SGOTM7 - Team Wacken

Preflight check: good grief! To tgl, or not to tgl? Ah well, good enough. Kill’em all before they get big, steal the library out from their noses (where did I do that before? :hmm: ).

Settler S,E going for somewhere around spot 6. Leave the MP’s in Bursa alone.

IBT: Istanbul warrior -> settler; Edrine warrior -> spear (sword prebuild)

T1: 1475BC warrior automoves to Sinop. Send him thru towards the Arabs. Rotate warriors around the Sinop, Edrine, Bursa area so everyone is covered from wandering Horsemen.

IBT: Uskudar warrior -> spear (ditto); Izmit galley -> galley; Konya worker -> worker

T2: 1450BC Meet the Arabs. They are up Wheel, WC, Myst, and IW. Only down Writing. Have Horses (1) and dyes (at least 3). Have only 4 cities (includes capitol)?

Trades: Sell Writing to Arabs for IW and 2g. Sell Philo for Myst, Wheel, and 57g. Sell MM to Arabs for HBR, Myst, and 34g.
Arabs up Poly! How nice of them to reduce our research costs :)
Selling MM is a bit sketchy, I know, but with only 4 cities I do not fear the Arabs. Actually, with this empire, I really don’t fear anything. And the other AI’s won’t have anything worthwhile for MM atm so we should be relatively safe till we get some real units online.

We have 2 horses and 2 irons.

Crap, differential naval movement is on.

Arabs call us a windbag when I demand Poly, so I give them the finger and declare

IBT: India building SoZ

T3: 1425BC Found Kafa -> worker; Looks like the Zulu got writing and philo from the Arabs, but no MM.

IBT: Istanbul settler -> warrior; Bursa granary -> worker

T4: 1400BC Use the galley and the eWarrior to play a little hit-n-run with the Indians. Capture an Indian worker with the eW.

IBT: Istanbul warrior -> worker; Iznik barracks -> spear;

T5: 1375BC Warrior dies attacking barb camp near iron (1/2)

IBT: galley kills barb galley (2/3); Istanbul worker -> spear (a pillager); Bursa worker -> worker
Indians building ToA, complete Pyramids in Delhi

T6: 1350BC Warrior dies to barb in barb camp again (1/2)

T7: 1325BC Warrior kills that bloody barb and takes the barb camp + 25g. MM sci slider to get some gold back.

IBT: Barb horse appears S of Sidon

Lit -> Poly (9T, -5gpt, 90%); Istanbul spear -> worker; Bursa worker -> worker; Uskudar spear -> horseman; Aydin galley -> galley

T8: 1300BC Found Ankara, popping a hut (gets us maps) -> galley
Iznik gets a sci to shave 1T off Poly.

IBT: Istanbul worker -> Libary; Edrine horse -> horse; Incense Hill galley -> gally

T9: 1275BC Moving to protect against barb horseman

IBT: lose a galley near Konya to barb galley; Bursa worker -> worker; Izmit gally -> gally; Persians complete MoM

T10: 1250BC Warrior kills barb horse near Sinop. Move 2 workers onto the iron hill near Ankara.

Notes: Spears in Istanbul are meant to go on a pillaging spree. Next player can chose the Indians or Zulu. Only meant to build 1 but forgot to swap Uskudar.
Another pillaging/exploring galley is near the Indian town of Calcutta.
Worker count finally getting respectable (13).

wacken-1250BC.jpg
 
I know G-Man, there was a lot of reading.
Iznik should be working on FP, you must have missed that part. :rolleyes:
Looks like we are doing pretty good...

India is building SoZ for us... That's nice... we will just wait when it is ready to get it from them. :devil:


EDIT: Our score graph is pretty impressive. We are 20 turns ahead.
 
Hi,
Due to an unfortunate happening in my family, i will not be spendig a lot of time online for the rest of this week. You will probably see me in a few days again.
 
I will be scarce the next couple days also, heading for Colorado on Wednesday, and have a lot to do after work tonight and tomorrow. I think we can afford to wait for Wacken to become available.
 
I'm not that wild about spearman in general, but I guess always war is the time to use them. I do feel pretty nervous about an AI invasion, as we are wide open at the moment, especially in the north west.

The culture graph shows Klarius' grumpies suddenly getting a lot of culture. I suspect, as Klarius likes science and was always trying to get us to research Mil trad that this represents a serious library building drive by his team. Entertaining as it implies that they aren't building the Great Library either. Should we consider the possibility of researching to Siphai ourselves? Wotan, if Uskadar's culture worries you I have no objection to a library.

