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[BTS] SGOTM 24 Unusual Suspects

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession GOTM' started by AlanH, Jan 28, 2017.

  1. Ronnie1

    Ronnie1 Deity

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    I know that look. -_-
     
  2. kcd_swede

    kcd_swede Jag är Viking!½ GOTM Staff

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    I know the look.:queen:
     
  3. nocho

    nocho Deity

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    It must've been a rather stern look. ;)

    Well, I guess death looks usually are.
     
  4. neilmeister

    neilmeister Lentils have feelings too GOTM Staff

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    Indeed! This week seemed like a soap opera.

    OK, the long awaited PPP is here... I will edit this post as I put it together, but broadly it is:
    - Fight Stalin without building too many more units
    - research along the path Education, Philo, Lib (bismark has Philo and can research Edu so we need some luck here to get Nationalism)
    - try to fix economy with courthouses and harbors

    War: Our newly conquered core cities will continue to have happiness issues until Darius is dead, but our older cities are suffering from war weariness. As Darius is offering us nothing for peace I propose simply to make a cease fire, at least until we regroup.
    I propose to have 2 stacks, the first will be for stabbing direct at Moscow and/or cleaning up Stalins units, this will/should become the focus for Stalin to send his units so it will need good defenders. The second stack will just work its way around the north south of his lands and contain a lot of cats.

    Techs: Education, Philo, Lib (Nationalism), Music, Mil Tradition ?

    Trade: Sell Gandhi our pig and cancel our pig to bismark trade and replace with gems in a few turns when Ectabana's gems are connected.

    Cities: obviously there is a big focus here on economic recovery and not much on new units. I feel we should use our existing units to take what we can from Stalin. We need to get to Liberalism/Nationalism asap to regain the tech lead and get ourselves to Cuirs. Obviously if we can pick up Engineering in a trade before then we can step up the war effort again.

    Persopolis: Currently 6t from Palace, as it currently generates almost exactly the same commerce/hammers as Cahokia, I will delay Palace and instead finish the barracks and produce a Mace for Moscow stack defence.

    Cahokia: finish observatory then HA's, courthouse

    PovP: harbor, courthouse, 3 WB's (for Chaco Canyon)

    MC: finish cat, courthouse, observatory FP

    Fishy: switch to courthouse, harbor and then finish observatory

    Stoned: units (Maces/XBows), then a harbor/courthouse at some point

    Eye Land: observatory (whip after 1t) then colloseum

    Phant Land: courthouse (whip before palace finished), harbor

    Pork Chop: finish market, then courthouse

    Clish: finish courthouse, then harbor

    WorkerGraveyard: finish lighthouse, courthouse & harbor

    Pasargadae: forge, barracks, units

    Ectabana: library (whip when available), granary

    Gordium: library (whip when available), barracks, units

    Susa: barracks, units
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2017
  5. Ronnie1

    Ronnie1 Deity

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    I would love to see the 2nd stack start in the south and take the marble city asap and then work north towards St Petes. I think we try to push Stalin onto the island if possible. Pillage his elephants and he can't really defend at all.

    If we are going to delay the new palace then I would love to see some HA's from Cahokia as it has our only stable. HA's with Flanking II are perfect either before or after the 1st sacrificial cat because they almost always do damage to the top defender and have about 50% survival odds.

    We can build wealth if necessary.

    We should be able to trade for Engineering at some point.

    EP on Bismark so we can see his research if possible.
     
  6. neilmeister

    neilmeister Lentils have feelings too GOTM Staff

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    OK, will produce some HA's from Cahokia first. EP on bismark (I didn't even look at espionage to be honest), will definitely pause if Engineering trade becomes available.

    I am happy to start from the south, just need to check we will have trade connectivity for marble.
     
  7. nocho

    nocho Deity

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    In Cahokia I still fancy the combination of NE and NP, so then there's no room for the FP. Maybe build it in MC instead of the observatory, possibly helped along with some whip overflow.

    Otherwise green!
     
  8. Ronnie1

    Ronnie1 Deity

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    We have Astronomy, marble will be connected as soon as we capture the city. ;)

    Agree with nocho on NP/NE in Cahokia.

    Green.
     
  9. kcd_swede

    kcd_swede Jag är Viking!½ GOTM Staff

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    Agree with Ronnie- Green
     
  10. Deckhand

    Deckhand Procrastination at its finest GOTM Staff

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    Green.
     
  11. neilmeister

    neilmeister Lentils have feelings too GOTM Staff

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    Oh yeah... that helps :blush:

    Also thanks nocho for reminding me about FP is a NW....

    Will play later today
     
  12. neilmeister

    neilmeister Lentils have feelings too GOTM Staff

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    I have played ~10 turns, we made cease fire with Darius and DoWed Stalin.

