RobO
King
Well, SirJethro, you don't have to build it all every time. In fact, the intention is that you should not be able to do that. Besides, Parks do just what you're suggesting.
SirJethro's DyP II - "The Emperor's New Mod"
- Thread starter SirJethro
- Start date
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
Guys...I'm confused about how to transport Air Cavalry. They cannot be transported on boats, and don't have the option to rebase at an airfield. I have four Air Cavs that I upgraded from Cavalry on a small island, and now I can't get them off. 
pdescobar
Moo, baby. Moo.
Hmm. They're supposed to be able to rebase according to the SS.... but they don't have that option in the BIC. Looks like you got yourself a bug there SJ 
I can confess, I did actually build some in my last game but I've never actually used any; my test games have been decided well before the modern age.
============
EDIT: OK, I thankfully kept the zip of saves I sent to Isak from my Beta 05 test and just loaded up a late one. There *is* a workaround for this, but it's screwy.
1) Isolate a coastal city from the trade network and/or cut off your oil. This will take transports out of the build queue and allow you to build clippers. (Transports can't carry them)
2) Build some clippers (Clippers *can* carry them)
3) Park a clipper just off the coast of your continent with the air cavs.
4) Bring over your air cavalry and drive them off the coast onto the clipper (they can't load normally).
Now, you are transporting helicopters on a clipper. Try to watch the ropes and sails when you take off
I can confess, I did actually build some in my last game but I've never actually used any; my test games have been decided well before the modern age.============
EDIT: OK, I thankfully kept the zip of saves I sent to Isak from my Beta 05 test and just loaded up a late one. There *is* a workaround for this, but it's screwy.
1) Isolate a coastal city from the trade network and/or cut off your oil. This will take transports out of the build queue and allow you to build clippers. (Transports can't carry them)
2) Build some clippers (Clippers *can* carry them)
3) Park a clipper just off the coast of your continent with the air cavs.
4) Bring over your air cavalry and drive them off the coast onto the clipper (they can't load normally).
Now, you are transporting helicopters on a clipper. Try to watch the ropes and sails when you take off
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
Originally posted by pdescobar
Hmm. They're supposed to be able to rebase according to the SS.... but they don't have that option in the BIC. Looks like you got yourself a bug there SJ
I figured it had to be a bug....I tried everything. BTW...modern warfare rocks! I LOVE TRUCKS! I had to actually use them to appreciate them, but the combination of marines and trucks made my tanks completely worthless prior to modern armor (they just couldn't keep up). And I definately love the Air Cavalry. I never used choppers in Civ3/PTW. It was the perfect upgrade for cavalry.
I noticed that I can put 3 tanks on an air transport. Is that intentional? It didn't seem to fit with the description. Makes sense though...you can fit a few tanks on a C130, right? Come to think of it, I think you can transport a few attack copters by Air Transport.
Anyway...I'm dragging through the final death throws of my Huge map Emperor win. I dragged it out a hundred years or so so that I could toy with the modern warfare toys. It isn't really a fair fight though, since the leading AI Civ hasn't discovered Mass Production yet and I'm blitzing them with Modern Armor, Air Cavalry and Marines. I'll post the save if anyone wants to take a look for giggles.
One interesting thing to look at in this game is the horrible shape the Zulu lands are in that I've just captured. Long even before I attacked them they just let their empire go to pot with polution and didn't seem to be able to manage cleaning it up. It's too bad for them...they were kicking it early in the game and stole most of the good wonders, but the polution caught up with them and cut their production in half in some cities. Interesting.
Here's a save.
pdescobar
Moo, baby. Moo.
Well, I found a workaround for the air cavs for now. I put it in as an edit to save some thread space, but we cross-posted so now I'm making another post anyway to be sure you see the edit 
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
Originally posted by pdescobar
Well, I found a workaround for the air cavs for now. I put it in as an edit to save some thread space, but we cross-posted so now I'm making another post anyway to be sure you see the edit
Yeah, I saw it. Thanks for the tip...we're definitely going to have to keep this in mind for this SG.
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
Since there's no word from Cromagnon or the DyP team for a got-it, and I'm done with my SP game, I'll get it now and post it later this evening.
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
Man, what am I up to now, Sir Jethro VII?
Inherited Turn....First thing I notice is that Polynesia has furs available. I'm going to lock those up: Trade Social Contract and 1gpt to Poly for Furs, WM and 533 gp (I gave the 1gpt in exchange for more cash than they would have normally offered...the gpt makes the fur deal renewable...I prefer to get a popup on luxury trades to make sure we don't lose it to another Civ).
