Discussion in 'Team CivFanatics' started by YossarianLives, Jul 4, 2012.
Hi Maga, glad to see you on the forum right now. Here are the Espy numbers from this turn:
Thanks. Which one of the EP numbers is "their EP"?
Turn 114 Spaniards' production
Sorry, their EP spending wasn't included in that screenshot. I had to log into the game to get that. Here it is. Their's is the first number (RB has 96, Spaniards have 47, CP have 0)
Thanks, Yossa To avoid confusion, I updated production number in the post above.
Good job. Can we get RB's numbers too? We are looking for big numbers built for TGLib or Scwedagon.
Uff, they have too many cities But you are right, they are definitely building a wonder at FocalPoint, possibly also at HorseFeathers:
Realms Beyond production, turn 114:
Focal Point 330
Horse Feathers 115
Eastern Dealers 24
Great job Yossa and Maga
We must do the same the next turn and count possible tiles around those 2 suspicious cities, so we know if they are building anything with resource. This must be Schwedagon.
Awesome work Maga, thanks!
These are the costs for the units the Spaniards could building.
Archer: 25 (unlikely they have Archery)
So, KwaD is probably on a cat. If those other cities go over 35 we can assume they're building cats too. If they reset soon, they probably finished chariot / axe / impi.
T115 Espy numbers.
I haven't logged on to make sure that the spending ratio hasn't changed, but seeing as how none of these teams have spent any espy against us in the last 50+ turns, I think it's safe to assume their spending remains the same as the screenshot I posted earlier
If we want accurate results, best confirm "their EP" for turn 115
Well, its been awhile since we went through the score increases to determine what all the teams have been up to. Im still keeping track of this on the spreadsheet, though, so heres a big update from the last dozen turns. Ill go from lowest score to highest score.
Spaniards (T103 Score 209-->231 Score T116)
The Spaniards started this period off with a score of 212 on T104. Since then, they havent been up to too much, besides ruining their economy and any chance to do well in this game by attacking us. They havent had a single turn with a score increase of more than 7 points. They havent planted any new cities, researched any new technologies, or built any wonders. If they get a Great Person, we would know, since we can see all five of their cities. They have performed three whips in the past dozen turns, 2-pop whips on T107, T108, and T111. These were probably all for cats. As 2metra has pointed out, their economy is at a point where they cant support any more whips, and can probably barely support any more troops. Their power started leveling off on the same turn they retreated, and hasnt spiked since.
It seems like WPC has made the strategic decision to hold off on further aggression against the Germans, at least for now. The biggest evidence of this is that they are gifting us some of their highly-promoted archers. Also, they seem to be focusing on their own expansion. They settled City 7 on T105, City 8 on T108, and City 9 on T111. Other than this, they havent been doing too much that we can see in the score. No Classical era techs have been completed. Its possible they finished Ancient techs on T104 and T108, but more likely these score increases (9 points each turn) were just a combination of land + pop.
The Germans chances of doing well in this game were really hurt by that early WPC DOW, but theyre doing a little better at staging a come-back than their attackers. On T105, they got an 11-point increase that may have included an Ancient tech (also included land from City 7 and probably some pop points). They settled City 9 on T109, and City 10 on T112. Their only whips in the past dozen turns came on T112, (a 2-pop and a 3-pop whip). On T114 they got a 6-point increase that could have been an Ancient tech, and on T115 they got a 13-point increase that may have included a Classical tech. However, they also should have gotten land points on T115 for their City 7, so unless that city only added 1 or 2 land tiles, then this T115 score increase could not include a Classical tech. Throughout the past dozen turns, they have gotten pretty consistent small pop increases.
