SGFN-06: Skull session - what next?

[anaxagoras]

We're getting quite a lineup here. Great! I'm out of my comfort zone at DG, but I wouldn't mind trying a non-optimal Civ. I'm not sure I want to also add alternative governments and other restrictions. Maybe if we whip this one, we can do that next time. I'm fine with pretty much any landforms and map size, though I'm not entirely crazy about arid maps. I prefer random opponents, personally, but I'll go with the flow.

 

[Elephantium]

I want to see what you come up with for SGFN-06, so here's my subscription post. Whatever it turns out to be, good luck!

You can subscribe without posting, you know

I've never been in an SG (but read some) and would like to try.

My history: Emperor/DG level player; usually play agri civs (Mayan or Sumeria); VC is always conquest; played some huge maps but have lately stuck with standard map (pangea or conts, never arch); only wonders are ToE and Hoover, but I've done JS Bach a couple times; usually do republic sling-shot, tried monarch a few times; leave culture-flips 'on'; set barbs to sedintary.

If people think conts is too easy, how about an arch map? Pangea is so boring (send two boats in opposite directions and eventually you meet everyone). Plus, pangea eliminates the need for navy and air force. I would think arch would make the game tougher because you can't just sit back and rex your way through the AA. I'd also like to try a gov't other than republic or monarchy - maybe fascism or communism. Also like to try a tier-3 civ instead of a powerhouse civ. A non-agri civ would be a nice change. But, whatever the group decides......

Archipelago is the easiest map setting, actually. Since the AI never uses suicide boats, you can meet everyone in the AA and set up a dominant position long before the AI gets to caravels.

 

[TheOverseer714]

Lots of interest, excellent! I see that the non-variant DG level, Space is winning out, at least for this round. I would probably not go any bigger than large map, maybe Continents would be the best compromise on world-type, also. Sedentary or roaming barbs might be a good choice also. I think Korea, England, and France are my idea of somewhat fresh civs(read: not over-played) that aren't Ag and have fairly decent trait combos. I don't know about the 3rd tier civs, they are bad for a reason, you watch the Aggies and The Ind tribes eat them up game after game. However, I think the tribe choice should be a team decision, so I rule nothing out. I guess it's time to open that area up for discussion: Who do you want to play as?

 

[anaxagoras]

I haven't played as England in a long time. I'd be happy with any of the Civs that you mention, but I would find the Brits particularly appealing. I'd vote for Roaming barbs. That's the default setting, and it would be nice to think we could beat a "typical" game.

 

[Optional]

I once read that England is one of the lesser played civs for Spaceship games in the Hall of Fame, which I find surprising; I think their traits are excellent for Spaceship.
Although I don't have a preference for landmass type, choosing England would swing it for me towards Continents. Well, maybe Archipelago, but Pangaea wouldn't allow your Seafaring trait and Man-O-War to shine much.

 

[Delphi456]

England sounds good. I vote for arch over cont. I hate barbs but wouldn't mind Roaming - to spice things up.

 

[Aabraxan]

You can subscribe without posting, you know

lurker's comment: You know that you're a smart-aleck, right?

 

[Elephantium]

<snooty voice>I prefer the term 'smartephant'</snooty voice>

 

[PrinceMyshkin]

I once read that England is one of the lesser played civs for Spaceship games in the Hall of Fame, which I find surprising; I think their traits are excellent for Spaceship.
Although I don't have a preference for landmass type, choosing England would swing it for me towards Continents. Well, maybe Archipelago, but Pangaea wouldn't allow your Seafaring trait and Man-O-War to shine much.

Englands traits would make for fine spaceship win, but wouldn't stay at #1 in HoF long against a determined effort to beat it. HoF games rely on early SGL's and all SCI civs have a better chance at those, but in absolute terms the 12+ turns saved on the age change free tech is too much to overcome for a non-SCI tribe.

If I were choosing settings and a civ for the fastest possible Large DG spaceship win, it would be Russia on 60% Pangaea against 6-8 SCI tribes, 5BYO and sedentary barbs. Even on DG, their scouts should pop an early settler, meet every tribe early, pop techs to speed their time through the AA and guarantee the Republic sling-shot. Cheap libs and unis and trading tech with SCI teams at the big picture screen on age change and getting a second-tier free tech to guarantee the tech lead just seals the deal.

Pangaea guarantees a faster tech pace since all the tribes know each other and ultimately you want some help with research with the ai's to get the fastest time. Barbs shouldn't give much trouble on DG as long as we don't have too much space to ourselves, since the ai is likely to whack them for us before they become a problem. Continents would be something of a challenge since resources for the ship could be hard to find and sometimes the other continent gets a big tech lead. An arch map with a seafaring tribe would really make the game much easier than DG, imho.

