Share your early space race strategies

[futurehermit]

Hey all,

A few of us have been talking in other threads about how to go about getting early space-race victories.

It would be helpful if you could share how you go about doing it. By "early" I mean sub-1800, but as early as possible of course.

It would be nice if you could state the skill level and game settings you use and then how you go about getting your win. Do you and, if so, when do you war? What are your early, mid, and late tech priorities? How large is your empire at different points of the game? Do you cottage early and often or transition to cottages or never use cottages? Do you have a couple cities building space parts or do you have many cities building them in parallel?

That kind of thing

 

[DaveMcW]

http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/index.php?show=diff&mapSize=Standard&speed=Any&condition=Space+Race

 

[frob2900]

http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/index.php?show=diff&mapSize=Standard&speed=Any&condition=Space+Race

Yeah, those games are impressive, but unfortunately rather "unnatural" when it comes to map choice/opponent choices/number of map regenerations...

Still, interesting reads

 

[budweiser]

I'm not a real expert but, my best was monarch, standard fractal Freddy 1898.

It was me, ragnar and brennus on one continent. I realized early on that ragnar needed to die so I killed him with two sword rushes in between a short war with brennus. Then a longer war with brennus gave me the whole continent by 1200ish.

Then I just built and tried to tech fast, so I dont know the best path. I built a lot of research too. I dont use many cottages, but in this game, I am sure I had some.

One thing I read on here was that computers was the best way to go so I put research labs in place and I built the space elevator first (this helped). I had to use factories and the 3 gorges to get enough production to make those parts fast. It worked though because I was all the way through when everyone else was just starting their casings.

I used my best production cities to make the bigger parts while my less production cities finished their easy parts in line with the bigger parts. And it all barely finished in 1898.

 

[futurehermit]

http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/index.php?show=diff&mapSize=Standard&speed=Any&condition=Space+Race

Am I missing something here, or is the fastest monarch normal speed space race on standard map size in the 1900s? If so, that doesn't do much for me as those are the settings I'm playing right now and I am winning consistently 1875AD +/- 25 yrs.

 

[InvisibleStalke]

Top times are all Epic speed. One in the 1500s looks very impressive. Computers in 1100 AD.

Definitely beeline computers for your late game strategy. But my best time is around 1850 I think - so there must be a lot more than that. I haven't played a game where I decided at the outset that I was going for early space win though.

 

[uberfish]

Well the players on monarch HOF are playing Inca, presumably rerolling until they get a very good start and quechua rushing to steal enemy capitals early. Not really my thing.

1700-1800 is a challenging target that's attainable on monarch under regular conditions (see the CE comparison thread)

 

[svv]

Here's a bit of advice re the Space Race, though not necessarily for an "early one."

I like the "all at once" approach. That means having enough good production cities to build 1 part in each (13?) all at the same time. The best-hammer city the highest-hammer part, second-best on the second-most hammers, etc.

Get Robotics for the space elevator early. It's nice of have a great engineer to help build this. Then get the tech you need for apollo mission, and build it in a very high-hammer city as it's a tough build and you can't use a great engineer. Then get the other techs for spaceship parts while those are building.

When getting ready for this early, and running a cottage economy, keep this in mind. When in Universal Sufferage, each cottage developed into a town generates one hammer. So, you SHOULD be in Universal sufferage when you start building, as this will greatly increase the production of your cottage/commerce towns, turning them also into production towns.

Also, if you've saved a couple of great people for a golden age, you can increase this one hammer per town to two.

Similarly, a farm on a plains square will generate 1 hammer - two with the golden age.

So, that means that, other things being equal, early on you should put cottages on grassland squares, and farms on plains squares. That way, if you have one of each in US and golden age, you'll generate 4 hammers on those two squares (2 on each), whereas if you farmed the grassland and cottaged the plains, you'd only get 3 (3 on the plains, and none on the grassland).

 

[Morgrad]

Save up at least 4 GP - scientist/artist (easy grabs from a GP farm) and two engineers.

Don't build the Space Elevator. You either have to build it in a massive production city (which could crank out the parts you need in the same amount of time), or have it take so long to build that there wasn't any point in building it.

Beeline Computers, build labs everywhere while tech for your other parts, crank out cheap parts (casings/thrusters) wherever it's easy to do so (i.e. don't do it with a high production city when you still have long-build parts to go, unless you're going to have to tech to the big part in enough time to build it anyway).

Beeline for the Space Elevator, use both GEs to build it immediately (or nearly so), then MM your builds so the longest-to-build part is in the highest hammer city, the second-longest in the second-highest, etc. If you don't have 2 GEs, it *might* make a 3-4 turn difference in your win, but that's about it, and a maybe. Whoop-de-doo.

Once you have the techs for your last part, Golden-Age and win.

During this whole time (until you have *every* tech you need), any city not building spaceship parts builds research. MM your slider/research builds to cut a turn off a spaceship tech wherever possible.

 

[InvisibleStalke]

Just one comment on the last point. Its more efficient to build wealth and raise your science slider (thereby getting the multipliers in your best cities) than to build research directly - at least until you are running at 100% science already.

