SGOTM 9 - jeffelammar

[Jove]

ok, here is the save: http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm9/Jeffelammar_SG009_AD1940_01.SAV

Pre-flight- Let's do a little espionage to see if Ghandi is getting anywhere with his spaceship-
Aarhaus- TOW Infantry. 5 MU's (military units)
Stavanger- Worker. 8 MU's.
Channel City- Aegis cruiser. 5 MU's.
Trondheim- TOW Infantry (in 2 turns!). 7 MU's.
Oslo- Aegis cruiser. 4 MU's. One looks like a sub. In port, as per AI tactics.
Molde- Marine. 4 MU's.

That's enough, where else would he build space parts? Well, trimming Ghandi down will allow for more comprehensive espionage, let's get to it!
Wait, just for fun...
Delhi- Research lab. 2 MU's. It's pulling 16cpt, and if the science rate picks up, he'll beat Ghandi to Alpha Centauri.

Ibt- Get bombed. Ghandi sinks our battleship!
We're certainly completing plenty of units.

1922, turn 1-
start setting up a shipping chain to reconquer the north of our homeland.
*Imposing a plan* I'll trim Ghandi down to Lahore and Hyaberdad. South of that, he keeps.
I'm assuming the Mech Infs are to take the place of defending Modern Armor, which can be shipped to the old homeland.
Army kills 3 bombed-out TOWs to capture Indian worker for a homeland airfield next turn. Okay, let's fight.

Ibt- Ghandi strikes.

1924, turn 2-
Set up for war.

Ibt- Ghandi strikes.

1926, turn 3-
I'll start some more space parts as an example to Ghandi.
Capture Chittagong.

Ibt- the same

1928, turn 4-
Not much.

Ibt- Ghandi strikes. He's pretty serious about his Aegis cruisers.
Reject Hareid's offer to revolt to our faction.

1930, turn 5-
Capture Ta-Tu.

Ibt- Lose another Battleship.

1932, turn 6-
Capture Neu Bergen. Capture Kolhapur.
An MA army finally takes control of the oil tile that Ghandi has been re-roading every turn.
Ghandi displays 3 warships and a galleon outside old Spain.

Ibt- Repel 2 marines at New Stavanger. So, Ghandi Will use them...

1934, turn 7-
Ghandi landed 2 MAs. An excuse to use the Radar Artillery.
Capture Punjab.

Ibt- Ghandi captures the worker I offered back to him.

1936, turn 8-
Capture Karichi.
Ok, time for more espionage:
Aarhaus- Marine, 4 MUs.
Stavanger- TOW Infantry, 8 MUs.
Channel City- Aegis cruiser, 6 MUs.
Trondheim- TOW Infantry, 8 MUs.
Oslo- Aegis cruiser. 3 MUs.
Molde- Marine, 4 MUs.
If there's any change, it is that Ghandi's citizens are less happy.

Ibt- An Uzbek warrior attacks our MA Army!
Complete spaceship part 6/10.

1938, turn 9-
not much

Ibt- Ghandi strikes.

1940, turn 10- I can't believe cruise missiles can't be launched from subes, but tactical nukes can.
Capture Indus.

Notes- There's a few workers and ships active, but there shouldn't be any surprises. Check for lots of fortified units in the north of the home continent.
-The plan I have in mind is to capture as far south as Lahore and Hyaberdad, but no farther. We want to leave him a useful core.
- Once we've trimmed him down, we might as well give him the oil back. Our MA army is enforcing a bunch of pollution in Ghandi's core.
-Our power has really grown relative to his, but I guess he isn't ready to give up on domination yet. Building lots of Mech Infs in the hope that an even greater power differential will get his attention. Not really sure what else might work.

 

[denyd]

You were correct about those MI's being relief for the MA on MP duty. Also I had a pair of Indian Amphib assaults (2-3 marines each), so the 18 Def of the MI is better than the 12 of the MA for that purpose. If we restrict his oil, he's limited to AEGIS & Nuclear Subs in the water, TOW & Marines on land and nothing in the air.

