ive been opening double scout settler unless theres a 3 food tile in which case you hit 2 pop the same turn the first scout builds and then its just scout settler honestly i'd prefer scouts to warriors in mplayer for picking off settlers and workers early game
Scout or Warrior?
- Thread starter UWHabs
- Start date
SeerTenedos
Chieftain
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2007
- Messages
- 24
How can there be a 3 page long thread on the consideration between a scout and a warrior without 'line of sight' being dropped once.. a scout with los promo is a big deal. Scouts are good for scouting, and with a promo like los can often avoid confrontation entirely there on out.
Having said that, when a game starts I often decide things like 'this game I am going to tear into whoever is beside me before he knows what hits him' and I will go 2x warrior. Other games I think 'lets take a look see' and go for a scout first. I will also look at my starting terrain and try to determine what turn I will want my worker out if I am feeling indecisive.
Anyone who says a warrior can scout better than a scout is wrong, and anyone who is using a scout for taking out barb huts is misusing the scout imo.
Having said that, when a game starts I often decide things like 'this game I am going to tear into whoever is beside me before he knows what hits him' and I will go 2x warrior. Other games I think 'lets take a look see' and go for a scout first. I will also look at my starting terrain and try to determine what turn I will want my worker out if I am feeling indecisive.
Anyone who says a warrior can scout better than a scout is wrong, and anyone who is using a scout for taking out barb huts is misusing the scout imo.
MasterMishi
Warlord
- Joined
- Jan 16, 2011
- Messages
- 251
warrior
settler spam settle on resource
warriors in new cities
get a worker once you have the improvement tech or buy it with first 220 gold/ steal from city state/ all of the above
settler spam settle on resource
warriors in new cities
get a worker once you have the improvement tech or buy it with first 220 gold/ steal from city state/ all of the above
Bibor
Doomsday Machine
My answer to these questions: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtA_mlM5fbs
From 4:30 to to 5:00 as well as from 9:10 to 9:20 and again from 12:55 to 13:10
From 4:30 to to 5:00 as well as from 9:10 to 9:20 and again from 12:55 to 13:10
I usually build a scout (rarely more than 1). Then I try to double team barbarians with the warrior and scout, giving both experience. If possible I get the scout to 30xp and +1 sight/+1 move before it pops a ruin to give it archery. The downside is the time it takes for them to heal after each battle with barbarians.
I usually do both. On marathon I won't build a scout because AI beats you to any huts anyway.
1. Explore with warrior
2. Build scout and explore with both
3. Later build another warrior or preferably horse unit if possible. Might build a scout if the surrounding lands seem relatively empty
1. Explore with warrior
2. Build scout and explore with both
3. Later build another warrior or preferably horse unit if possible. Might build a scout if the surrounding lands seem relatively empty
Randall Turner
King
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2011
- Messages
- 679
Someone mentioned not building scouts if they're playing as Songhai, I'd note that if you're going to make barb-hunting a major part of your strategy (ie, keep doing it late) that the AI is getting pretty good at kill-stealing, especially from bowmen and scout-archers. (You can usually depend on one scout-archer.)
I buddy-up a scout with something, warrior, archer, earlier chariot, something. Too many situations where the AI will kill-steal if I don't. (and quite often the scout can KS from the AI.)
I buddy-up a scout with something, warrior, archer, earlier chariot, something. Too many situations where the AI will kill-steal if I don't. (and quite often the scout can KS from the AI.)
Udey1
Prince
Isn't this like the third post on this argument? Or is it the same zombie post rising again and again from the grave?
Goodenuf
Warlord
Scouts are very cool when they get upgraded to Archers
And for this reason, I go Scouts. The ability to move and shoot in a forest against Barbs is invaluable
Airey
Prince
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2008
- Messages
- 509
Advantage of a Scout is well documented in the 3 pages...
Some advantage of early 2nd Warrior
- able to "rescue" CS worker captured in Barbarian camps
- free the worker would allow early CS ally (friendly)
- increase power rating to decrease chance of Super Early DOWs from aggressive neighbour (ie. Alex, Caesar, Wu)
It all depends on how you use the initial warrior.
Usually I use my 1st warrior for scouting. And that's faster than building a scout since it starts on turn Uno.
Build a 2nd warrior for "homeland" defense. Will not be as fast capturing the 1st worker as building them first, but will catch up by capturing multiple workers soon after.
I don't really like to take "military upgrade" difference into the argument. Because Spearman can be upgrade to Pike much earlier and can be more powerful than Archer at much earlier time frame if tech sequence is planned correctly. As oppose to Crossbowman. Especially considering how early Horsemen are available. Archer is vulnerable to get picked off.
The earliest 1st DOW is usually with Swordsman. 1 extra Archer (upgraded from Scout) does not determine the outcome of the war. It doesn't change if that initial unit is a spearman/pikeman or an archer.
Some advantage of early 2nd Warrior
- able to "rescue" CS worker captured in Barbarian camps
- free the worker would allow early CS ally (friendly)
- increase power rating to decrease chance of Super Early DOWs from aggressive neighbour (ie. Alex, Caesar, Wu)
It all depends on how you use the initial warrior.
Usually I use my 1st warrior for scouting. And that's faster than building a scout since it starts on turn Uno.
Build a 2nd warrior for "homeland" defense. Will not be as fast capturing the 1st worker as building them first, but will catch up by capturing multiple workers soon after.