Trade Social Contract (now that it is compromised) to China for WM and 375gp. Trade Cav Tactics to China for 912gp and 46gpt.
Trade Cav Tactics to Siam for 15gpt.
I change Constitutionalism to Federalism. We need as much corruption fighting power as possible, and we aren't going to be at war for a while (btw, the Civlopedia is not correct...we get 2 units free per town/city/metro....so that will help a lot).
Change production in the following cities:
Bear Butte: Shrine rushed for 150gp
Cottonton: Tollhouse rushted for 110gp
Wounded Knee: Taxman rushed for 20gp
Silvertusk: Harbor to Tollhouse
SirJethro Stables: Basilla to Marketplace
Goldmember: Temple>Library
Iron Mountain: MM to allow use of Iron (not using our namesake tile!!!)
Leo's: Forge>Tollhouse
Jungle Island>Rush shrine for 30gp
North Big Island: Temple to Port
Land 'o Plenty: Forge to Library (this city isn't going to have even 4shp until we can plant).
Rottnest: Rush Temple for 170gp
Issachia: Rush Shrine for 150gp
Wheat Thins: Naval Base to Temple and rush for 305
Goldron: Harbor rush for 75gp
Salusa Secundus: Rush Monument for 110g
Crank research up to 60%...Federalism in 3 turns at +11 gain per turn.
OT: Wow, China has a lot of boats. Renegotiate ROPs with Ethiopia (I give 1gpt), Incas (even), Polynesia (they give 2gp), Siam (even)
Quokkaton: Pike>Monestary
Bear Butte: Shrine>Tollhouse
Cottonton: Tollhouse>Library
Wounded Knee: Taxman>Shrine
Kal-el: Pikeman>Bank
Tuskany: Pike>Academy
Jungle Isle: Shrine>Tollhouse
NBI: Port>Tollhouse
Rottnest: Temple>Tollhouse
Issachia: Shrine>Courthouse
Wheat Thins: Temple>Courthouse
Goldron: Harbor>Courthouse
Salusa Secondus: Monument>Harbor
1505: mostly moving Pikes around.
OT: We stop sending Dyes to Polynesia. I wanted to try increasing it from 5gpt and got the "never would accept" shaft. Let them wear white.
Sugar Bay: Temple>Windmill
1510: send Clipper full of Pikes out. Last turn before Federalism...I'm going to overthrow the gov't in the offturn.
OT: We discover Federalism and descend into anarchy. Advisor says it will take around 3 turns.
1515: I sell Federalism to China for 450g, 72gpt and WM. China is sitting on a boatload of tech. He needs to trade!! By the way, China is disdainful of our culture.
Trade Gold and Dyes to Siam for 70g and 14gpt.
Trade Incense to Ethiopia for 12g and 6gpt.
OT: We learn Naval Tactics.
1520: Anarchy sucks....but we are netting 212gpt.
OT: Babylon wants to renew the Cotton deal for 5gpt. I'll take it.
1525: Anarchin' round the clock.....
OT: Babylon wants to renew the 26gpt Horses deal. I'm going to cancel it for 2 reasons: (1) we don't want them to have horses, and (2) it frees up gold for him to buy techs from China.
HA....we get to pick a government. Federal Republic it is.
1530....I'm setting research to 0 for now and am going to focus on infrastructure while the tech race catches up to us. Hmmm...I can put the FP in Silvertusk vs. in 14 turns vs. 33 in Foghorn Leghorn. I'm going to at least start banking these shields in Silvertusk and leave it to the next leader to decide. I change Silvertusk to Cathedral (21 turns).
I rush the following: Library in Land o' Plenty (140g), Library in Goldmember (140g), Library in Cottonton (190g), Temple in IOB (235g), Tollhouses in Leo's and NBI (90g & 170g), Courthouse in Goldron & Issachia (395g each), Harbor in Desperado (100g), Harbor in Salusa Secondus (145g), Tollhouse in Jungle Island and Rottnest (170g each), Harbor in SirJethro Farms (40g), Shrine in Wounded Knee (195g), Harbor in Salt Petersburg. After all of that, we still have 11,156g and are pulling 541gpt. I upped lux to 30% to compensate for loss of MP.
OT: Tibet and Polynesia sign a peace treaty.