I was saving that one Indian city SE of our new home as a potential lesson for Gandhi to spur him to space.

 

[jeffelammar]

I am back, but won't be able to play till later in the week. Since Pindicator is normally up after Jove, I suggest that he slip in a turnset, and If nobody objects I'll slip in my delayed set between him and Tim.

Reminder: We did decide to play this out, but that doesn't mean everyone has to. If you don't want to play sets, just post so and we'll move on to the next person.

Roster
Jove
pindicator <== Up..
jeffelammar <== Would like to take a turn here if nobody objects
TimBentley <== On deck if he objects to my jumping in here
Paul#42
CKS
denyd
jeffelammar

 

[denyd]

Since I've dropped down to a single XOTM per month, I've got plenty of available Civ time, so I'll be available to play this one out if for no other reason than to nuke Gandhi if he doesn't get his ass in gear.

 

[jeffelammar]

Since I've dropped down to a single XOTM per month, I've got plenty of available Civ time, so I'll be available to play this one out if for no other reason than to nuke Gandhi if he doesn't get his ass in gear.

Amen to that. If he won't get to space on his own, we'll launch him there on a pillar of nukes.

 

[CKS]

My available time will fluctuate for a while, but I plan to stick it out, however frustrating Ghandi is. I'd rather space ship than nukes at the end, but I'll take either.

 

[pindicator]

Got back from the easter family extraveganza just tonight. Got it and will play tomorrow.

 

[Jove]

I'm in. From space, nukes look pretty...

 

[pindicator]

Uh, hmm... I think I might have to drop out.

Mixed blessing: I've got a new job, but of course this means I haven't had the time to play Civ like I thought I would. So I may be done, especially since we have moved on to an optional participation point.

So... hmmm, gimme a skip this round and I'll keep checking in / posting.

 

[Paul#42]

If Tim also skips, please skip me, too.

If Tim plays, I might check if I can play on weekend.

I have to admit, my motivation to play this on is fading slightly

 

[jeffelammar]

Oops, somehow I missed pindicator's skip.

I'll take my makeup turns. Should be able to play tonight.

 

[jeffelammar]

1955 save file

Preflight - 1940
Not a lot to say. Wish I could cash rush in Communism. Oh well it's my own fault for converting.
Make a few minor changes to builds.
Hit go and get this little shocker...

Accept it given the current goals. Guess it still has a lot of our pop and culture so it isn't as shocking as I thought it was at first.

Turn 1
Take and keep Sarpberg, Bengal, Lahore
Wierd, I went away to stir my dinner and now the civ screen doesn't take up my whole screen.
Don't want to reload, so I'll play like this for a while.
Do a MM round. Lots of bad MM (of course at this point it doesn't make much difference)
Civil Engineers in cities building troops, clowns where we could have taxmen, etc.
Again, not a big deal.

Turn 2
Liberate Jaipur
Because it hurts to see, I switch our taxmen to scientists to get tech faster... I know the tech doesn't matter, but we have plenty of $$$

Turn 3
Take Hyperabad. Advance pauses here to see what Ghandi does. I have another Army on the way to complete the choke.

Turn 4
New army arrives from home, also get leader, there is empty army available.
Armys form blockade so India doesn't waste troops coming at us.
Not a whole lot more to do. Since I'm done conquesting for my turns, I'll concentrate on building lots of Mech Infs and Jets to defend.
I'll do a round of investigation next turn at the halfway of my turns.

Turn 5
Continue to reinforce towns. Found one on mainland. I want to cover fog and prevent barbs, so in a classic dot map sense it may look like , but I did it on purpose for a reason.
Trondheim, Stavanger, Bombay, Calcutta, Bangalore, Madras -- TOW
Barcelona, Stockholm, Birka, Aarhaus, Hareid, Molde, Fauske, New Svolvaer -- Marine
Channel City, Oslo, Risor -- Aegis
Karistad, Celtic Uranium -- Bomber (probably from before we took out their oil since they are 1spt and 2 spt)
Dacca, New Molde -- Modern Armor both at 1spt)
Curse him and his desire for military...
India is down to 19% of the land and 24% of Population...

