Semi-Noob needs some advice from warmongers

[*/SpaceRace\*]

Hi, I'm in a helluva lot of trouble getting from warlord to noble, and here's the basic reason why in my opinion. (I play warlords.)

Whenever I play, I go in with a mindset that I think is holding me back from really winning the game in any short amount of time. I always go in to build a civilization, to create a few wonders (I think I have a slight case of the Wonder bug), and above all create tons of civic improvments. My dream civics are all the bottom ones, except for one, which is state property. Whenever I get the chance and I'm at peace, which I try to maintain for as long as possible, I crank out Improvments, Wonders (mostly late-game, which If I survive to, I'm the dominant force due to my Improvments), Settlers (if there's any land), Workers, and then Troops. I'm a peacemonger.

I come to you wanting to turn this around completely. I want to know how to rush without screwing up my economy (major thing scaring me away from being a warmonger, and messing up my game for doing that, as once I start the wonder/improvement path I don't really want to stop), which improvments I ought to be doing to keep my military lead, etc. Please, If there are any of you with this kind of knowledge, I'd really appreciate it. Thanks for readin' this .

Oh yea, PS, I usually play Pangaea mapz, and I can sufficiantly (with the bonuses on warlord) outproduce the enemies, except now that I've moved on to noble, I always fall behind in tech., military, improvments, everything >.<. I've had 2 losses on noble and no wins, and on warlord, 5 wins, no losses. Ty again!

 

[InvisibleStalke]

For starters, don't build any wonders except National wonders. None. Wean yourself off them.

Improvements -to begin with only build barracks, granaries and courthouses except for your capital. The rest of the time build troops.

Play as an aggressive leader.

Settle only 3-4 cities yourself. Take the rest in war.

Attack with overwhelming force and take or raze every enemy city before stopping. With 3 cities you can raise an army of 12 axemen in only 12 turns or so. So do it - then go stomping through the enemy archers.

Have your workers build lots of cottages around your capital to help pay for the war.

Let your commerce slider drop as far as it needs to in order to finish the war as long as:
1) You have the Code of Laws tech and can build courthouses to bring it back up again eventually.
2) You are winning the war and capturing cities steadily.
3) War weariness is not a problem.
4) You don't reach zero&#37; science and risk strikes.

20% science is no big deal if you just captured 8 good cities. Once they get to work your economy will bounce back.

Wars should be fast and brutal. Nothing wrecks your economy more than a slow drawn out war that doesn't go anywhere.

Bribe allies to help you and keep tech trading with allies to keep the tech flowing.

Consider setting up the first enemy capital you take as a GP farm for later GP production. Use these GPs to lightbulb techs to trade.

Alternate periods of short brutal war with periods of rebuilding and fast teching.

Try to destroy one opponent before catapults. Another after catapults and a third with macemen.

Prioritize construction and early catapults in your tech path. Consider having half your army as catapults.

 

[*/SpaceRace\*]

First off I'd like to thank you so much for taking the time to help me out here. Greatly appreciated!

However, I do have a few questions that I hope you could just quickly clear up for me

Improvements -to begin with only build barracks, granaries and courthouses except for your capital.

What should I build in my Capital then? does this mean no improv, or more improvs.?

The rest of the time build troops. Settle only 3-4 cities yourself. Take the rest in war.

I assume that in the beginning I should build a few settlers+workers, correctamundo?

Consider setting up the first enemy capital you take as a GP farm for later GP production. Use these GPs to lightbulb techs to trade.

Where can I get a decent explanation of how to create and excellent GP farm?

Prioritize construction and early catapults in your tech path. Consider having half your army as catapults.

Ok, but does this imply that I should be done before Trebuches? Eek! I don't think I can manage that one! Or does that mean just for the early years, and I should continue having artillery/siege weapons as half my army for quite a while? Also, what are the best garrison troops? archer-longbow-gunpowder seems logical, but I was just wondering. How many units should I garrison per city, too?

Finally, if half of my army is possibly artillery, do you have any thoughts on what the other half should be? Like, 40&#37; of my best offensive troops, then my best defensive should make up 10% (for garrisoning and protection against the occassionally counterstrike if I mess up and I'm not quick enough)?

 

[InvisibleStalke]

1. In your capital you will build more - things like libraries, universities etc. Eventually you will specialise some other good commerce cities and build these kind of improvements there too, but initially you should aim on getting military cities up and building a lot of troops since that seems to be your problem.

2. Right - you can't build those cities without settlers. And you'll need 2-3 workers. You can use them to help chop out an army too.

3. There are some strategy articles on this. Basically all you need is a food rich city and put in all the buildings that allow you to run specialists. Library first, Forges, markets, temples etc depending on what GP you want. Build national epic there. Usually the food rich sites are your capital and enemy capitals.

4. If you have a big enough army you don't need strong garrisons, except on the border you are fighting - other AIs will be deterred if you are #1 in power (except Monty and I would be careful with Isabella too if you don't share her religion). Generally most cities would have a single warrior or archer. My border cities would be stronger with 2-3 units, more if I thought there was a real danger. Typically border cities would have an axe, a spear and a catapult or similar.

