SGOTM 12 - Ivan

[I. Larkin]

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Maya and Inca do hve bad terrain smayb it is better to take on another oponent with lot of grassland for science farming. I am worried about the safety of former India. We definatly need to send units there.

We could stay on the Egypt island and chose the Dutch, if they haven't recruited the swiss yet. Anyhow we must not break deals for diplo win. Also if we wat to reduce some civs we can start some wars without actually participating. We could declare on a civ and sign MA with all other civs on that island. That we we can be sure the civ we declare on will lose. Also it will weaken the other civs so we can land5-10 turns later and declare on next civ.

If we go to China it's a long way back if some civ makes an error. Can we get some units to block direct acces from Korea and Maya? I'm notaffraid of landings as ai is terrible at that, but they can send stack of 30 swords over land.

When we will have more workers in India we may start irrigation to south. I think Maya may be useful. With RR it is good.
But we can't start war in India now. We defenetly send units there Constantinople will build Caravels and MI to send to India. Also, we may poprush Pickman next turn in Lisbon.
I don't want war with Duch, say. They have easy accsess to us and I do not want Thebes to be damaged.
It is not that long way to China. With Cartage RoP it is 2 turns; for comparison to India 5 turns.
Yes, we can put somthing on Chock points. Explorer, say.
BTW, it may be an idea to unload Exlorer in Egypt and scout to America. I see border south of France.

 

[AutomatedTeller]

I'll check to see if I can figure out what france's 20K date is - I'm not terribly worried - they have a bunch of good culture, but they dont' have copes or Soz, they wont' get newton's and I don't think they will go for shakes, so that's 4 good culture relatively early wonders they wont' have. On the other hand, it *is* deity and research in the IA looks to take a *long* time.

I like the idea of an explorer, btw.

 

[Nitfan]

We can definitely block up by korea but I think the Maya choke point is in their cultural expansion. Are we taking out spain to give to korea or is that low on the list of things to do?

 

[I. Larkin]

We can definitely block up by korea but I think the Maya choke point is in their cultural expansion. Are we taking out spain to give to korea or is that low on the list of things to do?

Maya Ch/P on neitral zone.
Spain war is "low" on the list, but I think to give Spain to France...

 

[nerovats]

Spain is south of Korea right?, then we should keep them alive for now until we can reiforce our cities there. That way we can MA with Spain, if Korea would get frisky, to devide their forces.

Just to make sure people don't forget our other game, I played this morning and got a leader. In that game Niftan is up, Ivan is on deck.

 

[AutomatedTeller]

France's 20K date looks to be in the 1500's or so - it depends a lot on when they built temple/lib/etc.

I'll keep track.

It looks like the best researchers are France (obviously), Persia and Greece - I think we should jump those guys up to education so they get working on banking.

I'm ok with china, but why not go for the Dutch or the Hittites? they are nearby, we can get ROP with Persia easily and they may not be able to, and they are stuck in the middle ages. I'd say inca/maya, but most of our forces are on over by thebes...

There is pretty much no force that worries me if we are playing what is essentially a phony war against AA troops, especially if they are resource deprived. I'd almost be willing to leave Thebes undefended to act as a draw for whoever we go for.
I like the idea of sending an explorer around.

Thebes, btw, gets the lib if we either disband the three units in it, or disband 2 and poprush the rest.

There is no reason right now to disband anything for any reasons besides shields - we are well under our needs.

What do we want constantinople to build? units? ships? heroic epic?

 

[I. Larkin]

1)It looks like the best researchers are France (obviously), Persia and Greece - I think we should jump those guys up to education so they get working on banking.

2) I'm ok with china, but why not go for the Dutch or the Hittites? they are nearby, we can get ROP with Persia easily and they may not be able to, and they are stuck in the middle ages. I'd say inca/maya, but most of our forces are on over by thebes...

3)There is pretty much no force that worries me if we are playing what is essentially a phony war against AA troops, especially if they are resource deprived. I'd almost be willing to leave Thebes undefended to act as a draw for whoever we go for.
4) I like the idea of sending an explorer around.

5) Thebes, btw, gets the lib if we either disband the three units in it, or disband 2 and poprush the rest.

