SGOTM 19 - Also Sprach Sid

[Doshin]

Shall we renegotiate the Pigs for +1GPT:

Spoiler :

Alternatively, we can cancel the gift in the hopes that Tokugawa will demand we give him some.

 

[kossin]

Tokugawa expansion:

Spoiler :

Makes me a bit nervous.

Can we get some wars started? We could be opportunistic as Duckweed mentioned earlier with some HAs sniping cities.

 

[Duckweed]

Shall we renegotiate the Pigs for +1GPT:

I think the 1GPT is from Copper.

Alternatively, we can cancel the gift in the hopes that Tokugawa will demand we give him some.

Go ahead for that, there's a chance that Toku might offer 0 after cancellation.

Once the border in Const pops, we'll be Toku's LT and hence a war target, that's why I suggested to pull back scouting axes.

 

[Doshin]

No. None of the AI want to declare war.

IIRC, Alex is very easy to bribe. We'd need to get him to Pleased though.

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Tech screen:

Spoiler :

Diplo:

Spoiler :

I've been pulling back the southern Axemen. Shall I use the Scout to spawnbust the Pigs/Wheat site? It is presently on the Desert Hill with one of our Axemen.

Pics of the north:

Spoiler :

^^^^ as I said, the Scout is now on the Desert Hill.

 

[Doshin]

Move:

Northern Axe: 1SW
Axe by City Ruins: 1NW​

Yes?

 

[Duckweed]

Yes, we could delay the scouting a bit and pull the axes back.

 

[Doshin]

Safe on T85.

A barb city spawned by the Sheep/Horse, as it often did in the test save.

 

[Doshin]

I'm not certain about the movement of the SW Axe here:

Spoiler :

I am thinking 1E and then see where the LB moves. If we can avoid the battle, I'll avoid it.

 

[Duckweed]

1N then to Dye Hard through Toku's city.

 

[Doshin]

Hooked up trade routes:

Spoiler :

The Rice by Dye Hard isn't connected, so I will see if I can skip trading the Pigs with Kublai.

Are we good to trade Rice to Huayna and Napoleon?

 

[Doshin]

By the way, Tokugawa has hooked up his own Copper, so we'll need to figure out what we're going to do in terms of Warriors.

Kublai now has Feudalism.

 

[Duckweed]

Do the resource trade and get all the GPT as you see fit. About the copper, any AI lacks it? We should gift copper to Toku for free instead of 1gpt. Not a big deal to produce archers instead as we have quite a few happy resources.

 

[Doshin]

The Copper trade has a few turns left (3 or 4, I think).

When he cancels the trade, and it will fall in your set, immediately renegotiate. Then you can gift it, because Copper will still be on our side of the trade table.

I assume you know how/why to do this, but I bold for emphasis. It's very easy to click "ok" after an AI cancels an agreement.

 

[Doshin]

Uploaded to T88.

The only moves I performed this turn: whip a Granary in Dye Hard and settle Pigs/Wheat.

Construction is available now, if we want it from Kublai:

Spoiler :

Log:

Spoiler :

Here is your Session Turn Log from 800 BC to 675 BC:

Turn 83, 800 BC: You have discovered Horseback Riding!
Turn 83, 800 BC: You have constructed a Courthouse in Sheepish. Work has now begun on Buddhist Missionary.

Turn 84, 775 BC: Buddhism has spread in Dye Hard.
Turn 84, 775 BC: You have discovered Philosophy!
Turn 84, 775 BC: Taoism has been founded in Rice Pudding!

Turn 85, 750 BC: Taoism has spread in Case Départ.
Turn 85, 750 BC: You have trained a Spy in Constantinople. Work has now begun on a Library.

Turn 86, 725 BC: The enemy has been spotted near Thessalonica!
Turn 86, 725 BC: Golden Sands can hurry Settler for 2⇴ with 34ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 14 turns.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Constantinople has grown to size 4.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Sea Horse can hurry Courthouse for 2⇴ with 5ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 12 turns.
Turn 86, 725 BC: You are the worst enemy of Alexander.
Turn 86, 725 BC: The borders of Constantinople are about to expand.
Turn 86, 725 BC: You are the worst enemy of Alexander.
Turn 86, 725 BC: The borders of Constantinople are about to expand.
Turn 86, 725 BC: You are the worst enemy of Alexander.
Turn 86, 725 BC: The borders of Constantinople are about to expand.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Clearing a Forest has created 30 ℤ for Constantinople.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Clearing a Forest has created 30 ℤ for Sheepish.
Turn 86, 725 BC: You are the worst enemy of Alexander.
Turn 86, 725 BC: The borders of Constantinople are about to expand.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Case Départ will grow to size 9 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Rice Pudding will grow to size 7 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Sheepish will grow to size 8 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Constantinople will grow to size 5 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Cornish Cow will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Thessalonica will grow to size 4 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Sea Horse will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Dye Hard will grow to size 2 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Case Départ will grow to size 9 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Rice Pudding will grow to size 7 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Sheepish will grow to size 8 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Constantinople will grow to size 5 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Cornish Cow will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Thessalonica will grow to size 4 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Sea Horse will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Dye Hard will grow to size 2 on the next turn.
Turn 86, 725 BC: Case Départ can no longer work on Heroic Epic. The lost ℤ is converted into 179ℴ!
Turn 86, 725 BC: You have trained a Settler in Golden Sands. Work has now begun on a Library.
Turn 86, 725 BC: The borders of Constantinople have expanded!

