Shafted by the RNG?

[anti_strunt]

OK, so I wanted to try out a new civilisation... the Chinese? Well, why not. Qin Shi Huang looked like a good deal with financial and industrious. So I fire up a game on a large terra map...

I notice that I've started with a the sea to my south, and further exploration reveals that I'm alone on a sub-continent with ocean to my south, west, and east, and a huge (at least 7-9 squares thick) jungle to my north, north of which I meet several other civilisations. "So I'll get to develop on my own without being completely isolated, this could be one great start!"

Since my strategy involves making the most of my wonder construction bonus I beeline for bronze working so I can chop all those yummy looking forests.

"Hm. No copper anywhere in sight, I see..." Oh well, I'll just have hook up some iron once I discover it.

Some time later: "Hm. No horses anywhere in sight either, I see..." Oh well, I'll just have to hook up some iron once I discover it...

Well, it's half past time to research iron working and get this resource drought over with... "Hmm, the barbarians are starting to come in ever larger numbers from that huge yonder jungle, and those axemen are proving quite the challenge for my archers. Well, no matter, I'll soon have iron and everything will be fine..."

Oh For Funk's Sake

Long story short: with zero strategic resources I had no counter to the every increasing hordes of barb. axemen stampeding down from the jungle interior. All I could do was fight a loosing battle of attrition in the cities and watch helplessly as all my beautiful towns and cottages were razed... I realised that I would never be able to recover, and quit.

 

[anti_strunt]

"Hey, I was crippled by a crappy starting location, let's try that again..." I think. Qin Shi Huang; large terra. Again I find water to my south... exploring northward, I discover jungle; lots of jungle. To the east I find some more land and then... water. The same holds for the west...

Uh oh.

Hey, no worries! I hold a larger chunk of land, so there's bound to be some resources around! I'll research bronze working for the reasons above and... What? Whaddaya mean there's no copper ANYWHERE?? We've explored half our continent, probably a fifth or fourth of the Old World, how can there be NO copper ANY-DAMN-WHERE?!

Ah well. Animal husbandry. Horse archers own.

Except we have no horses. No, wait! On the northernmost edge of the jungle! HORSES! Prepare for Exodus!

Oops, Victoria got there first. Bummer.

Well, iron working'll get me what I need. Then I can take the horses and rule the world! Muahahaha!!

At least that was the plan. Unfortunately, well... you know.

BUT! there are still catapults! Beautiful no-resource catapults! I'll have nothing to escort them with besides archers, but it'll still be enough to grab those horses, where after things will look up considerably. Or so I tell myself.

With some 13 turns still remaining for "construction" to be discovered, Napoleon shows up from the north with a wandering stack of horse archers. He demands monotheism? What? Forgetting that my "army" is only slightly less fearful than a bunch of bears painted purple; I refuse. Bad idea.

Having lost a city I momentarily left unguarded; ca half my archer force and most of my long-nurtured villages, I realise that my entire empire was about to be conquered - or at least utterly crippled - by three units. I quit in frustration.

 

[anti_strunt]

OK, so that game was mucked up by a poor starting location and stupidity on my part, nothing to do but to go into the breach once more.

Another game as Qin Shi Huang, this time on a standard terra map for whatever reason made sense at the time.

OK, so I've started in the little archipelago region in the south of every terra map.

OK, so I've got jungle just to my north.

OK, so I've got the Incans and the Greeks further to my north and am about to be shut in before I've pushed out my first worker.

OK, so there's no copper around.

OK, so there're no horses around.

OK, so there's no iron around.

OK, so a barbarian just spawned in the single FoW square within reach of my capital.

OK, so I have the chance to spend countless hours to lift my civilisation to, with Herculean efforts, mediocrity.

OK, so I quit.



Does anyone else have similar stories of shafted-ness to share?

 

[Roxtar]

What difficulty were all these at?

 

[Yzen Danek]

There's no reason for barbarian axemen to be affecting your cottages and resources.

Build archers, and move them out into that jungle, ideally on a jungle hill or forested hill. Array them so that no barbarians can pass between them without being passing adjacent to one of your units.

I, never, ever, let barbarians bring the fight to me. I lose more turns of production from the lost mines, and more commerce from the lost growth and cottages then I ever would from building extra archer units and moving them to my frontier. With my archers fortified out there on those forested/jungle hills, the barbarians are nothing but a source of 10 exp per unit


As for jungle squares, some of the biggest, baddest cities ever arise out of huge expanses of jungle. Usually every square under that jungle is grassland and grassland hills.

 

[oagersnap]

Did you get the exact same map every time? If yes, this is a known bug, and maybe it will be fixed in the next patch.

 

[Mahatmajon]

Yzen Danek hit the nail on the head on this one. Hard to be sympathetic of barbarians running over from a jungle with the layout you described in the first post

Barbarian axeman = 5
Fortified archer in jungle = 3 (+50% for jungle, +25% for fortify)
Battle is 1.25 vs 3 -- basically it's just free experience for your archers

If you find a hill or advance your archers vs. melee it's even better

 

[Kilroy]

Here's what you do:

Play as the Aztecs. Beeline to Iron Working. Chop Jaguar, chop Jaguar, chop Jaguar. Find the RNG's capital city and raze it problem solved okay.

 

[El_Machinae]

Isn't the definition of insanity to do something over and over, expecting the outcome to change?

 

[Bain]

you don't get hammers from chopping jungle

 

[anti_strunt]

Yzen Danek hit the nail on the head on this one. Hard to be sympathetic of barbarians running over from a jungle with the layout you described in the first post

Barbarian axeman = 5
Fortified archer in jungle = 3 (+50% for jungle, +25% for fortify)
Battle is 1.25 vs 3 -- basically it's just free experience for your archers

If you find a hill or advance your archers vs. melee it's even better

Which is what I did in my second game; so at least I learnt something from my mistakes.

And no, it wasn't the exact same map every time; although they were eerily similar in general layout...

 

[Nilrim]

Isn't the definition of insanity to do something over and over, expecting the outcome to change?

LOL by the third try I would be so PO'ed that I would hit the world builder and just plop down some copper and or iron on a nice hill within one of my cities working hills.

With that said I do wonder what level he is playing on? Personally I like a Barb city or two, means one or two less setllers I have to make and lots of exp. for my young military. If the barb city is just one pop and has a forrest hill next to it I will run over a couple of units and foritfy right there, upping their forrest defense while the city grows to 3 or 4 or until the darn AI shows up with their insta kill barb unit

Edit added: By the way I have had lots of luck with Qin Shi Huang, some of my highest scores are with him.

 

[Glinka]

And no, it wasn't the exact same map every time; although they were eerily similar in general layout...

I didn't catch which level of difficulty you were playing. The higher the difficulty, the less chance you'll have of finding yourself with plenty of attractive resources. It isn't an exact corrolation, but there's definitely less of what you need as you make the game harder.

 

[madmaven]

you don't get hammers from chopping jungle

You don't?! Son of a...

 

[Bain]

yeah tis a shame, but you kinda have to chop all the jungle down for the grassland + health factor