Heres where we take our first big leap from the bottom-tier to the middle-tier teams. You can start to see the snowball effect, since the much larger UCiv was able to make much greater gains in score than the smaller teams. This is only going to get more pronounced as we reach the higher scores. Anyways, back to business. UCiv settled two new cities on T104, #12 and #13. They got a 9-point increase on T106 that could have included an Ancient tech, but more likely was just pop + land. On T108 they performed three whips, one for 3-pop and the other two for 1-pop. On T109 they got a huge 19-point increase that probably included a Classical tech. On T110 they got another big 16-point increase, so maybe this was a Classical tech? Hopefully they werent both techs. They have enough cities that the pop increases alone could account for much of this score (16 points for 6 pop growths). They also performed 4 (!) whips this turn, three for 2-pop and one for 1-pop. This is when we were starting to get really worried that they were preparing an invasion against us. On T112 they got a 13-point increase that I think included a Classical tech, plus 1 land point for City 9. T113 came with another big 14-point increase, maybe a tech, but probably just pop + land. They performed a 1-pop whip this turn. T114 came with a huge 26-point increase. Part of this was land for settling City 10, part of it must have been for pop increases, and the rest was most likely from a tech. Depending on how many land and pop points they got, this could be an Ancient tech (6), Classical (12), or even Medieval (18). On T115 they whipped 1 pop. And just now on T116 they got another bigger score increase of 13 points, probably for pop + land.
CP started this period strong with a 25-point increase on T104. This was the turn they finished Theology, a Medieval tech for 18 points. The remaining 7 points were for 3 pop. They then performed 4 whips (!), three for 1-pop and one for 2-pop. Their team has been sprinkling these 1-pop whips all over the place, made efficient by their cheap Sacrificial Alters, which we saw they have in most of their cities. They planted City 8 on T106. They performed a 1-pop whip on T107, then three more 1-pop whips on T108. T108 also saw a 17-point increase. Maybe this is when they completed HBR for 12 points? On T109 they got a big 19-point increase. Part of this was land points for City 7, and the rest was either a bunch of pop growths recovering from all those whips, or else some combo of pop + tech. They did three more 1-pop whips on T110. On T111 they got 28 points. 16 were for completing the Apostolic Palace. The other 12, maybe another Medieval tech? They did another 1-pop whip this turn. T113 saw a 1-pop whip. T114 had a 19-point increase, followed by 1-pop and 2-pop whips. On T115, they got a 13-point increase, followed again by 1-pop and 2-pop whips. And finally, just now on T116, they have already performed another 1-pop whip. This team relies heavily on slavery, and are making the most of that Aztec UB.
Poly has Alpha, so we know all the techs they have (thats the bad side about researching it, they get to see everyone elses techs, but everyone else gets to see their techs, too). So, we know that they have every Ancient tech except Archery, of the Classical techs they have Alphabet, Code of Laws, Maths and Monarchy, and of Medieval techs they have Civil Service and Philosophy. They bulbed Philosophy on T106 with a Great Scientist that was born that same turn. Remember how MZprox was asking 2metra how all these teams could possibly have settled all these cities, since their own maintenance costs were supposedly killing them? Well, they settled City 9 on T108, City 10 on T112, City 11 on T113, and City 12 on T114. So, I guess they solved their own problem! Revolting to Bureaucracy and OR on T113 helped, Im sure. Theyve whipped away about a dozen pop in this time period, but Im not going to detail them turn-by-turn. These were mostly of the very efficient 3-pop variety. Just now on T116, they got a big 21-point increase, so Ill be looking to see if the tech screen shows a new tech that theyve researched.
CivFr has been doing very well this game. I really hope they start talking to us soon, since they could be a great team to have on our side. I will say, though, that their land score is inflated since they are CRE, so theyre really not that far ahead of us. On T104 they had a 13-point increase, not sure if this included a tech or if it was just pop + land. On T106 they completed the MoM. 1-pop whipped on T107. On T110, they got a huge 24-point increase, which included land points from their city 7. This probably also includes a Classical tech. On T113 they completed the Temple of Artemis, and also settled their City 10. This turn still includes 17 points that are not accounted for, so maybe another Classical tech? T115 saw another huge 27-point increase. Part of this was from their city 7 popping borders, but I am not sure where to attribute the rest of the points. And just now on T116 they got a 10-point increase, which includes land points from their city 8, as well as probably a few pop increases.
