SGOTM8 - Xteam

[Capt Buttkick]

Turn 0 – 1150 AD Switch a few builds in former England to cavs and rush to prepare for gift-and-take against Japan. We've only got 80 units and I think that may be the reason the AIs won't give much in peace deal. We need to frighten them more so I change a few builds to cavs. We can afford to anyway...

IBT: Lots of cavs finish.
Jonk. flips with a 4/4 cav.

Shanghai Temple --> Harbour
Cleveland Market --> Bank
Pittsburgh Market --> Wealth

Caesaraugusta completes Newton's

Turn 1 – 1160 AD Rome and Vikings won't talk.
Make peace with the Japanese, get 23 gold, WMap and Music Theory.
New Cincinatti founded.
Gift the following cities to the Japanese:
Warwick, Liverpool, Hastings, Coventry, Springfield, Santa Fe, New Chicago, Spokane.
Redeclare war.

Spokane: 3/3 --> 1/3 cav defeats 3/3 Samurai. We capture Spokane
New Chicago: 3/3 --> 3/4 cav defeats 3/3 Samurai. We capture New Chicago
Santa Fe: 5/5 --> 2/5 cav defeats 3/3 Samurai. We capture Santa Fe
Springfield: 4/4 --> 3/4 cav defeats 3/3 Samurai. We capture Springfield
Coventry: 3/3 cav looses to 3/3 --> 2/4 Samurai.
4/4 --> cav defeats 2/4 Samurai. We capture Coventry
Hastings: 3/3 --> 3/4 cav defeats 3/3 Samurai. We capture Hastings
Liverpool: 3/3 cav defeats 3/3 Samurai. We capture Liverpool

Jönköping: 5/5 --> 4/5 cav defeats 3/3 Spear. We capture Jönköping
Man! I just realized right after I did it, that was a mistake. I should have taken Oslo instead. That would have Jönk. the new capitol and increased our war effort

IBT: Japanese unload Samurai + cav outside Matsuyama.
Västerås Settler --> Settler
Göteborg flips with a 4/4 cav that I forgot to move. At least now I'll get the chance to capture Oslo again...
Hunt Valley Harbour --> Wealth


Turn 2 - 1170 AD Noone will talk.
Outside Matsuyama: 4/4 --> 5/5 cav defeats 5/5 Samurai
4/4 --> 2/5 cav defeats 5/5 Jap cav.
Oslo: 4/4 --> 2/5 cav defeats 3/3 Musket
5/5 --> 2/5 cav defeats 3/3 Pike
There's still a 3/3 Spear in the town. Move on to Göteborg...
Göteborg: 4/4 cav defeats 3/3 Spear. We capture Göteborg

IBT: Corinth Temple --> Bank
Buffalo Harbour --> Temple

Turn 3 – 1180 AD Vikings will now talk Malmö is close. Örebro is doubful. I'll wait and see if I can't get one of those cities. Hurry cav in Norrk.
New Dallas is founded, starts settler. Rush a few cavs.

IBT: Norrk., Oxford and Brighton trains cavs.

Turn 4 – 1190 AD Not much.

IBT: Wash cav --> cav.
LA Temple --> Wealth

Turn 5 – 1200 AD .
Rome will talk, but wont give anything, not even close.
I'm taking a break here. I don't think there's much more to do than to push down the road we're going. How do you feel about getting a huge cav army, say 200 cavs? Would that scare the AI into giving more and bigger cities for peace? We've got 16,000 gold.

Should we mass rush settlers to found new towns and ICS all of the English island. Will that make them scared?

Here's my proposal for dealing with the Vikings: We grow one of the English cities huge (size 12), then gift it and take Oslo. We'll fill the tiles of the gifted city with our own forces so the Viks can't get out, then we redeclare and wait for the city to starve down to size 1. Will that scare them into giving Norwich?
Btw, they're still only close to giving Malmö.

 

[WillowBrook]

Wow! crazy game we're playing, isn't it?

I vote for the 200 cav army trick! (well, it will only be a trick if it works) Actually, lets see if 40 or 50 works first. Gotta do something with all that gold.

 

[leif erikson]

Gotta do something with all that gold.

We should figure that we'll need to be able to buy a Cav Army to defeat Japan and Rome, should we ever get on their continent. At 340 Gold, iirc correctly, per Cav, we'll need at least 50. So that means a reserve of 17,000 or so.

Can't we scare them with another type of unit, something cheap to mass produce that we can dispose of when we need to. Like say, MDI?

We could pump out Reg MDI on our mainland. Is it unit count or unit count times number of attack points or......?

BTW - Capt., your idea has some merit. Let's get their capital into a place with no culture and no improvements, destroy their old stuff. Maybe we need to start razing?

 

[bluebox]

As Leif pointed out the gold we've saved would come just perfect for a invasion army for ROM and JPN - and we have to get there somehow.

We're already strong to Rome and Japan. We could get a little bit stronger but I suspect the effect will be thin. OTOH building some MDI's from shields connot hurt.

Remember we're in our GA. Our gold income will half after it's over.

I'd opt for razing and some culture bombs. Gotta go to the Academy for some info about flipping.

There is Lugdunum at the east coast of Rome. It has no culture! WE have a settlement called New Washington there and could found another on the 2-tile penisula N of it.

Jumping the Vikings' capital sounds good but if the PJ fails and the palace jumps to one of the islands, we're doomed.

We could raze all cities with a Viking majority immediately. IIRC the AI notices razings even when they are not executed in the capture process. Will read about that too.

 

[DJMGator13]

Remember we're in our GA. Our gold income will half after it's over.

