Skaven development thread

[Stormrage]

You might see in that thread that I already asked for that one with warpstone in mind Mebbe a little editing? A longer tail perhaps?

 

[mrtn]

That could work as a giant rat, I suppose (assuming it looks good as a civ unit too, and not only as a gif).

 

[LMR]

I presume it would look good as a flic, and i agree the tail would need to be lengthened.

i've also included more stuff on the first post: military and scientific leaders, cities and buildings.

if you have any more to add, or i've missed them when reading through the pages, post them again please

 

[mrtn]

I looked at the first post, and it seems to me that there are too many units there. Where would you fit them all in the tech tree?
Nightrunner and Assassin
Plague Monk and Plague Censer bearer
for example.
I'd add Grey Seer Thanquol as a GL, btw.

 

[LMR]

Added Thanquol as GL, although I had him as the leader "representative of the council". now we have both

Nightrunner no tech, upgrades to Gutterrunner

Gutterrunner (Military Training) upgrades to Assassin

Assassin (Assassination)

Rat Swarm (Domestication) upgrades to Giant Rat

Giant Rat (Creature Control)

Clanrat (Warrior Code)

Stormvermin (Steel)

Poison Wind Globadier (Ballistics) upgrades to Warpfire Thrower?

Warpfire Thrower (Feudalism)

Ratling Gun (Adv. Siegecraft) upgrades to Jezzail Team?

Jezzail Team (Gunpowder)

Plague Priest (Religion) upgrades to Plague Censer Bearer

Plague Censer Bearer (Nature Lore)

Rat Ogre (Awakening)

Vermin Lord (Domination)

Warplighting Cannon (Metallurgy)

Doom Wheel (Invention) upgrades to Rat Tank

Rat Tank (Steam Power)

Grey Seer (Magic) upgrades to Master Seer

Master Seer (High Magic)

Warplock Engineer removed from units. Instead could be a Skaven-only specialist that increases science output.

Screaming Bell removed from units. Instead could be a Skaven-only improvement that lowers corruption.

Whaddaya think?

IMO, if you wanted to keep only one of the nightrunner/assassin, you would have to keep the assassin, since they are the best out of the three in my proposed upgrade chain.

i put the plague censer bearer in as an upgrade to the plague priest

 

[mrtn]

I don't think that there should be any guns before Gunpowder. So I don't know if there is room for two gunpowder units, apart from the cannon.

What is a Master Seer? I haven't heard about them. In Mordheim you (can) play a group from Clan Eshin, and there you can have a Eshin Sorcerer, so I propose make it Sorcerer =>Grey Seer instead.

I think I would put the Rat Ogre at the same tech (and stats) as the troll.
I think that one plague guy is enough too, but then I haven't really thought about stats yet.
I'd put the Poison Wind Globadier and the Warpfire Thrower much later.

 

[LMR]

I just made the Master Seer up. i was reading about the pitfighting and there are Master Moulders in that. i'm happy with sorcerer, or perhaps just the Grey Seer, like how the Lizardmen only have the Slann Mage-Priest.

I guess the plague priest would be alright by itself. and without the plague censer bearer at Nature Lore, the Rat Ogre can move there with 11/5/1 with +2 HP, but it should be cheaper than 110 shields if it requires warpstone.

how about this: skaven-only tech "Skaven Ingenuity" that allows Ratling Guns and Gunpowder is a prerequisite for it. since Adv. Siegecraft would be free, Warpfire thrower can move to Adv. siegecraft and the PWG can move from ballistics to feudalism.

do you like the idea for the warlock engineers and screaming bells?

 

[mrtn]

I just made the Master Seer up. i was reading about the pitfighting and there are Master Moulders in that. i'm happy with sorcerer, or perhaps just the Grey Seer, like how the Lizardmen only have the Slann Mage-Priest.

But the Mage-Priest is their UU...