Here's our new production (you can see what was produced above):
Cottonton: Bazaar
Wounded Knee: Courthouse
LoPlenty: Bazaar
Goldmember: Windmill
Tuskany: Monastery
Iron Mountain: Bank
Golden Blubber: Clipper
IOB: Tollhouse
Leo's: Temple
Jungle Isle: Library
NBI: Bazaar
SJ Farms: Tollhouse
Rottnest: Forge
Issachia: Temple
Goldron: Taxman
Desperado: Worker
Salt Petersburg: Monument
Secundus: Taxman
1535: notta
OT: Quokkaton: Monastery>Dragoon
My people love me, they put a second floor on the West Wing.
1540: petty empire administration
OT: Inca and Tibet have signed peace agreement. Chinese are building Clausewitz's. Yuck....I would hate to lose that one. I investigate Hangchow where it is being built. The city pulls 21spt and is set to complete in 57 turns. They have high growth in this city, but all grassland, so prob won't improve the number of turns much. BTW...China prefers Theocracy. That really has to hurt them in research rate...(they are at 50% science, 50% tax).
1545: I change Kal-el to a Palace (20 turns). Maybe we can snag Clausewitz's.
OT: We learn Music Theory. hmph.
Golden Blubber: Clipper>Clipper
1550: I change Quokkaton to JS Bach's (27 turns).
Feel free to start researching if you want. Once China makes peace with Polynesia, hopefully it will pick up. The cash is great for rushing. Ultimately if we build right, we'll overtake them on cash and production.
Here is the save.
Inherited Turn....First thing I notice is that Polynesia has furs available. I'm going to lock those up: Trade Social Contract and 1gpt to Poly for Furs, WM and 533 gp (I gave the 1gpt in exchange for more cash than they would have normally offered...the gpt makes the fur deal renewable...I prefer to get a popup on luxury trades to make sure we don't lose it to another Civ).
Trade Social Contract (now that it is compromised) to China for WM and 375gp. Trade Cav Tactics to China for 912gp and 46gpt.
Trade Cav Tactics to Siam for 15gpt.
I change Constitutionalism to Federalism. We need as much corruption fighting power as possible, and we aren't going to be at war for a while (btw, the Civlopedia is not correct...we get 2 units free per town/city/metro....so that will help a lot).
Change production in the following cities:
Bear Butte: Shrine rushed for 150gp
Cottonton: Tollhouse rushted for 110gp
Wounded Knee: Taxman rushed for 20gp
Silvertusk: Harbor to Tollhouse
SirJethro Stables: Basilla to Marketplace
Goldmember: Temple>Library
Iron Mountain: MM to allow use of Iron (not using our namesake tile!!!)
Leo's: Forge>Tollhouse
Jungle Island>Rush shrine for 30gp
North Big Island: Temple to Port
Land 'o Plenty: Forge to Library (this city isn't going to have even 4shp until we can plant).
Rottnest: Rush Temple for 170gp
Issachia: Rush Shrine for 150gp
Wheat Thins: Naval Base to Temple and rush for 305
Goldron: Harbor rush for 75gp
Salusa Secundus: Rush Monument for 110g
Crank research up to 60%...Federalism in 3 turns at +11 gain per turn.
OT: Wow, China has a lot of boats. Renegotiate ROPs with Ethiopia (I give 1gpt), Incas (even), Polynesia (they give 2gp), Siam (even)
Quokkaton: Pike>Monestary
Bear Butte: Shrine>Tollhouse
Cottonton: Tollhouse>Library
Wounded Knee: Taxman>Shrine
Kal-el: Pikeman>Bank
Tuskany: Pike>Academy
Jungle Isle: Shrine>Tollhouse
NBI: Port>Tollhouse
Rottnest: Temple>Tollhouse
Issachia: Shrine>Courthouse
Wheat Thins: Temple>Courthouse
Goldron: Harbor>Courthouse
Salusa Secondus: Monument>Harbor
1505: mostly moving Pikes around.
OT: We stop sending Dyes to Polynesia. I wanted to try increasing it from 5gpt and got the "never would accept" shaft. Let them wear white.
Sugar Bay: Temple>Windmill
1510: send Clipper full of Pikes out. Last turn before Federalism...I'm going to overthrow the gov't in the offturn.
OT: We discover Federalism and descend into anarchy. Advisor says it will take around 3 turns.
