WackenOpenAir
Deity
Wacken: 140
Bede: 136
Xteam: 135
We are picking up good guys !
Bede: 136
Xteam: 135
We are picking up good guys !
SGOTM7 - Team Wacken
- Thread starter mad-bax
- Start date
Hmm. A large part of the reason to wait before contacting the Arabs is that we want to teach them about literature. The warriors we build now will all find uses, we need more MPs yet and a couple of lookouts to suppress barbs. Our invasion fleet is still in the development stage too. Not having money or horses or iron is frustrating though.
I agree that settler building in Istanbul doesn't have to keep going for very long now. The few settlers we will require in the medium turn can be squeezed out of corrupt towns. We do want lots of workers though and with our worker factory nearly built we should have plenty soon.
I am shocked that we are ahead in the spam race. I wanted to dine on victory, not dubious meat products.
I agree that settler building in Istanbul doesn't have to keep going for very long now. The few settlers we will require in the medium turn can be squeezed out of corrupt towns. We do want lots of workers though and with our worker factory nearly built we should have plenty soon.
I am shocked that we are ahead in the spam race. I wanted to dine on victory, not dubious meat products.
? This is unfortunately not something I understand, have we really agreed on wanting to teach the arabs literacy?. I would not have argued to take MM as the free tech if I had known this was the team plan. All along I argued for MM as part of a plan to have us pursue Literature and trade it to a 4th tribe we have yet to meet. BTW, "Waiting" is a word I would like to ban from use by this team...Offa said:
I would rather we keep discussing things, even if it could be seen as excessive instead of weighing every word on a golden scale. An active thread will help us hammer out the best strategy for this game. Keep talking!Offa said:
WackenOpenAir
Deity
Yes, i have thought about it a little more as described in my previous post, I am completely with Wotan, we should contact Arabia now.
WackenOpenAir
Deity
Wotan said:
indeed, never hold back to post, don't be afraid to post things that you didn't think about thoroughly yet, dont be afraid to look stupid or anything by posting idea's that might not be the right ones. Just post everything that comes up in your mind and together we will filter out the good things from all the things we all post.
Wotan said:
I remember Bursa, but you missed my point. I don't want to hire a specialist in Iznik. I want it to switch to FP immediately and once it grows put extra shied from new citizen toward FP build instead of using specialist.
That will only be possible if we sent a warrior from Istanbul to Iznik for MP on pre-turn basis. Otherwise, yes we will have either hire specialist or bump lux.
So Please lets make desicion of FP build, nobody has spoken and i strongly think we should do it now.
Agree with rest of you on war plans. Lets start building army - get knowledge of iron and horses from Arabs.
OK, sorry about that, I must have forgotten to read the fine print.dmanakho said:
Re. FP I would not mind waiting for a while with it. Use a GL in "foreign lands" to have a really good site produce plenty of military for us. Maybe one of the capitals?
I don't think building FP in far away lands or capital for that matter is such a good idea in C3C.
It works perfect in PTW but sucks in C3C due to different corruption models.
My book says that C3C frontpage palace should be close enough and built at earliest convinience to maximize uncorrupted core size and increase OCN.
Especially if we are going to stay on Despot-Monarchy course where both goverments have high corruption rates.
I do think we should hand build it now and use leaders for armies.
Iznik is a perfect place, with no FP built we will never get full use of the cows it has. I am screaming here.
But again if there is a draw and it is your word against mine i will probably do as you say since you have better civ records than i do.
It works perfect in PTW but sucks in C3C due to different corruption models.
My book says that C3C frontpage palace should be close enough and built at earliest convinience to maximize uncorrupted core size and increase OCN.
Especially if we are going to stay on Despot-Monarchy course where both goverments have high corruption rates.
I do think we should hand build it now and use leaders for armies.
Iznik is a perfect place, with no FP built we will never get full use of the cows it has. I am screaming here.
But again if there is a draw and it is your word against mine i will probably do as you say since you have better civ records than i do.
I agree with you on the FP issue in C3C. But on a small map the distance to eg. Delhi is not that far, it is probably just north of our most northern city if the indications from the indian borders are telling us what I hope they do. Iznik is not such a great location, I was just hoping M-B had placed the AI's initial Settlers in good places so putting our FP in one of those would give us a very good production site. That was my thoughts on this. And, MGL's can build minor GW's so we would save 200 shields by using one of our many MGL's.
WackenOpenAir
Deity
The chosen place for FP is correct IMO. The only other possibly better place i imagine would be at our south coast when the jungle is cut.
if we build it on another continent, the cities near it will have little distance corruption, their rank corruption will be so big that they will still be totally corrupt. the C3C FP needs to be build between cities with only a moderate rank corruption (and a distance corruption as big as possible, but that is secondary)
If rank corruption is very high, going for a lower distance corruption is rather useless.
I am in doubt if we should build it or hope for a leader.
+Leaders are unsure we will get them.
-building it will take long before it starts to pay off.
+Armies are also an extremely good use of leaders in C3C.
-Not building it means more units for our blitzkrieg in the near future.
So i am not sure about it.
if we build it on another continent, the cities near it will have little distance corruption, their rank corruption will be so big that they will still be totally corrupt. the C3C FP needs to be build between cities with only a moderate rank corruption (and a distance corruption as big as possible, but that is secondary)
If rank corruption is very high, going for a lower distance corruption is rather useless.
I am in doubt if we should build it or hope for a leader.
+Leaders are unsure we will get them.
-building it will take long before it starts to pay off.