I don't really like to take "military upgrade" difference into the argument. Because Spearman can be upgrade to Pike much earlier and can be more powerful than Archer at much earlier time frame if tech sequence is planned correctly. As oppose to Crossbowman. Especially considering how early Horsemen are available. Archer is vulnerable to get picked off.
The earliest 1st DOW is usually with Swordsman. 1 extra Archer (upgraded from Scout) does not determine the outcome of the war. It doesn't change if that initial unit is a spearman/pikeman or an archer.
Civsassin
Immortal
I don't typically put out a second scout right away, and I use my warrior to scout around the city limits. I favor the second warrior usually, especially if I meet an early / close rival. I will often build two in rapid succession to get the power rating up.
Johan511
Old Schooler
Scout before Warrior, there are unique exceptions of course, but usually your gonna be good going with the scout.
RD-BH
Human
Scout.
Barbs can be seen from distance and avoided.
Move scouts one tile at a time, they are worth more alive than dead.
The sooner you find AIs, CSs, and NWs the more value they have.
Barbs can be seen from distance and avoided.
Move scouts one tile at a time, they are worth more alive than dead.
The sooner you find AIs, CSs, and NWs the more value they have.
Steelyglint
Warlord
I normally build a monument first, 'cause it's such a massive relative increase on your culture, and it means that I can get the free worker and settler from Liberty more speedily.
After that I do a worker. Then, two scouts unless I'm on a water map, in which case it's case-sensitive. All other situations are case-sensitive.
My strategy is probably rather different to everyone else's because I play with no barbs. I try to delay military unit-building as much as possible (not 0 units, but the bare minimum) until I can build an armoury in my Capital, until which time I am normally safe from other Civs.
Welcome to the forum Steelyglint
This strategy to build monument first is good if your focus is cultural victory or the map you are playing is archipelago,where the chance of meeting another civilization or even a city state is very low. With June/July patch, building a monument first will be the first priority of many players,since first social policies are cheaper and more important to support a wide empire.
Misterboy
Modern Major General
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2010
- Messages
- 244
For me it's highly dependent up Civ and strategy, but I must say I go with a scout first nearly all of the time.
Unlike others, I don't have too much trouble keep my scout alive, even on Emp/Im/Diety. Sometimes you get unlucky, but I manually scout early on and use the terrain carefully. They often pop into Archers, and as other have pointed out, they become quite powerful.
Some have suggested that warriors scout just as quickly if you use the terrain carefully. While I agree that can help, I find that scouts consistently uncover more territory and therefore meet CSs and Goody Huts more often.
First warrior scouts until the real scout pops out. Then arc that warrior around, continuing to scout with him while bringing him back in time to protect the worker that comes next (if I don't go with a monument first).
Unlike others, I don't have too much trouble keep my scout alive, even on Emp/Im/Diety. Sometimes you get unlucky, but I manually scout early on and use the terrain carefully. They often pop into Archers, and as other have pointed out, they become quite powerful.
Some have suggested that warriors scout just as quickly if you use the terrain carefully. While I agree that can help, I find that scouts consistently uncover more territory and therefore meet CSs and Goody Huts more often.
First warrior scouts until the real scout pops out. Then arc that warrior around, continuing to scout with him while bringing him back in time to protect the worker that comes next (if I don't go with a monument first).
I usually go Scout, Scout, Monument, Warrior, Warrior.
Scouts are good for, well, scouting, so it helps you get to goody huts, city states and other Civs sooner than a warrior will. Of course, I scout with my starting warrior too, just only in the local vicinity, so I can get him back in case a barb comes to visit.
Usually there is a small window of opportunity before all goody huts are gone, so anything that maximizes your chance of getting to them before the AIs do is very beneficial. A Culture hut, or two can make a big positive impact upon your start and subsequently the rest of the game.
Meeting City States first gives you extra cash and early on this is important. Likewise, the sooner you find the AIs the sooner you can sell them your lux and ultimately turn their cash against them. You also need to scout to find the good local city placements which have the lux.
All in all, scouts can make a big difference.
I've beat the AIs to goody huts by one move on several occasions. I'd of had no chance with a normal warrior. Even if you get a map, or one of the less useful bonuses, you're stopping the AIs getting the goody hut and on their turn they may of got something really good.
If I play large maps (which I often do) I'll sometimes get three scouts out before anything else.
Scouts are good for, well, scouting, so it helps you get to goody huts, city states and other Civs sooner than a warrior will. Of course, I scout with my starting warrior too, just only in the local vicinity, so I can get him back in case a barb comes to visit.
Usually there is a small window of opportunity before all goody huts are gone, so anything that maximizes your chance of getting to them before the AIs do is very beneficial. A Culture hut, or two can make a big positive impact upon your start and subsequently the rest of the game.
Meeting City States first gives you extra cash and early on this is important. Likewise, the sooner you find the AIs the sooner you can sell them your lux and ultimately turn their cash against them. You also need to scout to find the good local city placements which have the lux.
All in all, scouts can make a big difference.
I've beat the AIs to goody huts by one move on several occasions. I'd of had no chance with a normal warrior. Even if you get a map, or one of the less useful bonuses, you're stopping the AIs getting the goody hut and on their turn they may of got something really good.
If I play large maps (which I often do) I'll sometimes get three scouts out before anything else.