1515: I sell Federalism to China for 450g, 72gpt and WM. China is sitting on a boatload of tech. He needs to trade!! By the way, China is disdainful of our culture.
Trade Gold and Dyes to Siam for 70g and 14gpt.
Trade Incense to Ethiopia for 12g and 6gpt.
OT: We learn Naval Tactics.
1520: Anarchy sucks....but we are netting 212gpt.
OT: Babylon wants to renew the Cotton deal for 5gpt. I'll take it.
1525: Anarchin' round the clock.....
OT: Babylon wants to renew the 26gpt Horses deal. I'm going to cancel it for 2 reasons: (1) we don't want them to have horses, and (2) it frees up gold for him to buy techs from China.
HA....we get to pick a government. Federal Republic it is.
1530....I'm setting research to 0 for now and am going to focus on infrastructure while the tech race catches up to us. Hmmm...I can put the FP in Silvertusk vs. in 14 turns vs. 33 in Foghorn Leghorn. I'm going to at least start banking these shields in Silvertusk and leave it to the next leader to decide. I change Silvertusk to Cathedral (21 turns).
I rush the following: Library in Land o' Plenty (140g), Library in Goldmember (140g), Library in Cottonton (190g), Temple in IOB (235g), Tollhouses in Leo's and NBI (90g & 170g), Courthouse in Goldron & Issachia (395g each), Harbor in Desperado (100g), Harbor in Salusa Secondus (145g), Tollhouse in Jungle Island and Rottnest (170g each), Harbor in SirJethro Farms (40g), Shrine in Wounded Knee (195g), Harbor in Salt Petersburg. After all of that, we still have 11,156g and are pulling 541gpt. I upped lux to 30% to compensate for loss of MP.
OT: Tibet and Polynesia sign a peace treaty.
Here's our new production (you can see what was produced above):
Cottonton: Bazaar
Wounded Knee: Courthouse
LoPlenty: Bazaar
Goldmember: Windmill
Tuskany: Monastery
Iron Mountain: Bank
Golden Blubber: Clipper
IOB: Tollhouse
Leo's: Temple
Jungle Isle: Library
NBI: Bazaar
SJ Farms: Tollhouse
Rottnest: Forge
Issachia: Temple
Goldron: Taxman
Desperado: Worker
Salt Petersburg: Monument
Secundus: Taxman
1535: notta
OT: Quokkaton: Monastery>Dragoon
My people love me, they put a second floor on the West Wing.
1540: petty empire administration
OT: Inca and Tibet have signed peace agreement. Chinese are building Clausewitz's. Yuck....I would hate to lose that one. I investigate Hangchow where it is being built. The city pulls 21spt and is set to complete in 57 turns. They have high growth in this city, but all grassland, so prob won't improve the number of turns much. BTW...China prefers Theocracy. That really has to hurt them in research rate...(they are at 50% science, 50% tax).
1545: I change Kal-el to a Palace (20 turns). Maybe we can snag Clausewitz's.
OT: We learn Music Theory. hmph.
Golden Blubber: Clipper>Clipper
1550: I change Quokkaton to JS Bach's (27 turns).
Feel free to start researching if you want. Once China makes peace with Polynesia, hopefully it will pick up. The cash is great for rushing. Ultimately if we build right, we'll overtake them on cash and production.
Here is the save.
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
Guys...if you are bored and looking for no greater challenge, take a look at this diety starting position. I'm starting a Diety game as America and this is the start I rang up (obviously, I restarted)...this is friggin impossible.
I'm posting the savegame for posterity.
Here is the savegame.
I'm posting the savegame for posterity.
Here is the savegame.
What is up with the Map Generator and Jungle?
I was thinking of starting a Deity game for beta 5 also. I've just had a 4 day break due to illness and feel fresh and wanting to kick some a$$. I have played a few Emperor games to the definite win stage. I'm leaning towards a large or huge game to make sure I get to the Modern Age and have some modern warfare.
I was thinking of starting a Deity game for beta 5 also. I've just had a 4 day break due to illness and feel fresh and wanting to kick some a$$. I have played a few Emperor games to the definite win stage. I'm leaning towards a large or huge game to make sure I get to the Modern Age and have some modern warfare.
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
Quokka...if you are interested in playing from the same start and comparing progress as we go along here is my start.
It is standard map with the Americans. There are no barbarians, so no goody huts, but I guess that's just as well in a Diety game, since the percentages are so much lower.
