Guard.
-German Mercenaries, Landsknecht and "advanced" type, Doppelsoeldner

Condottiera will not be a unit; to make note of them I am renaming Armies to Condotta.

Hungary exerts significant influence over both Bosnia and Croatia, which are at the time semi-independent. However, Venice also exerts significant influence over both and acquired a number of cities from both without incurring Hungary's wrath, so both Bosnia and Croatia will be their own 'civs' for my purposes. I'm not as sure about the HRE and the divisions thereof. Maybe Austria should be included, after all...
Provence was a third consideration for France/Dauphine; if that fits the scenario better, I will use it.

The naval engagement of meloria is one of several events that contributed to the choice of starting date; it gives more character and urgency to the scenario for Pisa, which will start with a navy in tatters and faltering influence.
Speaking of navies, I'm unsure of the naval upgrade tree. I currently have
Galliot -> Galley -> Galleass -> Carrack -> Man-o-War
with Dromons as a side unit, something of an early superior Galliot. Suggestions?

 

[Gagliaudo]

Condottiera will not be a unit; to make note of them I am renaming Armies to Condotta.
The naval engagement of meloria is one of several events that contributed to the choice of starting date; it gives more character and urgency to the scenario for Pisa, which will start with a navy in tatters and faltering influence.

No matter, "condotta" was the name of the contract between the committant and the "condottiero" = the chieftain of the "compagnia di ventura"

Indeed, Pisa fleet was down, but the city struggled yet for a long time with Firenze

1284 is a good start-year, but, of course, there is only a 16years difference with the begin of 14th century, so @Chomski's project is compatible, too.
You could choose to work together, or to follow two different ways, in EVERY case your works will be something original and - hopefully - good

 

[Kyriakos]

I was thinking of expanding my byzantine map, or rather combining the two maps and adding genoa, and veneto to the north, for a possible byz scenario

 

[Gagliaudo]

hi varwnos, you're everywhere
Good idea , I recall a civ2 scenario ("The 4 Sea Republic") map that was exactly as like as you mean... from Sardegna to MiddleEast. Excellent!

 

[GRM7584]

I'm attempting to do a map for this area, although I'm having some troubles with Corsica and Sardinia for some reason. The map size is a little over 100x100, with a 6w:7h ratio.

 

[Kyriakos]

hi varwnos, you're everywhere

like god, did you miss to see the connection between Kyrie and Kyriakos? (my name)

 

[Gagliaudo]

like god, did you miss to see the connection between Kyrie and Kyriakos? (my name)

in classic greek: "ybris"
in psichological terms: "delirium omnipotentiae"

 

[Kyriakos]

Add a bit of Taedium Vitae, and some Tusis Nervosa as well, and you are there

 

[GRM7584]

What cultural groups should I use? I know precious little about architectural differentiation between the different civs. For all purposes, I currently have:
European Nations
Northern Italy
Southern Italy and Med. Islands
Greek and Slavic
Ottoman

Although I have no clue which graphics to use for each. (I'm sure I'll be using Varwnos', of course )

 

[Kyriakos]

What cultural groups should I use? I know precious little about architectural differentiation between the different civs. For all purposes, I currently have:
European Nations
Northern Italy
Southern Italy and Med. Islands
Greek and Slavic
Ottoman

Although I have no clue which graphics to use for each. (I'm sure I'll be using Varwnos', of course )

Check my "secret thread" for the new byz cities

It depends on your map, if it has the ottomans then it should reach to ankyra (ankara) at least, if it starts in the 14th century anyway, i think that the ottomans reached Macedonia in the end of the 14th century.
You could have culture groups according to religion, and slavs werent really on friendly terms with greeks at that era.