Hareid offers to revolt to us, I rebuff them since it would be on the wrong side of the Army Line.

Turn 6
Not much to report. Continue to skirmish in the water. Need more boats...
I bomb India's Rubber to prevent more Marines, then realize he needs it for his space ship, send army out of sight of rubber so he can reconnect it?

Barcelona revolts to us, refuse as I don't want to take India's gems.

Turn 7
Running close to our unit limit, slow down on Mech Infs, concentrate on Navy.
Found Odense in another place to fill in fog.

Turn 8
Not much at all. Look around. Still no parts started. I'm hoping that he'll build some when he reaches his troop max. (If that ever happens)

Turn 9
Same old, same old, Clean Pollution, move troops, start building more wealth.
We have a strong military vrs India.

Pollution at carthage drops happiness production enough to cause riot.

Turn 10
Not much going on again.
Trying to pump out workers in our original lands to repair the damage.
Back to building Infra.

There are two unfilled armies on the indian continent. The can be loaded with MAs to expand our picket lines. I created the lines because this way India won't attack, so will just keep building troops. Hopefully when he starts to max out on troop support, he'll start building other things.
I've purposely left the Indian Colonies alone and have avoided building anything to expand borders. This way they keep resources.

 

[pindicator]

Doesn't look like he's building a thing except for military.

I was thinking about that earlier today, and I bet that if we were to declare peace and leave Gandhi be, he would build the space ship and launch. But with the constant war he just wants to build troops, whether he is winning easily or getting he butt handed to him on a platter.

I like the picket line idea. Hopefully it works

 

[Jove]

You sound a little frustrated that Ghandi isn't doing what we want. Me too. But what else is there to try?
For instance, is what Ghandi builds based on a set formula and entirely predictable, or is there any element of chance to it? If its 90% chance military, 10% space parts (just for an example), massive production sabotage would give us that many more 'rolls of the dice'. And we could certainly afford it. But I'm just guessing, I don't have a clear insight into how Ghandi-AI makes these decisions.
I like jeff's theory about maximum military as well. If that is true, and with the monster military we command, we could trim Ghandi even further and just enforce wastelands rather than claiming the land ourselves. That'd bring the max down, plus leave him with mostly productive cities.
It's all speculation. Does anyone else have any ideas?

 

[TimBentley]

I think if we sabotaged production, they would still continue to build the same thing.

They currently have 119 units out of a support for 152 (I wonder if pillaging some irrigation would be useful). But I think the AI is willing to overbuild units to the point of bankruptcy. They should have sufficient garrison: they've got more than enough for two defensive units per radar tower and three per city.

Got it. I should play tonight.

 

[CKS]

I don't think there is anything to do but wait. Maybe they'll build space ships when they reach their troop support limit. I think we should try anything we can think of, though. We could try sabotaging production in corrupt towns to see if they build anything new, but I'm not sure that helps much - at a shield per turn, SS parts take a long time. (Slow but steady might win this race, though.) I don't think it is worth sabotaging core builds to test the idea, because they should be finishing pretty quickly anyway and this would interfere with our build up his troops plan.

 

[denyd]

We could always build enough units to the point where no new ones can be built. There is a maximum # of units hardcoded in the game. If we started pumping out cheap units (workers) as fast a possible we might be able reach that limit and force Gandhi to build something else.

 

[TimBentley]

8192 units? I don't think so.

 

[CKS]

Well, we'd only need to build 8000 of them, since Ghandi has some already.

 

[jeffelammar]

8192 units?

All I have to say to that is At 1 per turn per city that would only takes us about 200 turns

Couple points: In my experience, ususally sabotaging causes the AI to start the project over rather than switch.

I *think* the AI will only build way past their troop limit if they have nothing else to build, but that is just *think*