I'd opt for razing and some culture bombs. Gotta go to the Academy for some info about flipping.

Our GA ended during leif's set, so income is already adjusted. As for the culture bomb just think back to our 100K game when we received very few cities via flips.

Building up some more units is OK, but if we're already strong I'm not sure what effect it would have. But it's worth a shot.

 

[bluebox]

Our GA ended during leif's set, so income is already adjusted.

Ups!

As for the culture bomb just think back to our 100K game when we received very few cities via flips.

Yep, you're right. Following TF advice from the civilopedia, all main factors (overall culture, capitol distance, foreign citizens) count against us.

What about propaganda!? We'd need Espionage and the CIA (would make up for a real American solution ).

I mean when we're still in the same situation in 20 turns, we could try that. Better than nothing.

 

[leif erikson]

What about propaganda!? We'd need Espionage and the CIA (would make up for a real American solution ).

I mean when we're still in the same situation in 20 turns, we could try that. Better than nothing.

OOoooohhhhhhhh!! Espionage, that would be really cool!

Perhaps we should begin researching towards that goal and start a pre-build?

That should be easy to plan out?

What do you think?

EDIT - Including Espionage, we would need 7 techs, a total of 28 turns. We could reduce that by 4 to 8 turns through trades and pointy stick. We have cities that could pump out The CIA in no time through a Palace pre-build.

We have our stash of gold, more or less. We can do Physics in 4 turns and still make 424 GPT, although it would be faster to get it in a peace deal if that is possible, forgot to check.

I guess at this point, what do we have to lose? We can try to spend some shields on a larger MDI force and work towards The CIA, continuing to try and bully a city out of someone. I don't see a down side, but I bet someone can paint one for me.

What do you think?

 

[DJMGator13]

But to get to spies you have to have nationalism and that means rifles. I really hope we don't see too many of those.

 

[leif erikson]

But to get to spies you have to have nationalism and that means rifles. I really hope we don't see too many of those.

I don't want to see them either. However, in 28 turns we could be sitting exactly where we are. :thumbdown :suicide: I think we have to try something new, have something in our pocket to pull out?

I'm not saying we should sit on our hands for 28 turns and see if this works. imho, we *must* continue with what we're doing, just add this as an aside. And the earlier we start, the sooner we will "get there" so we can give it a try.

No? :shakehead

EDIT - And we have faced Rifles before and beaten them, just costs more! We'll need to figure on 20 to 25K in Gold. No problem!

 

[Capt Buttkick]

I think it's too late to start researching.
In 28 turns we need to be in a commanding position against Japan and Rome or we've lost the laurels.

I think I'll try to accomplish all 3 objectives: build up a massive army, jump Viking's capitol and keep the treasury intact (or thereabout). We don't need 17K gold in hand when we get the city on Japan/Rome's island. Even with a 200 cav army, we can pull in around 1000 gpt, that's almost 3 cavs per turn and I think we'll be lucky to get even one city at first...

 

[AlanH]

it seems Xteam has finished their game (I saw one of them reading the end-game spoiler thread)

I hope this was an error, either by them or by you. Please make sure you don't stray

 

[bluebox]

I hope this was an error, either by them or by you. Please make sure you don't stray

It must be my fault I looked at the first post of the spoiler to read the requirements like I do since I started GOTM's in 2003.

 

[AlanH]

Thanks, no problem, I'll reassure them.

A final spoiler's requirements are actually pretty obvious from the title

 

[bluebox]

Thanks, no problem, I'll reassure them.

A final spoiler's requirements are actually pretty obvious from the title

Indeed, I figured that out after having read the requirements.

 

[leif erikson]

Even with a 200 cav army, we can pull in around 1000 gpt, that's almost 3 cavs per turn and I think we'll be lucky to get even one city at first...

This will certainly be true initially. If we are to have any chance at the laurel, we must have the capability to surge a bunch of Cav, quickly, from the cities we take, especially if we are facing Rifles. imho, that means we can't expect to produce an army off of income alone, although I think I understand that is not what you mean to do.

Those cities may require that we rush Barracks as well. Reg. Cavs against Vet Rifles is not a good combination.

Good luck Capt.

 

[WillowBrook]

Once someone will talk, we probably can't get techs in a peace deal, but I checked on the price of physics during my turnset, and it was something like 1200 g. So if we'd research, we'd definitely want to buy at least physics first.

And I disagree that having to research would be failure. Even if we don't get the laurels, I'd love to have a victory that didn't include any air transport of any type. That would enough victory to keep at it.

But I'm fine with Capt trying his strategy for the rest of his turnset; we should discuss the results before hte next one, though.

 

[DJMGator13]

Hey Capt - The VIK palace jump you're talking about is to the ENG mainland right? We don't want it to jump to one of the islands.

We may need to do the gifting thing a bunch.

 

[leif erikson]

And I disagree that having to research would be failure. Even if we don't get the laurels, I'd love to have a victory that didn't include any air transport of any type. That would enough victory to keep at it.

I agree with this. Victory without researching through to the Modern Age would be a good victory, imho.

 

[Capt Buttkick]

Hey Capt - The VIK palace jump you're talking about is to the ENG mainland right? We don't want it to jump to one of the islands.

We may need to do the gifting thing a bunch.

Yes, I thought about jumping it to Newcastle. I'll have to join some English workers to make it happen, but that jump and razing Oslo should put some pressure on them.

 

[Capt Buttkick]

I agree with this. Victory without researching through to the Modern Age would be a good victory, imho.

Ok, should we see what I can do during my turnset first?