Man things move crazy fast here. I don't think you'll have to worry about getting to Modern Age.
Here is the 4000bc autosave.
It is standard map with the Americans. There are no barbarians, so no goody huts, but I guess that's just as well in a Diety game, since the percentages are so much lower.
Man things move crazy fast here. I don't think you'll have to worry about getting to Modern Age.
Here is the 4000bc autosave.
Looking good. I turn down the lux rate to 20%, but that only increases our gpt from 528 to 621, and I figure the WLTKD's are worth more.
I want the Supreme Court (free courthouse in every city), so I set that as the target, and increase science to 20%, bringing our gpt to 289. We are ahead of everyone by 2-5 techs, except China, who has Econ, Flintlock, Grand War, and Newtonian Synthesis (all monopolied).
MM a few workers here and there, and income is now 305gpt. 13000 in the bank.
Rush worker in Desperado for 35.
Rush Tollhouse in IOB for 110.
IBT: Incan alliance vs Ethiopia denied. The Chinese take the Polynesian City of Nahkon Ratchisma, relieving some cultural pressure on Wheat Thins.
[1] 1555AD: IOB tollhouse -> aqueduct.
Desperado worker -> worker.
Elephants near Oyster Bay go extinct, but a new herd arises a few tiles away; too bad we can't work that tile.
Monument in Saltpetersburg rushed for 130.
I send some clippers and frigates out to explore the world.
[2] 1560AD: SJ Stables Marketplace -> Academy.
Saltpetersburg monument -> taxman.
Rush Desperado worker for 45.
[3] 1565AD: Tuskany Monastery -> University.
Golden Blubber Clipper -> Monastery.
Desperado worker -> Wiseguy.
Lots of worker action and fog-busting.
IBT: Tibet & Polynesia sign on against Ethiopia.
We get Newtonian Synthsesis from Encyclopedia.
[4] 1570AD: SJ Stables Academy -> Monastery.
Dyed Pretty Bank -> University.
Polynesia gets Newtonian Synthesis for WM & 455.
IBT: Siam starts JS Bach's.
[5] 1575AD: Iron Mountain bank -> Hardy colonist.
Rush Bear Butte tollhouse for 100.
Rush Salusa Secundus Taxman for 10.
Rush Desperado Wiseguy for 15.
Rush Saltpetersburg Taxman for 35.
Rush Jungle Island Library for 80.
IBT: China and Polynesia sign peace.
[6] 1580AD: Bear Butte Tollhouse -> Temple.
Sugarbay -> Town Clock.
Jungle Island Library -> Aqueduct.
Desperado Wiseman -> Taxman.
Saltpetersburg and Salusa Secundus Taxman -> Wiseman.
Rush SJ Farms Tollhouse for 65.
Somehow China got Music Theory in the IBT, even though the price didn't drop.
IBT: Chinese are building JS Bach's.
[7] 1585AD: We learn Constitutionalism, Modern Legal System in 9. Economics comes in from Encyclopedia.
Goldmember windmill -> Town Clock.
Golden Blubber Monastery -> National Gallery (+50% research, one happy face).
SJ Farms tollhouse -> Temple.
Rottnest forge -> Aqueduct.
Goldron taxman -> Wiseman
Rush Salusa Secundus and Saltpetersburg Wiseman for 20 each.
China won't give either Flintlock or Grand War for Constitutionalism without something to lube his palm.
IBT:
China's luxury deal is up for renewal, which I do, minus iron and tea!
[8] 1590AD: East Port Forge -> Temple.
SP and SS Wisemen -> Tollhouses.
Cavalry Tactics to Siam for 14+4gpt.
Tea goes back to China for 10 gpt.
IBT: Tibet & Siam sign peace.
[9] 1595AD: Iron Mountain Hardy Colonist -> Monastery.
Colonist heads for the spot between LoP and Cottonton, which workers are laboriously clearing of jungle.
Naval Tactics for 85 + WM to Siam. No one else has anything worthwhile. I hope these wars smolder out soon.
Rush Goldron Wiseman for 15.
Rush Desperado Taxman for 35.
Rush North Big Island for 80.
Rush Dyed Ugly windmill for 125.
[10] 1600AD: Dyed Ugly Windmill -> Temple.
SJ Stables Monastery -> University.
North Big Island Bazaar -> Aqueduct.
Goldron Wiseman -> Temple.
Desperado Taxman -> Temple
No more sea fog!