So, while the bottom three teams went up 20-50 points during this period, RB has skyrocketed up over 200 points over the same turns. Ill go over their score increases turn-by-turn, but I have to admit that Im at a loss for where these points are all coming from. They got 15 points on T104, followed by a 1-pop whip. On T105 they completed The Great Wall for 16 points, but they also got another 34 points for a total of a 50-point increase this turn! They then performed a 2-pop whip. On T106 they got 38 points. On T107 they got a relatively measly 11 points, then performed a 2-pop whip. On T108 they got 17 points, and then settled their City 13. On T109 they got another 17 points, then performed 2-pop and 3-pop whips. On T110 they got 26 points. On T111, they got 28 points, then settled City 14, then did a pair of 2-pop whips. On T112 they got 9 points and did a 2-pop whip. On T114 they got 4 points for 2 pop, then did a 2-pop whip so this turn they actually didnt get a score increase! On T114 they got 25 points. On T115 they got 19 points, and then performed 3-pop and 2-pop whips. And on T116, they got 14 points. So, I need the teams help to try to figure out what they could be doing to get all these points. Here is how to earn points: 2.43 per pop increase, 0.7 per land tile (counted after the land tile has been in a teams possession for 20 turns), 6 x Era for each tech (Ancient=6, Classical=12, Medieval=18, etc), and 16 points for each Wonder, but we get a pop-up whenever a Wonder is built so they couldnt have any hidden wonders giving them all these increases. What do you guys think? 2metra has been doing a great job of taking pictures of their revealed lands on each turn, so if I even get the time I guess I could go back and track their pop increases from each turn. Any volunteers for this?
Highligths: RB is building a wonder in FocalPoint, but (currently) not in Horse Feathers. Spaniards are chopping (?) in Nobamba.
Realms Beyond production, turn 115 (turn 114 in parentheses):
A1 40 (32)
MM 50 (44)
Focal Point 368 (330)
Horse Feathers 0 (115)
Gourmet 12 (0)
7Tribes 52 (45)
ForbiddenF 10 (0)
Eastern Dealers 0 (24)
BbB 40 (30)
Starfall 0 (57)
Turn 115 Spaniards' production (turn 114 in parentheses):
Ulundi 77 (63)
Umgu 28 (21)
Nobamba 63 (22)
Bula 38 (25)
KwaDukuza 50 (40)
Great summary report, Yossarian, on different team score increases and fascinating commentary! Could you also add same analysis for our score? I do not follow the game closely and I am not good at score-reading, I have no idea how RB gets such huge score increases.
CFC Summary since T104
Capture Abhi with 4 pop = 10
Settle Hansa = 2
Sailing complete = 6
Growth in Indira, Mantra, Daiva, Lakshmi = 10
Growth in Lana, Raj, Astan = 8
3-pop whip Lakshmi = -5
Archery complete = 6
1-pop whip Mantra, Daiva and Astan = -8
Land from T88 Terasvin 2nd border pop = 3
Growth in Mantra, Daiva, Lana and Astan = 10
2-pop whip Lana = -5
1-pop whip Raj = - 3
Growth in Lakshmi, Astan and Lokapara = 8
Construction complete = 12
Growth in Indira, Raj and Hansa = 7
2-pop whip Terasvin = -5
Ran out of time here. Might do the rest later, but you get the picture
Great, thanks! I just meant general info, how many points we gained during the same period and brief comment.
Great job as always, Yossa. And absolutely awesome summaries for those who dont keep close look at the game and still want to get the feeling. Keep up the good job.
They might be using switching production and whips with max overflow to actually build a wonder there. I am suspecting they might be up to TGLH or The Colossus there. Which will be too bad if they manage to get any of those. We must observe and see if there is a Forge in Horse Feathers or if there is a Lighthouse. Or maybe those ~120 hammers was the forge built there?
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