You can continue with artillery as half your army right through until the late game. Upgrade to cannons and artillery later. Probably I should have said as half of your attacking army - not counting garrison troops.

I doubt you will be done before Trebs, but you might well have destroyed a couple of AIs by then and be #1 in tech and power.

Let consider a couple of attacking stacks:

- Early rush

6 City Raider axes
1 Spear - combat 1 - promote to medic when you can.
1 axe - combat 1 - promote to shock when you can.
2 other units - archers / spears etc that can be left to garrison captured cities. Keep building CR1 axes to replace losses.

Later when you have catapults:
- 5 CR 1 cats - take down walls and attack in the third wave to wipe out remainders. Promote to accuracy.
- 2 barrage cats - attack first
- 3 CR 1 swords - second wave - kill toughest defenders
- 2 spears - stack defense and garrison.
- 2 axes - stack defense and garrison.
- medic unit (chariots are great, but anything will do)
- 2-3 garrison troops that can be left.
- Build mix of garrison, swords and catapults for replacement.

To begin with have just one attacking stack.

 

[InFlux5]

I think you might find this thread very helpful:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=168739

Also, look over the articles in the War Academy:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?f=156

You many find many of them helpful as well.

 

[*/SpaceRace\*]

Thanks so much! I'll start a new game following your help asap!

However I do have one more question, If you can help me out just one more time.

How long should I take to create my first 3-4 cities+give them the basic 3 improvements b4 I attack? I think the AI starts to attack stuff around 2500 B.C., so before or around then, right? or is it another date, or is there no specific date and i've got it completely wrong?

TY so much man, TY!

 

[InvisibleStalke]

The AI usually won't attack you until it runs out of places to settle - thats usually much later than 2500 BC. You will be doing very well to have three cities before 2000BC.

There isn't a hard and fast rule on this. Sometimes you can gain by taking an enemy capital very quickly - after building your second city. But if they aren't that close I'll usually let them grow cities closer to me before I attack. This really depends on the distance to the AIs, when your unique unit comes and what military resources you have available.

Also its good to leave an industrious leader alone until you get to catapults - you might pick up several wonders that way.

 

[JesusOnEez]

Here's something else you might want to try. It's something I've known about but not tried until a couple of games ago.

A recent game I had I decided to try a different strategy. I never build a Warrior first...ever. So I decided to do just that whilst my first warrior explored in a circular pattern.

By the time the warrior is built, you may have found a civilization or two. If not, keep exploring until you do (hopefully you're not isolated).

When you come across a border (this early it should be a capital) search around to see if there are any resources (wheat, rice, blah) in the border and sentry next to it...if you see a worker even better. Do the same with the second warrior if another civilizations' capital has been found.

As soon as your warrior is next to a worker, declare war, steal it and escort it back to your capital (which has in the meantime built a worker anyway).

If you can get one, great..two even better.

Now you can rapidly improve your capital while the civs you've stolen a worker from stagnates while they build another one.

In the meantime, you've improved your food tiles and rapidly build population, you've also settled or at least are nearly ready to settle a city near copper or iron. Chop out a settler but either way, it's key to get settled near the copper iron as soon as possible.

Got your copper and iron hooked up? Good, you've also research the wheel and built roads to connect your iron or copper? Good.

Chop, whip, build plains hill mines...anything to knock out as many Swords/Axes as possible in as short a time as possible. I went for four CR swords and a couple of combat axes...although a spear wouldn't go amiss if you can get one in. Send them to the nearest capital and take it...they may have a few archers but you'll have no problems.

If they've managed to get their second city out, raze it (gaining CR 2 promotions with any luck) and go on to the capital with your more experienced units.

The first game I used this tactic, I'd destroyed two civilizations and thus owned three capital standard cities (including my own) by 1000BC. I'd also build a city or two of my own. I had however, isolated myself which may not have been the best move but I feel the three great cities this early made up for the lack of tech trading until Optics.

The second game I destroyed one (protective) civ with a lovely capital.

While you are partaking in these inital battles, your workers are building infrastructure to help your economy get back on track. Roads, improvements, cottages. You don't need to build any more than a few units and then infrastructure to recover while they are away getting you nice cities.

What then? Well, that's up to you...I'm not going to tell you how to play the whole game, but this is as good a start as (m)any.

My general rule of thumb for this tactic is to produce units whilst at peace, then war and PRIMARILY build infrastructure (whilst building back-up units in one or two high production cities).

Wonders? Ignore them. They divert you from going to war (unless you've got a dead cert at getting one). Some of the later game ones are handy and you should be able to get them given your huge tech lead from using this tactic!

 

[bluedevil99]

Another thing to try is playing a leader with a good early UU. Hatty or Cyrus are absolute monsters on Pangea maps, as early War Chariots/Immortals will reach enemy cities fast and eat archers for breakfast. It's easy to build a 1-2 of them early, send them out to find an AI capital and steal a worker, then come back in a few turns with enough of them to take the city. The key is you can churn them out quickly and they get there fast, so the AI has a lot less time to spam archers.