No trades that are even minimally acceptable are possible. China is up Flintlock and Grand War, we are up Constitutionalism, which sells for 420+60gpt (no haggling) to China.
Espionage:
Hangchow will build Clausowitz's in 46.
Nanjing will build JS Bach's in 12, and has an International Port.
Beijing will Build Smith's in 4 turns.
They are no longer in Golden Age.
Unfortunately, it looks like we'll lose both Smith's and JS Bach's, as the best Kal-el can manage is in 13, starving. Quokkaton is due in 17 for JS Bach's. I recommend using these as pre-builds for Clausowitz. Unfortunately, we can't pre-build for Supreme Court, as we don't have District Courthouses (need 3, one of which is in the same city as SC). Perhaps it's worth switching Quokkaton to National Gallery.
Final note: The Colonist is on auto-move to the selected city spot. Feel free to change, but there are four wasted tiles in the area.
Here is the save
And a screenie:
I want the Supreme Court (free courthouse in every city), so I set that as the target, and increase science to 20%, bringing our gpt to 289. We are ahead of everyone by 2-5 techs, except China, who has Econ, Flintlock, Grand War, and Newtonian Synthesis (all monopolied).
MM a few workers here and there, and income is now 305gpt. 13000 in the bank.
Rush worker in Desperado for 35.
Rush Tollhouse in IOB for 110.
IBT: Incan alliance vs Ethiopia denied. The Chinese take the Polynesian City of Nahkon Ratchisma, relieving some cultural pressure on Wheat Thins.
[1] 1555AD: IOB tollhouse -> aqueduct.
Desperado worker -> worker.
Elephants near Oyster Bay go extinct, but a new herd arises a few tiles away; too bad we can't work that tile.
Monument in Saltpetersburg rushed for 130.
I send some clippers and frigates out to explore the world.
[2] 1560AD: SJ Stables Marketplace -> Academy.
Saltpetersburg monument -> taxman.
Rush Desperado worker for 45.
[3] 1565AD: Tuskany Monastery -> University.
Golden Blubber Clipper -> Monastery.
Desperado worker -> Wiseguy.
Lots of worker action and fog-busting.
IBT: Tibet & Polynesia sign on against Ethiopia.
We get Newtonian Synthsesis from Encyclopedia.
[4] 1570AD: SJ Stables Academy -> Monastery.
Dyed Pretty Bank -> University.
Polynesia gets Newtonian Synthesis for WM & 455.
IBT: Siam starts JS Bach's.
[5] 1575AD: Iron Mountain bank -> Hardy colonist.
Rush Bear Butte tollhouse for 100.
Rush Salusa Secundus Taxman for 10.
Rush Desperado Wiseguy for 15.
Rush Saltpetersburg Taxman for 35.
Rush Jungle Island Library for 80.
IBT: China and Polynesia sign peace.
[6] 1580AD: Bear Butte Tollhouse -> Temple.
Sugarbay -> Town Clock.
Jungle Island Library -> Aqueduct.
Desperado Wiseman -> Taxman.
Saltpetersburg and Salusa Secundus Taxman -> Wiseman.
Rush SJ Farms Tollhouse for 65.
Somehow China got Music Theory in the IBT, even though the price didn't drop.
IBT: Chinese are building JS Bach's.
[7] 1585AD: We learn Constitutionalism, Modern Legal System in 9. Economics comes in from Encyclopedia.
Goldmember windmill -> Town Clock.
Golden Blubber Monastery -> National Gallery (+50% research, one happy face).
SJ Farms tollhouse -> Temple.
Rottnest forge -> Aqueduct.
Goldron taxman -> Wiseman
Rush Salusa Secundus and Saltpetersburg Wiseman for 20 each.
China won't give either Flintlock or Grand War for Constitutionalism without something to lube his palm.
IBT:
China's luxury deal is up for renewal, which I do, minus iron and tea![8] 1590AD: East Port Forge -> Temple.
SP and SS Wisemen -> Tollhouses.
Cavalry Tactics to Siam for 14+4gpt.
Tea goes back to China for 10 gpt.
IBT: Tibet & Siam sign peace.
[9] 1595AD: Iron Mountain Hardy Colonist -> Monastery.
Colonist heads for the spot between LoP and Cottonton, which workers are laboriously clearing of jungle.
Naval Tactics for 85 + WM to Siam. No one else has anything worthwhile. I hope these wars smolder out soon.
Rush Goldron Wiseman for 15.