    Stack 1 lunged for Moscow, and took it with only light losses (we now own the Parthenon!). Stack 2 left for the southern Marble city when a huge Stalin stack appeared to the south of Susa. Quickly whipped Walls & Stack 2 returned to Susa just in time. Unfortunately, his stack was full of Cats/Axes with city raider so I felt we only really had the choice of attack. We lost ~4 cats on his stack but after this it was all XP for our units.

    GS in position (for Academy?) in Persoplis. GG near Persopolis. Palace in 2 turns.

    Stalin also now has Feudalism and longbows, so that is a bummer.

    Stack 1 only had 1 tile to move to attack Rostov, so it did that and again took it with minimal losses. It seems logical to take his northern city next. If we want Marble (and I think we do) I believe we should build a settler in Stoned to settle directly on our available Marble in the south. Bismarck will get Nationalism in 5t so we need to hustle for Taj.

    Asoka has long been willing to trade Engineering for Education, but as he already had Philo I demurred. We have Philo ourselves now and almost enough cash to complete Lib at 80% in 2 turns. So I was originally thinking of trading Asoka Education + 140g for Engineering & Feudalism next turn. But Gandhi has just this turn been willing to trade Engineering for CS & Philo & 10g.

    I felt this was a good point to hand over, still a number of units that can move, especially boats.

    Link to save
    http://gotm.civfanatics.net/download.php?file=Unusual_Suspects_SG024_AD1040_01.CivBeyondSwordSave
     
  13. nocho

    nocho Deity

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    Nice work, neil.

    I guess I would make the trade with Gandhi for Engineering and sit on Education a bit longer. How much of a hurry do we have with Liberalism? Right now there's nothing too interesting to lib, especially with Bismarck closing in on Nationalism. I'm thinking, we could bulb Printing Press nearly to completion, finish it, then lib and take Scientific Method. Downside is obsoleting the newly acquired Parthenon, upside is we can start on preserves, press on to biology and at least get a half decent tech out of lib.

    Edit: by the way, it seems we just lost sight on Stalin's demographics, any idea what power we last had on him? I presume we can still press on? Maybe we can get feudalism out of Stalin in a peace deal if/when we get St Pete.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2017
  14. Ronnie1

    Ronnie1 Deity

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    Haven't seen the save, but it sounds like we made progress!
     
  15. kcd_swede

    kcd_swede Jag är Viking!½ GOTM Staff

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    Lib something on the path to forest preserves. Sci Meth is great. Well. its pretty good anyhow. OTOH, we seriously need better units as our strategy is reliant on more and faster conquest. It is very hard to judge the bottlenecks in this strategy, but it is what we are working with, so lets do it. I'll try some calculations over the weekend and see if I can gove some advice. Right now, it looks like beating apart one bottleneck after the other... but that, I suppose, is always the case in sgotm. Good job, Neil. I am still unavailable for play, so some one should claim nexty.
     
  16. kcd_swede

    kcd_swede Jag är Viking!½ GOTM Staff

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    1 month to go.... we probably should pick up the pace some.
     
  17. nocho

    nocho Deity

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    Should I take it next? Can probably post a ppp in the next day or so.

    Would like some votes/ideas about what to lib though. Should we go for SciMeth as mentioned above?
     
  18. Ronnie1

    Ronnie1 Deity

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    Go for it!
     
  19. neilmeister

    neilmeister Lentils have feelings too GOTM Staff

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    I am ok for Sci/Meth, keep an eye on the AI though as they are only 1 tech from being able to research Lib themselves.
     
  20. nocho

    nocho Deity

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    So, something of a plan.

    Take engineering, map and little cash from Gandhi for CS and philo.

    Bulb printing press with GS. Finish PP and continue lib and take scientific method. Next up go gunpowder-chemistry-biology (?).

    Things of war: northern regiments near Rostov turn to Thracian. Southern regiments heal a turn and head for St Pete. Kill off stray russian LB this turn. Try pillage the bronze next to Moscow to leave him without metals. I think we should press on to the Russians as much as we can.

    Build 5 more universities for Oxford. I was contemplating skipping Oxford all together, but as we're PHI and universities are cheap, might as well get that. Oxford should go to Persepolis, so a university there. That means we can leave out one of the currently queued ones, I guess Clish. Maybe that overflow can go to barracks and then do units. Once we settle the marble near Jute, build NE in Cahokia. HE still reserved for Moscow, but will take a while, surely. FP can go to Mound City. Other than these buildings, I guess we just need military. Trebs will be a nice addition to our capabilities.

    A great person will be born in 3 turns. A GS might go to that academy, but I'm quite willing to use it for a bulb. Actually, depending on how close other civs are to lib, we could even contemplate bulbing scientific method and libbing physics. Or communism, state property might be pretty good to have. A GE on hold for the UN, a low-odd GM might be sent on a boat to Bombay (ToA).

    I think for now I'll play just 3 or 4 turns to see how they pan out, a bit short of liberalism and with next great person born.
     

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