Turn 87, 700 BC: The enemy has been spotted near Thessalonica!
Turn 87, 700 BC: The enemy has been spotted near Thessalonica!
Turn 87, 700 BC: Case Départ has grown to size 9.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Rice Pudding has grown to size 7.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Golden Sands can hurry Library for 1⇴ with 17ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 23 turns.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Sheepish has grown to size 8.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Constantinople has grown to size 5.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Constantinople can hurry Library for 1⇴ with 28ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 32 turns.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Cornish Cow has grown to size 3.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Thessalonica has grown to size 4.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Thessalonica can hurry Courthouse for 2⇴ with 17ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 11 turns.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Sea Horse has grown to size 3.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Dye Hard has grown to size 2.
Turn 87, 700 BC: You are the worst enemy of Alexander.
Turn 87, 700 BC: You are the worst enemy of Alexander.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Kublai Khan will trade Horse
Turn 87, 700 BC: You are the worst enemy of Alexander.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Kublai Khan will trade Horse
Turn 87, 700 BC: Golden Sands will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Thessalonica will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Sea Horse will grow to size 4 on the next turn.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Golden Sands will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Thessalonica will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Sea Horse will grow to size 4 on the next turn.
Turn 87, 700 BC: You have trained Buddhist Missionary in Golden Sands. Work has now begun on a Library.
Turn 87, 700 BC: Kublai Khan adopts Vassalage!

Turn 88, 675 BC: The enemy has been spotted near Thessalonica!
Turn 88, 675 BC: Case Départ will become unhappy on the next turn.
Turn 88, 675 BC: Golden Sands has grown to size 3.
Turn 88, 675 BC: Golden Sands can hurry Library for 1⇴ with 17ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 22 turns.
Turn 88, 675 BC: Sheepish can hurry Market for 4⇴ with 10ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 28 turns.
Turn 88, 675 BC: Cornish Cow can hurry Library for 1⇴ with 5ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 23 turns.
Turn 88, 675 BC: Thessalonica has grown to size 3.
Turn 88, 675 BC: Sea Horse has grown to size 4.
Turn 88, 675 BC: Sea Horse can hurry Work Boat for 1⇴ with 7ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 20 turns.
Turn 88, 675 BC: Dye Hard can hurry Granary for 1⇴ with 4ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 10 turns.
Turn 88, 675 BC: You are the worst enemy of Alexander.
Turn 88, 675 BC: The borders of Cornish Cow are about to expand.
Turn 88, 675 BC: Kublai Khan will trade Construction
Turn 88, 675 BC: Huayna Capac will trade Construction
Turn 88, 675 BC: Kublai Khan will trade Horse
Turn 88, 675 BC: Amsterdam has been founded.

 

[Duckweed]

Good job!

Nice to see that Toku went for Currency than Feudalism.

 

[Doshin]

Good job!

Nice to see that Toku went for Currency than Feudalism.

I am happier that Toku isn't plotting.

 

[kossin]

Besides barbarians, the game has been surprisingly peaceful.

Way to go, Doshin.

 

[Doshin]

Besides barbarians, the game has been surprisingly peaceful.

Way to go, Doshin.

Thanks.

I am very glad the barb phase of the game is over. And the "hey, let's Axe rush Asoka!!! That'll be fun!"–part.

I'll post more thoughts in the morning. For now, .

 

[Folket]

We'll run out of cash after Music, therefore Market gives best return before resuming research for CS. Sheepish essentially has little production and the 2nd best commercial city. Investment to any world wonder is unpredictable to get return, as you can see that TOA is available to build from T0 and still available now.

We spend 150 gold to get 0-5 gold a turn. I think building wealth and whipping market is the way to go.

 

[Doshin]

A 4-pop whip of a Market will whip away three riverside Cottages, unless we work the Plains Hill, in which case it will whip two. It seems better to 2-pop whip a Monastery into a Market, which in turn should be whipped for 3 or 2-pop. An earlier Bureaucracy would be useful, but this also means that we will need to build the MoM sooner, start a Golden Age sooner, and stop running Slavery/Organized religion sooner. I'd like to set up infrastructure and grow cities in advance of all that.

Vienna is building something larger than a Settler. It currently has 117 invested in production. No other visible cities are building wonders, unless they just started.

The Construction trade opened up with Kublai and HC this turn. HC was researching Philosophy, as predicted:

Spoiler :

We won't know whether he's still pursuing this until T89.

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I don't think we should trade for Construction. 95G with Kublai is too much, and I don't really want to give Philosophy to HC, unless he is still researching it.

Calendar + Aesthetics/Literature <-----> Construction would be preferable, for me at least.

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The easiest AI to bribe is Alex, who will declare at Cautious against AI with whom he is Pleased. Napoleon should be doable too.

Spoiler :

Diplo:

Spoiler :

• Alexander: can be bribed at Cautious against an AI with whom he is Cautious.
• Napoleon: can be bribed at Pleased against an AI with whom he is Cautious.
• Kublai Khan: can be bribed at Pleased against an AI with whom he is Pleased.
• Huayna Capac: can be bribed at Friendly against an AI with whom he is Cautious.
• Tokugawa: can be bribed at Pleased against an AI with whom he is Pleased.

We could (a) gift Literature to Alex, to bring him to Cautious (I think); or (b) gift Aesthetics to Napoleon, to bring him to Pleased.

Gifting Aesthetics to Napoleon will probably mean that we need to gift Literature on the turn after that. It's a lot of free , and Napoleon has 10 cities so is more dangerous than most AI. OTOH, Alex may refuse to attack Tokugawa, because Toku is so far away.

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In terms of defense, we'll need to shuffle Archers around in the coming turns. There is an Archer in Rice Pudding, and an Archer in Sheepish. Both of these should move westwards, although the timing will need to be tested.