Rush Desperado Taxman for 35.
Rush North Big Island for 80.
Rush Dyed Ugly windmill for 125.
[10] 1600AD: Dyed Ugly Windmill -> Temple.
SJ Stables Monastery -> University.
North Big Island Bazaar -> Aqueduct.
Goldron Wiseman -> Temple.
Desperado Taxman -> Temple
No more sea fog!
No trades that are even minimally acceptable are possible. China is up Flintlock and Grand War, we are up Constitutionalism, which sells for 420+60gpt (no haggling) to China.
Espionage:
Hangchow will build Clausowitz's in 46.
Nanjing will build JS Bach's in 12, and has an International Port.
Beijing will Build Smith's in 4 turns.
They are no longer in Golden Age.Unfortunately, it looks like we'll lose both Smith's and JS Bach's, as the best Kal-el can manage is in 13, starving. Quokkaton is due in 17 for JS Bach's. I recommend using these as pre-builds for Clausowitz. Unfortunately, we can't pre-build for Supreme Court, as we don't have District Courthouses (need 3, one of which is in the same city as SC). Perhaps it's worth switching Quokkaton to National Gallery.
Final note: The Colonist is on auto-move to the selected city spot. Feel free to change, but there are four wasted tiles in the area.
Here is the save
And a screenie:
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
Kalel.....Isak....pdescobar....Quokka....Sultan?....Beuller....Beuller...Beuller....
who's next?
who's next?
pdescobar
Moo, baby. Moo.
I'm almost certain this is incorrect. It's just 3 overall, the wonder-building city doesn't need one itself. Of course, they do require fresh water, so I don't know if you can get 3 anyway given the terrain (at least what you started with.)
PS: SJ, the link to the ridiculous diety jungle start save game is screwy
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
pdescobar is correct. I think the Civlopedia states that the city must have district courthouse, but I can confirm from my build 5 game that it isn't necessary. There is the district courthouse minimum though.
I got it
Sir Jethro, how far did you get in the game? I tried a couple of Deity games with Korea tonight and was so far behind I gave up. In the first effort the Romans built their 8th city where I was going to build my 2nd. They also had another city that was in my first ring, but their 8th took the Wheat I needed.
In the second I got a second city but lost first ring city sites to the Arabs, Indians and Ethiopians. This was after I made sure I got Flood Plains and a decent start. The Arabs were on the other side, 18 tiles, of the continent and I hadn't even found the Indian or Ethiopian borders yet and I had 3 scouts out. The Indians and Ethiopians marched Clans straight through the Germans and Celts and set-up camp on my doorstep.
It was nuts. The rate caps play havoc with trying to amass money to buy techs. I haven't had my arse handed to me twice within 2 hours ever. I'm going to have to have a rethink before I fire up DyP Deity again.
Sir Jethro, how far did you get in the game? I tried a couple of Deity games with Korea tonight and was so far behind I gave up. In the first effort the Romans built their 8th city where I was going to build my 2nd. They also had another city that was in my first ring, but their 8th took the Wheat I needed.
In the second I got a second city but lost first ring city sites to the Arabs, Indians and Ethiopians. This was after I made sure I got Flood Plains and a decent start. The Arabs were on the other side, 18 tiles, of the continent and I hadn't even found the Indian or Ethiopian borders yet and I had 3 scouts out. The Indians and Ethiopians marched Clans straight through the Germans and Celts and set-up camp on my doorstep.
It was nuts. The rate caps play havoc with trying to amass money to buy techs. I haven't had my arse handed to me twice within 2 hours ever. I'm going to have to have a rethink before I fire up DyP Deity again.
SirJethro
Paterfamilias
It was too stressful so I quit. I came within one turn of getting the Great Library and lost it. All hope seemed to vanish. I actaully had quite a few cities, though. More than I expected. It is a decent map. I may restart on the same map and try to adjust some of the poor decisions I made early on. You just can't play a diety game like just any other. It is brutal.
I was playing pretty carefully. The problem is the cost of Clans. If you go for a Flood Plain start then shields are low, so I ended up at size 6 before the Clan would build, if I went for a normal start it took forever for the Pop to grow to get a Clan out. I need to analyse what sort of start is best for DyP.
The Deity bonus is magnified on DyP because you can't use superior tile development to overcome the cost advantage.
In the not too distant future, I wouldn't mind trying what you suggested about playing the same start and comparing at set stages. Just let me work out how to start properly. These are the changes I made to my BIX to fix some errors.