The score graph looks very good, but although it shows we have expanded well, it implies we are less well defended than the other teams. I hate to sound like the voice of caution but I don't see how we can achieve adequate homeland defence and a concerted attack in the near future. Please prove me wrong. Nicking coastal workers is great though.

India would be a tempting prospect but Gandi has iron. We should certainly look to take the town that builds the SOZ before any ancient cavalry come out as they are great troops. Perhaps the Arabs in the meantime? The Zulu are possible too as Impi in towns give them no benefit provided we attack with slow units. The Zulu golden age could be tough for us though.

Anyway Wacken I hope nothing too bad is happening. I am not about to suggest micromanagement before your turn ;)
 
spears in AW are best for forward pillaging or settling. I only wanted 1, but instead missed an IBT MM and we got 2, sorry. however, we should put them to use by using them both to pillage a foe, perhaps Gandi's iron? if we can get them into the mountians and the iron is on the mountian, we can prevent India from building anything useful for a long time. they can also be used to cover an initial horse invasion or a settler landing 2T from Lahore to give us a port invasion town near our capitol.

our core towns Izmit, Edrine, and Uskudar need to start pumping out the units, and the new workers will help that along. Library in Istanbul can be switched without missing a beat, but I recommend we keep it as it will help us research Monarchy more quickly by boosting our bpt by about 15%. Ankara could use a library too, if for nothing else than to keep an iron supply safe.

@wacken: sorry to read that, please take care.
 
I agree re. Spears, I almost never build them and when I do it is for a specific purpose. Like rushing them in exposed locations when threatened by enemies or in "island cities" where I do not expect to do anything but defend.
 
I might play tomorrow, but i am not sure yet. If not tomorrow, it will be friday or later.
Before i play, i have some questions to the team:

Grahamiam changed our focus from military to science quite a bit by starting research towards monarchy and starting a library.

Do you guys want to continue this research or do you think we should keep focus on military by stopping science until we have money to upgrade our warriors and not building a library but units instead ?

Iznik has now 65% corruption, finished its barracks, lost a forest and another one is being cut soon. It is no longer feasable to build the FP there. Do we want to wait for a leader?

For military target: The zulu town offending Uskudar looks like a very interesting target to me as it would stop the culture flipping risk for us. Attacking it risks them getting a golden age.
-Do we want to take this risk?
-If they do get their GA, do we continue to fight them in order to reduce their benefit from the GA rather than waiting for them to come to us ?
 
sorry if I screwed up the focus of the game, should have asked for an executive summary before starting. however, in AW, it's generally required to do your own research, at least to get to decent gov't.

re zulu GA: I would rather them have it as a despot with small towns than a Monarchy so, imho, setting it off now would be a good thing.
 
Havn't really looked at the save but if the change has been done to science I would like us to go back to the military focus we had.

I guess waiting for a leader to build the FP is now our best option.

I too would consider taking out the zulu frontier town. As an overall target I would favour the indians though.

Clearing our island from barbs would also rate high on my wish list.

EDIT: Very good argument re. Zulu GA, Grahamiam!
 
I would probably still try to handbuild FP.
It has high corruption rate, but once we have monarchy corruption will get lower and we will be able to shave few turns off.
But don't listen to me, momentum is lost. Do what ever you feel right.

We need a formidable army to take Impus in their GA even Despiotic.
How long will it take to create such a force?

India is also high in my list. I would capture/raze all the cities except the one building SoZ and then just wait for the right time.

Science vs. Military... Khhm.... How many warriors do we have to upgrade? We should have very few at the moment, so no major upgrade costs required.
So it should be okay to go full speed to monarchy, IMHO.

Another question, are we going to build bunch of swords or bunch of horses?
 
We have 8 warriors that could be upgraded.

We have ~35 commerce per turn to spend.

We are 5/6 turns from that last tech before monarchy.

Against the zulu i'd prefer swords as the horses will lose their retreat ability anyway. Against india i do not have a preference.

If it weren't for the cultural offence, i wouldn't think a second it. No other reason to attack the zulu really than to secure our cultural safety. India is our best target now, but Uskudar is still at flip risk.

If we handbuild the FP, i think we should do it elsewhere.



Therefore, the decisions go together a bit. Attacking the zulu with horses while we have few of them is not a good option. If we want to attack the zulu, we need to upgrade the warriors.

Still, if we do that, there is a considerable chance to activate their GA. If we do so, there will be a lot more anoying impi.

If we go for India, some extra swords with the horses we produce will make short work of It. SoZ certainly is a prime target. With this upgrade we have a lot more control over India and it will be easier to take SoZ at the right moment.
We must take this wonder. It will make a very important difference if we fight with or against it.

On the other hand, monarchy is also very important of course.
 