6) There is no reason right now to disband anything for any reasons besides shields - we are well under our needs.

7) What do we want constantinople to build? units? ships? heroic epic?

1) Now persia will ahead, they even can pay for edu. Probably Scandinavia have some money. Give them 25-75 gold before "trade" edu. If they alive, let they be polite...
2) 3)I am not insist on China. I simply see, that it is closest way to combat. Hitties may be a good idea, we may send more troops from Actecs land and give Cities to Persia. Or help with war...
BTW, change Market in Teno for MI. then Pickman.
We may easy arrange MA with Iro and Cartage... But whatever you go declare and form MA naw, at preturn. Get new fur if China.
4)After Pickman in Osaka it may make Explorer. 2Dormons go to China and 1 may make a link...
5) I wrote about it yesterday:

you: disbanding 2 longbows and pop=rushing will give us a lib in thebes.

me: I thought we need 3...
OK, we may wayt 1 turn, disband 1 LB and p-r, (lib in 2)
Or disband 3 LB now and get Lib next turn.
I prefer second, but agree with first.

So, 1 or 3 to disband, not 2 and poprush, it is a losses!
Did you read, that Kyoto may be (2 turns) worker Factory after CORTHOUSE
6) Yes, and only after upgrade, we have money.
7) 2 Ships, and MIs (Micromanage at 21-19 spt) We may need HE for Newton Prebuild.
Workers at Portugal. Bombay CORTHOUSE, it may cut and plant forest to get it sonner.
MMN Delhi to have uni 1 turn sonner.

 

[AutomatedTeller]

I had read it, but I mis-read it thanks for clearing that up with the lib.

I'm not sure we *need* an MA for war if against hittites - in fact, the problem with an MA for leader farming is that the other civ will take most of the combat. We need targets for leader farming...

 

[AutomatedTeller]

hey guys - I haven't gotten to this yet, and I'm going to be out of town and perhaps not able to download to my machine. Can I skip my turn this time around? I don't think we have a solid idea of what we want to do (leader fish? conquer more civs? both?)

 

[nerovats]

Taken another look at save. We're strong compared to: England, Ottomans and Scandinavia. None of these are potentail targets as they are either to far away or strong researchers.
We're weak compared to Spain, Rome and France so we should avoid them as well.

I looked at all civ's also at their current science level and I think Inca is best choice. Sign MA with Otto's and Maya. It will stabalize that island. We can attack from north. With any luck Inca will manage to get Otto's capitol, so we can have that city as well lateron. I think this because they don't have feud yet, but are likely to get it soon. This is also true for Iro's and Carthage, but iro is on wrong side of continent and Cartage already has 3 defense unit. We need pikes in any case as almost all civs have both horses and iron.

We could also go after China to get foothold on that continent. Use same trick as against Egypt and land couple turns after start of war. Should do that against Inca as well.

Agree on Kyoto 2 turn WF.

detail: Delhi can work plain on river in stead of mined BG, give more commerce.

 

[I. Larkin]

hey guys - I haven't gotten to this yet, and I'm going to be out of town and perhaps not able to download to my machine. Can I skip my turn this time around? I don't think we have a solid idea of what we want to do (leader fish? conquer more civs? both?)

Do you want skeep or swap?
So roster may be like
Ivan,
AT
nerovats
Nitfan
glenmetz,

Or Ivan, Nitfan, nerovats, AT, glenmetz?

I may play today/tomorrow...

We have main task as Uni/Courthouse/Newton buildup. + 3 suplimentary military tasks:
1) Leader fishing, 2) Expand to Maya+Rome, 3) Make some AIs stronger. This is a very multi -task...

 

[I. Larkin]

Research parabola update. With Unis and Copernicus "boom" Nitfan and glenmetz have bended it well up.

However, I do not anticipate the same rate of progress in a future.
Our limit before Sanitation will be approximatly 480 bpt (a bit highre with FP, and lower without); it is clear that in IA our recourses will be also limited. Very probably that at IA our bpt level will saturate at about 700 bpt (I will do this calculation later.)
glenmez, how to put "Attached Thumbnails" in between text? (I know, you know)
Egit: thanks, glenmetz, it works!