+Armies are also an extremely good use of leaders in C3C.
-Not building it means more units for our blitzkrieg in the near future.
So i am not sure about it.
WackenOpenAir said:
Agreed on everything Wacken said about corruption.
+We will get leaders, not sure how many and i'd rather use our first few leaders for armies
+Yes it will take long time to build, but Iznik is pretty much useless city now, so if we don't start building FP there, what else that city is good for???
(Answer: nothing really). Besides the early we start building FP the earlier it will start paying off.
+Armies are too good in C3C AW variant to miss them
+True, but again building units in Izmik is almost waste of time.
EDIT: Yes it might take another 40 turns to build FP in Iznik, but it will take significantly longer time to build it somewhere in Delhi with leader. My feelings are still very strong on this matter. @Wotan: YOu will have to come up with more arguments to convince me on this.
MORE EDIT: There is a downside using armies on this particular map. Once we have army and fill it we won't be able to transport until astronomy.
Basically army is getting stuck on the island where it is created
WackenOpenAir
Deity
Yes, armies being stuck is quite a disadvantage indeed.
I suggest we need to make a choise between buiding it in iznik and leader rushing it at our south coast.
I would suggest leader rushing, but 40 elite victories without leader is very much a posibillity.
Izmiks production is not useless. we have not many cities with decent production, so izmiks 5spt will be a nice addition.
I suggest we need to make a choise between buiding it in iznik and leader rushing it at our south coast.
I would suggest leader rushing, but 40 elite victories without leader is very much a posibillity.
Izmiks production is not useless. we have not many cities with decent production, so izmiks 5spt will be a nice addition.
Leader rushing on south coast is a better proposition thatn leader rushing overseas. But i'd rather hand build it. Leader hunting is pretty much a lottery.
Plus again... Lest say it takes 40-50 turns to get FP handbuild...
How many turns will it take before our first war. About 20 to 30???
How many turns will it take to make an elite unit, then for elite unit to heal (likely), then to win (chances 1 of 32)... and how many win we will have before 1st leader... Then wouldn't we want to use 1st leader for an army and second to build HE perhaps??? Well... there are too many variables if we rely on leader.... I don't feel good about it
Plus again... Lest say it takes 40-50 turns to get FP handbuild...
How many turns will it take before our first war. About 20 to 30???
How many turns will it take to make an elite unit, then for elite unit to heal (likely), then to win (chances 1 of 32)... and how many win we will have before 1st leader... Then wouldn't we want to use 1st leader for an army and second to build HE perhaps??? Well... there are too many variables if we rely on leader.... I don't feel good about it
I agree we ought to hand build the FP, having scored zero leaders in my last game. One thing, Iznik with a FP would be able to build the Great Library pretty quickly .
I don't feel anything like strongly enough to argue more for delaying contact with Arabia, so go ahead. From the power-graph the AI would appear pretty weak so hopefully our aggressive plans will work.
.I don't feel anything like strongly enough to argue more for delaying contact with Arabia, so go ahead. From the power-graph the AI would appear pretty weak so hopefully our aggressive plans will work.
WackenOpenAir
Deity
Gogo calculate it !
I haven't got the game here. But i will give it a try anyway
It can grow to size very fast with the cows.
At size 6, we could mine the cows and have this:
city: 1
grass cow: 2
plain cow: 3
mined BG: 2
forest x2 : 4
nything with 1: 1
total 13
Last time i checked, it had 55% corruption, but that might have changed due to roads or new cities.
with 55% it would be 6 production.
It is size 3 i see, will be size 6 in 10 turns.
5 turns for rax = 40 shields 15 more durin next 5 turns = 55.
then 145 / 6 = 24 for a total of 34 turns if we do everything right with worker jobs and time the mines to be done at growth to 6. This is probably not realistic as it would require 4 workers to start mining different tiles at exactly the same time. so i would expect 35-36 turns with 55% corruption.
If corruption is below 53% due to roads, we can get the city to 7 shields per turn at size 6 (with a mined plains)and thus reduce it by 4 turns
I haven't got the game here. But i will give it a try anyway
It can grow to size very fast with the cows.
At size 6, we could mine the cows and have this:
city: 1
grass cow: 2
plain cow: 3
mined BG: 2
forest x2 : 4
nything with 1: 1
total 13
Last time i checked, it had 55% corruption, but that might have changed due to roads or new cities.
with 55% it would be 6 production.
It is size 3 i see, will be size 6 in 10 turns.
5 turns for rax = 40 shields 15 more durin next 5 turns = 55.
then 145 / 6 = 24 for a total of 34 turns if we do everything right with worker jobs and time the mines to be done at growth to 6. This is probably not realistic as it would require 4 workers to start mining different tiles at exactly the same time. so i would expect 35-36 turns with 55% corruption.
If corruption is below 53% due to roads, we can get the city to 7 shields per turn at size 6 (with a mined plains)and thus reduce it by 4 turns
grahamiam
In debt to Mr. Geisel
tag, though it seems i have a little bit of reading to do 
8 pages to go!
and i thought my aunts chatted a lot
8 pages to go!and i thought my aunts chatted a lot
Good to have you back, Grahamiam. A lot of catching up...
And with the half-life of Margaritas I am surprised you are alréady checking in.
7 days on them would normally take a few days just to get them out of your system.
On my way to bed now but hope to discuss the game with you tomorrow.
And with the half-life of Margaritas I am surprised you are alréady checking in.
7 days on them would normally take a few days just to get them out of your system.
On my way to bed now but hope to discuss the game with you tomorrow.
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