High science is indeed a bit inconsistent with our Great Library plans, as it seriously limits our ability to upgrade troops.

Wouldn't the Indians be best attacked immediately after they build the SOZ?

How are you proposing to invade: how many troops and what sort? In my sid game settling on a hill in the AI island, rushing a wall and barracks and then soaking up the AI attack worked very well, but may be a bit passive for you guys.
 
I decided for the following plans:

-Focus on military. Stop research to upgrade the warriors. Stop the library.

-Capital to 15 spt. I will micro manage it to grow in 3 turns, building a horse in the first2, skimming a worker in the 3th. Then grow it to size 7 again next 2 turns, join a worker for size 8, meanwhile mine some things to get the 15 spt.
It will require 20% lux, but that will be required anyway as we upgrade our MP warriors and send them to India/Zululand.

-Sinop has too much corruption and no food tiles available. It must now first build a worker.



Turn1:
Horsemen attacks barbarian horse and becomes elite.

Turn2:
As i had to choose between several risks in the defence against the barbs in the south, i had chosen to let them do one more ransack and they steal 12 gold.

Turn3:
First 3 warriors upgraded to swords.

Turn4:
First 3 swords are boarded, a defender moves into Hlobane :(

Turn6:
Istanbul to 15 spt.
with 7 horses, 4 swords and 4 warriors, our military is average to everyone we know.

I find a green border in the south. If our horse on the penensula isn't killed by the barbs right next to it, we will soon contact them.

Iznik cannot be made happy with 6 citizens. I mine a plains to slow down its growth and provide it 4 production.

3 swords and 1 spear landed near Hlobane.

Turn7:
An arabian settler with warrior lands on our southern penensula right next to our horsemen and barb camp. A barb horsemen attacks our horse and brings it to 1 hp.
So now we have a 1 hp horse with next to it an arabian settler+warrior and a barb camp. I let the horse rest right there and start moving 2 reenforcement horses to the south.

Our elite warrior stepped ashore on the back side of the zulu's to scare a worker. It was attacked by an Impi. The impi retreated without dealing damage. 3 archers moved next to the warrior, so it reenters the boat.

Hlobane is defended at least by 2 veteran and 1 regular impi.
We have 4 swords and 1 spear next to it.

The zulu seem to be quite strong.
The Indians on the other hand have a small island and havent shown any danger yet.

Turn8:
An archer from hlobane kills the spear.
The barbarian hut is abandoned as the barb attacks our horse and dies.
The Arabian city is reenforced with a spearman.
A zulu galley is spoted, they are afloat !

As hlobane is now defended with at least 3 impis and a spear, i decide to abandon the attack. I load the swords and move them to India. Uskudar builds a library now to defend culturaly. This will be less costly than an attack on hlobane.

I move our heavily wounded elite horse closer to the green border. I have little hope for it though, it will probably be attacked by the arab warrior.

Turn10:
Enough gold for the warriors. I restart research.

We stand ready to attack Lahore.
Be prepared to take Bombay as soon as it finishes SoZ.

Defence of our homelands is pretty ok i think, MP's are being replaced by horses at the moment.

We have a nice amount of workers. Feel free to change Bursa to produce units if you want.



The forest used by the capital is being cut.
After the horse it is producing, if you swich to a library, the forest cut will make the lib complete in 2 turns. For this the capital needs to use the BG from Izmit at the turn the forest will be cut. Else 14 shields will be wasted.
After the forest cut, the plains need to be mined in order to regain the 15 spt. Until this is done, the BG must be used. Since there is a road on the tile already, you can stack workers on the tile to make the mine.


Mines are built and being build around Iznik to bring it to 5 spt, maybe 6 someday in the future.

During the next turnset, i think Iznik, Izmit, Bursa, Edrine and Uskadar can all be brought to 5 ot 6 spt for good unit production.


Some units have moved. Some have not.

I would expect contact with the green guys any turn now. Probably we can trade some tech from them.
 
Offa said:
High science is indeed a bit inconsistent with our Great Library plans, as it seriously limits our ability to upgrade troops.

Wouldn't the Indians be best attacked immediately after they build the SOZ?

How are you proposing to invade: how many troops and what sort? In my sid game settling on a hill in the AI island, rushing a wall and barracks and then soaking up the AI attack worked very well, but may be a bit passive for you guys.
Click to expand...


Such plans are good, I prefer to do things like that with the AI's that we are not yet fighting. For india i'd say just go all out offence. For arabia or the zulu's, we can do such things.

Either our worker factory, or our corrupt cities could build a settler for this.
 
We have a lot of workers... :)
Now lets make sure we have at least twice as much swords and horses
 
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