 

[glenmetz]

If I can't be good for anything else in the game, perhaps I can help Ivan learn how to add an inserted picture into a post.

1st-You'll have to upload your files to CivFanatics or another file hosting website. I prefer the easy upload system here that can be found at:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploader.php

2nd-Upload your file using the easy upload system, and it will take you to a page where you can copy the link as shown below

3rd-Click the picture icon in the reply window. This will bring up a dialog box where you can enter a URL address of a link. Paste the link that you've just copied from the easy up load system.

4th-Click OK, and your image will be inserted into the post

 

[AutomatedTeller]

I will be out of town until thurs night and my ability to play will be low until the weekend. I can play a set over the weekend, though.
I believe we should gift France and Greece, at least, to eduction so they might get banking for us.

My thoughts on HE - we should build it now. It will save us only 6-8 turns to use it as a prebuild, and there is a fair chance that someone will have researched navigation by then, which means we could use magellans' as a prebuild for Newtons if we want to put it in constantinople.

If we put newton's in thebes, we can just use the palace as a prebuild.

 

[glenmetz]

Murphys law states:

As soon as one starts building the HE, 2 leaders will appear within a turn.

But that is a good point AT. But, I think we should get a Lib and Uni up in Thebes first. I think we should put Newtons in Constantinople. Talk about beaker production!!!!!

 

[nerovats]

We're the fastest researchers so ai will not have discovered navigation in time. I'd prefer to keep HE reserved as pre-build, and we need Constantinopel to build units right now.

Is someone gona play? Do we go Inca or China?

 

[I. Larkin]

Well, I played 7 turns and finish China. (Catured Shanghai and Cartage Capture Bejing). BTW Cooruption in Sh 61% (With courthouse).
No losses, but no Leader.
I'd like to play few more turns today. Any advise, where to go next?
My thought is agree with nerovats: dogpit for Inca. (MA with Ottos+ Maya).
Who will play after me? Nitfan or nerovats?

Economy looks as:

City, Size, Shields, Waste, Science, Luxury, Taxes, Corruption, Maintenance, Net Gain, Buildings, Error
Constantinople, 12, 21, 0 %, 114, 0, 0, 0 %, 7, -7, B-TML----U-H, 0 / 0
Teotihuacan, 7, 6, 12 %, 21, 0, 0, 12 %, 3, -3, ----L--A---H, 0 / 2
Osaka, 9, 5, 18 %, 30, 0, 0, 18 %, 6, -6, B---L--A-U-H, 0 / 3
Tenochtitlan, 8, 10, 27 %, 32, 0, 0, 27 %, 6, -6, BG--L--A-U--, 0 / 6
Kyoto, 11, 7, 22 %, 28, 0, 0, 22 %, 7, -7, BG--LC---U-H, 0 / 4
Delhi, 8, 2, 43 %, 32, 0, 0, 43 %, 4, -4, ----L----U-H, 0 / 12
Thebes, 7, 4, 47 %, 31, 0, 0, 47 %, 5, -5, BG--L--A---H, 0 / 18
Bombay, 8, 2, 59 %, 9, 0, 0, 59 %, 1, -1, ----L-------, 0 / 8
Oporto, 4, 2, 71 %, 3, 0, 0, 71 %, 1, -1, ----L-------, 0 / 5
Lisbon, 6, 2, 78 %, 3, 0, 0, 78 %, 4, -4, B---L--A---H, 0 / 5
Shanghai, 5, 2, 61 %, 3, 0, 0, 61 %, 3, -3, B----C-----H, 0 / 5

 

[nerovats]

Depends where troops are. I recon most are now in China so we could take out another civ down there. Reduce it to max of 2 civs. But don't want to wait to long to secure Inca. Probably just see how far we can strech it with units in China, use new units to prepare for Inca.

 

[I. Larkin]

Well, it is "mini stack" of 8 units in former China. My plan was to start Maya next and I transfer some there. But troops from China may go to Inca faster.
Arabs and others in South continent are too strong to start war there...

 

[I. Larkin]

Did we decide who play next? Could we suppose that Niftan? The reason I ask, that I am in "complicated situation" with Inca. If Nitfan skip again after nerovats, I can leave it to nerovats to resolve or try to resolve myself...