 

[InvisibleStalke]

I am going to try my next game for fastest space win on Monarch (at least fastest for me - I will be ecstatic with a sub 1800's win).

My preferred leader for this is Hannibal. Reasoning:

- Financial for early and late game research.
- Extra happiness at start means more cottages
- Charismatic warring for land gaining.
- UB increases trade which will be a big part of the strategy since extra trade = extra research. (Wang Kon was my other considered leader here)
- Desired wonders - temple of artemis and great lighthouse.
- Tech path - aim at taking economics from liberalism. If this doesn't look possible then nationalism to aim at democracy. Run free market as much as possible.

Goal is to reach around 12 good big cities, with at least two major production centers, a GP farm and 9 commerce cities - aim to get an academy in several of them with a couple of lightbulbs for liberalism.

Fight wars against two opponents max leaving four for tech trading. Wars to be fought in stages - aim at quick brutal wars when I have a tech edge. Let the AIs develop cities for me.

 

[lilnev]

I don't think you have to decide on space race from the start -- just expand and grab land as normal. You probably do want to start growing your cities and cultivating cottages before Liberalism, however. I generally run a hybrid that leans CE -- one or two cities will run scientists off libraries early for the Philosophy lightbulb and academy in the capital. If I get the GL (happens less often now that I'm playing large maps on immortal), I'll have a few more GSs for Ed and PP. Liberalism generally claims Nationalism, then get PP and Democracy for Emancipation (generally adopt Free Religion and Emancipation right away, with Free Speech, US, and Free Market eventually). Trade for the lower branch of the tech tree and head for Astronomy (overseas trade routes and observatories), Assembly Line (factories and coal plants) and Railroads, then either Rocketry or Computers -- I'm still unsure if there's a general rule on which comes first. Unless I've got a spare GE, I don't usually bother with the Space Elevator -- it's certainly not needed. Fusion, then Genetics, then Ecology last. Subject to trading opportunities, of course. Overall, your finish time should be research-limited rather than hammer-limited, finishing ~5 turns after Ecology.

A key point is to conclude your war(s) in a timely manner -- typically you should have your last opponent fairly beat down with maces + trebs, or possibly grenadiers. But any later than that, you need your cities on infrastructure builds instead of troops (except for the HE city, which should be enough to keep your defences credible), and anything you capture won't come online fast enough to help.

peace,
lilnev

 

[DrSpike]

You are better off looking at old gotm games than the HoF imo - there just aren't very many good games there for standard settings.

For standard monarch games with a randomly generated map 1850 is a good target. Sub 1800 requires really good land - dig out the map from the Mansa Musa gotm where you start with 2 gold mines for a good example.

 

[volfan37132]

Lets say you are planning on launching between 1800-1950.

What year or tech tree advance are you going to stop building
acadamies and just lightbulb with scientists?

Say you do divide your cities with 9 to science /wealth
2 to production and one to gp factory and defeat two
neighbors. How many acadamies would you expect to
have related to the above question?

Would you start a war to acquire nearby coal, oil or aluminum
if you do not own it yourself?

 

[pigswill]

Irs perhaps more likely that you would have one academy for a commerce based capital, lightbulb other GS for standard liberalism beeline then build academies after that.

 

[DaveMcW]

A lightbulb gives around 2000 beakers in a large empire. A super specialist in Oxford University gives 20 beakers. So while there are more than 100 turns left, you should settle them.

Of course you can always build academies if they give more than 20 beakers/turn too.

 

[futurehermit]

Hey Dave, thks for the tip. What year does "100 turns left" correspond to for monarch/standard/normal speed? thks!

 

[Morgrad]

Just one comment on the last point. Its more efficient to build wealth and raise your science slider (thereby getting the multipliers in your best cities) than to build research directly - at least until you are running at 100% science already.

This is 100000% true. With a grand CE and the decision made for space race, I usually find myself running 80-90% science as I'm entering the race with a reasonable pile of money saved up - for rushing needed buildings and running research at a deficit.

I'll often bump the slider up to 100% and see that I'm 3 turns from finishing a tech, but just a teeny bit more science will make it two turns - that's when I slap a couple cities on research to make my deficit research give a faster benefit. Hit the tech, then back off it a bit if my gold supply says I have to.

If I have tons and tons of gold for whatever reason, I'll run in a huge deficit for as long as I can - though I often find it's better to spike up your power rating with massive unit upgrades to prevent the AI from DoW (or be able to repel them if they do).

So, point well taken - build research if you're at 100% science, otherwise build wealth and bump the slider.

 

[DaveMcW]

It's actually more efficient to build extra spaceship parts than Wealth. Once you complete all the required parts, the extra parts are converted to gold.

 

[InvisibleStalke]

It's actually more efficient to build extra spaceship parts than Wealth. Once you complete all the required parts, the extra parts are converted to gold.

How does this work? Are hammers from lost production converted at a higher rate than just building wealth? You get production multipliers on building wealth too.

Anyway building wealth lets you raise your science rate now - building parts and juggling queues might let you do it in the future.