I guess the plague priest would be alright by itself. and without the plague censer bearer at Nature Lore, the Rat Ogre can move there with 11/5/1 with +2 HP, but it should be cheaper than 110 shields if it requires warpstone.

I'm not sure it should require Warpstone. I think it would be better to put game-play above realism for the Skaven, and only let some of the units require warpstone.
It's not as if the Chaos Troll requires it.

how about this: skaven-only tech "Skaven Ingenuity" that allows Ratling Guns and Gunpowder is a prerequisite for it. since Adv. Siegecraft would be free, Warpfire thrower can move to Adv. siegecraft and the PWG can move from ballistics to feudalism.

PWGs should definitely come after the first era IMO, but I'm not sure when they fit best. Maybe at Invention, if we see them as an alternative to the Crossbowmen.

do you like the idea for the warlock engineers and screaming bells?

I'm in favour of trimming the unit list, so yes.
One idea is to make the Warplock Engineer give 3 or 4 beakers, but cause one unhappy face.

 

[LMR]

But the Mage-Priest is their UU...

Aren't all their units UUs?

I'm not sure it should require Warpstone. I think it would be better to put game-play above realism for the Skaven, and only let some of the units require warpstone.
It's not as if the Chaos Troll requires it.

I agree. Let there be many a Rat Ogre whacking the **** outta stuff!

PWGs should definitely come after the first era IMO, but I'm not sure when they fit best. Maybe at Invention, if we see them as an alternative to the Crossbowmen.

Doomwheel is already at Invention. perhaps put the PWG at Alchemy or Engineering?

I'm in favour of trimming the unit list, so yes.
One idea is to make the Warplock Engineer give 3 or 4 beakers, but cause one unhappy face.

Would you cause unhappiness by making the luxuries option minus 1?

 

[mrtn]

Aren't all their units UUs?

UU as in causing the GA.

Doomwheel is already at Invention. perhaps put the PWG at Alchemy or Engineering?

There is room for two units at Invention.

Would you cause unhappiness by making the luxuries option minus 1?

I suppose so, haven't tried yet, but I know it's possible.

 

[Gibsie]

Warlocks are the Skaven's weaker magic users, it should go Warlock > Grey Seer...

 

[LMR]

UU as in causing the GA.

I realised this as soon as i posted

There is room for two units at Invention.

Okay. have them both at invention

Gibsie has a point. Perhaps it should go Warlock > Grey Seer

 

[LMR]

On a completely different topic, what do you think Skaven music would sound like? I wanna make some for one of my games...

 

[mrtn]

Bad?

Maybe some Pestilens religious music? Brassy gongs and high-voiced whiny choir? Maybe some glockenspiel if they get really adventurous?

 

[LMR]

Occasional squeaks of rats, roars of rat ogres, clicking chains...

 

[fe3333au]

incorporating the sound of the sewer ... and the agony of plague and corruption.

It would certainly be chaotic, with sharp atonal and discortant fenzies and flurries which spike and burst above the plateau of an unending and ever tremor of cancerous despair.

Think Japanese Butoh which is minimalist and percussion, wierd strings droning and shrieks) and the loud discordant trills of the bagpipes ... and the underlying menace of a didgeridoo ... and, and also add the shiek of an animal (preferably cat and other domestic loved pet) being tortured with very hot needles, as the chorus

OT ... been following your process for a while Lizardman good one and good luck

 

[Quinzy]

so something by Pink Floyd then...?

 

[fe3333au]

Mix of Captain Beefheart and Einsturzinge Neu Bauten (sp?)

 

[mrtn]

so something by Pink Floyd then...?

Einsturzinge Neu Bauten

If you guys keep dissing my favourite bands you'll end up on my ignore list.

It's Einstürzende Neubauten, BTW, "collapsing new buildings".

Eh, whatever did that have to do with skaven?

 

[Quinzy]

steady on mrtn, Pink Floyd is one of my favourite bands too, and the Wall is one of my favourite films
i love their psycho-depressant music.