I'm of course fine with any settings the team chooses, though, but would vote for a large, pangaea against 11 random civs and standard settings regardless of the civ we choose and I've no preference for that. If we wanted to go with England, I'd be fine with that and we would certainly want some MoW's for our GA, but wouldn't want to get carried away with them for fast SS. We want a lot of workers rather than ships eating our unit support as we enter industrial to lay rails asap.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

Not a sign up. But something to consider if you decide to go for space.

This was originally posted by Grey Fox:

6. Opium Barons. Trade and luxury focus, no religious happiness wonders
(ie colliseums ok, no temples, cathedrals or related wonders)
Control the masses with luxuries. Overarching goal is to have as many
luxuries for your cities as you possibly can. Perhaps India as 'Thailand'

 

[Northen Wolf]

I like England for space, but I always prefer pangea instead of continents as once you control continent it is simple to win (AI can't attack you in your own continent). In settings I prefer all (but land mass type/size and barbs) random.

Also, do we still head to republic path or do republic and then change to some less used government again? I liked getting to know facism - this would make game harder as tech speed will slow down (for us) due less commerce per turn.

I'm trying to get my own laptop in next 2 weeks (any suggestions how to pick one?), But I still assume large (one step above standard) is max I can play - waiting 5 mins for one turn is not fun.

 

[Optional]

I like England for space, but I always prefer pangea instead of continents as once you control continent it is simple to win (AI can't attack you in your own continent).

I think you're right about what the usual strategy would be, but this might be tough enough on Demigod. Things that work fine on Emperor don't necessarily work on Demigod anymore, so I think you'll see enough difference from what you're used to.
Like personally, I'm surprised by PrinceMyshkin's remark that a Continents might be tougher, as the AI can develop a tech lead on the other continent. On Demigod you would catch up in no time, I know that from experience, but I don't have experience on Demigod, so this would be new to me.

 

[PrinceMyshkin]

Sorry, I must not have worded that properly. I meant continents can have interesting challenges, but its not tougher than pangaea. England as a seafaring civ should do well on a continents map if we went with them. They would do fine on pangaea also, though, and if we put our heads together I would think this team can handle the challenge. For a good chance at the republic sling-shot on DG, there's no better starting techs than alphabet and pottery on any map-type.

 

[Rodent]

It seems we are going England?

They just smell of Money don't they . We can use the extra cash for rushing in Wars, And speeding peacetime Improvements.

Maybe we would like to get through the AA without any warring.

Their UU is a sea-based one, and an awesome enslavement ability, Archi looks very tempting with them, although continents would be fine

Just offering some food for thought

 

[TheOverseer714]

Archipelago is Englands bread and butter, so that might be too easy. Pangaea might be too hard, the tech pace would be blindingly fast and Seafaring does not work very well on that landform. If we do Pangaea, standard map would be ok, but a large world with 11 opponents might be a little too tough. I'm more for continents on a large world, it allows the tech broker option. I can say England is our tribe, so this is the time to discuss land-form and other settings.

 

[Optional]

In a way, even with a seafaring civ, I really don't mind whether we're going Continents or Pangaea. A Pangaea can still be interesting with England; read Zerksees' post here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=87994&page=2
We could consider 80% water if we're going Pangaea: you'll create lots of coastal towns that way and curraghs will still be quite handy for meeting everyone.
And we can handle a Pangaea if we keep it tight. It'll be a challenge for us, but it's not above our capabilities.

 

[anaxagoras]

One advantage to playing a seafaring civ on a pangea map is that we don't have to watch our backs. We are guaranteed to start on the coast, so we won't be facing a multi-front war right out of the starting blocks. And for a space race game, a high tech rate is good.

Having said this, I stick by my original post on the subject: I'm open to any landform. I wouldn't mind just setting it to random and seeing what we get. I'll go with the consensus pick.

 

[Delphi456]

Sorry to report I won't be able to participate in this SG. RL went into overdrive this weekend.

 

[TheOverseer714]

RL is definitely a problem for SGs, sorry to hear you won't have time to play, Delphi. Hopefully you get enough time to lurk this and see how it goes.

 

[Optional]

It's not so unusual that people hop in and out of an SG. I hope you'll be following us, Delphi, and perhaps be able to play a guest set. Since you haven't played in an SG before, it would perhaps be good to allow yourself a taste of it.

But, with Delphi456 in principle out, does this make our choice for landmass easier, perhaps? I was just about to suggest Arch 60% water, as I think that could have been a decent compromise between what Northen wants and what Delphi wanted, but Archipelago is actually the landmass I fancy least, mainly because of the bigger chance of an isolated start - more boring.

Going 'random' could put us up with 80% Arch with all kinds of thin slithery islands, nah, that's not what we want, is it?

Northen is now the only one with an outspoken opinion, so perhaps we should simply with that opinion, and go Pangaea. We could go 70% water, if we go 80% water, to suit seafaring, I would suggest knocking 2 civs off and leave 10 civs, to avoid overcrowding on the smaller landmass.

I don't want to rush things, but I don't think we're that far off from rolling a couple of starts here?