Changes to BIX for Units: (known bugs)
Removed Starts Golden Age from Samurai
Removed Starts Golden Age from Eastern Pikemen
Added Starts Golden Age to Kensai
Added Starts Golden Age to Outrigger
Removed Transport Only Foot Units from Transport.
Added Transport Only Foot Units to Clipper. Stated intent of Kal-el in game thread on CFC. This game
Added Re-base ability to Air Cavalry
Fixed Swordsmen Upgrade path
Changed Hardy Colonist population cost from 3 to 2
Changes to BIX for Wonders and Improvements: (to reflect the spreadsheet)
Added Doubles Research Output to Bells Lab
Added Industrious and Commercial traits to the Slave Trade Wonders. Only Rome had it previously
Removed +1 Ship Movement from East India Company
Changed Wiseman cost to 2
The Deity bonus is magnified on DyP because you can't use superior tile development to overcome the cost advantage.
In the not too distant future, I wouldn't mind trying what you suggested about playing the same start and comparing at set stages. Just let me work out how to start properly. These are the changes I made to my BIX to fix some errors.
Changes to BIX for Units: (known bugs)
Removed Starts Golden Age from Samurai
Removed Starts Golden Age from Eastern Pikemen
Added Starts Golden Age to Kensai
Added Starts Golden Age to Outrigger
Removed Transport Only Foot Units from Transport.
Added Transport Only Foot Units to Clipper. Stated intent of Kal-el in game thread on CFC. This game
Added Re-base ability to Air Cavalry
Fixed Swordsmen Upgrade path
Changed Hardy Colonist population cost from 3 to 2
Changes to BIX for Wonders and Improvements: (to reflect the spreadsheet)
Added Doubles Research Output to Bells Lab
Added Industrious and Commercial traits to the Slave Trade Wonders. Only Rome had it previously
Removed +1 Ship Movement from East India Company
Changed Wiseman cost to 2
Bamspeedy
CheeseBob
Lurker comments- Unless these things have changed in the latest patch (I'm using 1.05x), then this is what I feel about quick early expansion in DyP:
The best start for DyP, most of the time would be an expansionists civ (starts with farming, so you can use some bonus food resources right away), and get corn or something at your start. England (starting with wheel) could then start on domestication to reveal pigs and cattle for even a better start (but that tech might be awfully expensive on deity), or research pottery to get a granary going.
In chiefdom, plains are better than grassland, but pigs and cattle (which appear on plains), doesn't show up until domestication.
Because of the tile penalty in chiefdom, floodplains are only good for commerce (higher population). In Civ3, you could irrigate them for excess food, which ends up netting more production. But in DyP, floodplains only give you just enough food to feed another citizen, no more (while in cheifdom). Working floodplains in DyP, is like working a non-bonus grassland tile that can't be mined in Civ3. If you got wheat or oasis on floodplains, though, that may be good if there is more good producing tiles around. (but wheat also requires farming).
Expansionists, with bonus resources, plains, and having a game or fruit on forest (for extra production without losing much food) I think would be the best.
The deity bonus is also magnified because the AI (non-commercial civs) will often join some (or all) of their 3 starting workers into the capital, since they have nothing to do (if there are no forests/jungle to clear).
The best start for DyP, most of the time would be an expansionists civ (starts with farming, so you can use some bonus food resources right away), and get corn or something at your start. England (starting with wheel) could then start on domestication to reveal pigs and cattle for even a better start (but that tech might be awfully expensive on deity), or research pottery to get a granary going.
In chiefdom, plains are better than grassland, but pigs and cattle (which appear on plains), doesn't show up until domestication.
Because of the tile penalty in chiefdom, floodplains are only good for commerce (higher population). In Civ3, you could irrigate them for excess food, which ends up netting more production. But in DyP, floodplains only give you just enough food to feed another citizen, no more (while in cheifdom). Working floodplains in DyP, is like working a non-bonus grassland tile that can't be mined in Civ3. If you got wheat or oasis on floodplains, though, that may be good if there is more good producing tiles around. (but wheat also requires farming).
Expansionists, with bonus resources, plains, and having a game or fruit on forest (for extra production without losing much food) I think would be the best.
The deity bonus is also magnified because the AI (non-commercial civs) will often join some (or all) of their 3 starting workers into the capital, since they have nothing to do (if there are no forests/jungle to clear).
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