So this is what I hate about the tile acquisition governor

[Smokeybear]

Click on link for screenshot:

stupid governor pet tricks pic

So the tile-selection governor has already selected one utterly worthless desert tile on the upper right, and is about to pick another one on the upper left. Note the sweet river/hill tile on the far right, under my cursor... that is the one I would want it to pick, and the one it should have automatically picked LONG before it even considered those crappy useless desert shingles. Especially since I have 'production' selected for tile management, and I'm trying to build wonders here, fer Set's sake! Of course the tile picker is too stupid to know that and take common sense into consideration, hence the pink hex in the screenie.

So, what- is being 'flat' the only requirement for a tile to beat out a perfect, wonderful, incredibly productive hill tile for consideration? That has to be the case, since it sure isn't picking them because they're covered in food or gold or anything actually useful. #$!%& devs. It's enough to drive one more insane than one already is.

 

[dopingman]

Yeh, tile acquisition governor is a dick.

Gov: You have no drop of oil in your boundaries and next to this cities cultural borders are 3 sources you say? How about a desert tile with zero yield, yes yes? And the next tile will be desert too!

^ This did actually happen to me once, the city was a puppet and I didn't want to annex it just to buy the tiles. I had to conquer 2 civs to get 12 oil and all the time that a*shole didn't get those 3 tiles (50+ turns or sth). Lesson learned: Annex the city, buy the tiles yourself if they don't produce the disered results. Did that promplety in the next game and *taddaaa* 17 oil worked in 8 turns for the price of an additional city.

 

[JJOne]

It is known that flat tiles will always be prefered to hill tiles. If you want it so badly, buy it. Or in this case buy the desert tile so the next tile chosen will be your hill tile, and you don't get to upset Hiawatha. About oil - it must have been an earlier version, lately the ressource tiles seem to be prefered.

 

[Smokeybear]

It is known that flat tiles will always be prefered to hill tiles.

If that is the case, and the actual quality/content of the tiles isn't even taken into consideration as part of the equation, then that is one of the stupidest, laziest, most incomprehensible dev choices that was ever made in history. Way to not go intelligently.

 

[joncnunn]

I find G&K expansion much better than vanilla.

But cultural expansion for the 3rd ring tile that's not a straight line prefers acquiring both connecting tiles first and not just one.

But there's no real need for the cultural expansion to be perfect; it it were there'd be no need for cash purchasing tiles to be an option.

 

[dopingman]

About oil - it must have been an earlier version, lately the ressource tiles seem to be prefered.

It was not, I finished that match like 5 days ago. Even in my most recent match I finished today the gov preferred to pick up plain tiles instead of luxes. I eventually buy those tiles with , but it is annoying as hell.

 

[Smokeybear]

But there's no real need for the cultural expansion to be perfect;

No. I'd be willing to settle for just not sucking eggs completely.

 

[Smokeybear]

I eventually buy those tiles with , but it is annoying as hell.

Yes yes yes, that! Definitely that. That in spades. Did I mention I totally freakin' agree with that? Instead of using any logic whatsoever, it's like ol' Govie just deliberately makes the most awful, incomprehensible choices repeatedly with the distinct intention of driving you nuts till you are forced to waste gold that you shouldn't have had to.

 

[CivCube]

Does it really matter if you have enough cultural output to collect a tile in 6-10 turns? I always thought it was just the RNG anyway.

 

[Smokeybear]

I always thought it was just the RNG anyway.

Nah. It's been proven to be a commie plot.

 

[Matthew.]

When I first began playing Civ5 I would just let my borders expand naturally. The more I play, the less patience I have and now I probably purchase around 5 tiles per city on average. So about 20-30 tiles per game. America's UA has increased in value since I first started playing

 

[Cilpot]

If that is the case, and the actual quality/content of the tiles isn't even taken into consideration as part of the equation, then that is one of the stupidest, laziest, most incomprehensible dev choices that was ever made in history. Way to not go intelligently.

It is taken into account as long as it's two competing flat tiles. I think the way CiV expands borders makes sense as borders in real life tend to naturally draw along rivers and mountains/hills.

 

[Jelster]

Why buy a piece of sea with no resources in sight rather than the lux or food on the tile just outside the city ? That just doesn't make sense.

However, I have had the AI stretch a couple of tiles in 1 direction to reach cows, or wheat in the past, so I think it just varies per game.

 

[ohioastronomy]

This Civ series has always emphasized player choice. You get to pick where your cities go; what your cities build; technologies you research; religions; policies. This particular idea - forcing players to pay to work around the AI - simply doesn't fit with the rest of the series. It was driven by purely aesthetic considerations, and as mentioned above it badly distorts city building.

I would very much prefer to have one of two options:

1) There is a default that you can override from the start;
2) There is a technology that you can research that gives you such an override.

Paying to choose an intelligent tile is roughly like having to pay cash to produce a soldier instead of a building, or having to pay cash to research the tech you want instead of the one picked by the AI.

 

[Smokeybear]

This Civ series has always emphasized player choice. You get to pick where your cities go; what your cities build; technologies you research; religions; policies. This particular idea - forcing players to pay to work around the [butt-stupid -ed.] AI - simply doesn't fit with the rest of the series. It was driven by purely aesthetic considerations, and as mentioned above it badly distorts city building.

I would very much prefer to have one of two options:

1) There is a default that you can override from the start; [adjustable tile-selection governors, praise be! -ed.]
2) There is a technology that you can research that gives you such an override.

Paying to choose an intelligent tile is roughly like having to pay cash to produce a soldier instead of a building, or having to pay cash to research the tech you want instead of the one picked by the AI.

On behalf of intelligent, thinking CiV players everywhere, I approve of this post.

 

[number51]

This Civ series has always emphasized player choice. You get to pick where your cities go; what your cities build; technologies you research; religions; policies. This particular idea - forcing players to pay to work around the AI - simply doesn't fit with the rest of the series. It was driven by purely aesthetic considerations, and as mentioned above it badly distorts city building.

I would very much prefer to have one of two options:

1) There is a default that you can override from the start;
2) There is a technology that you can research that gives you such an override.

Paying to choose an intelligent tile is roughly like having to pay cash to produce a soldier instead of a building, or having to pay cash to research the tech you want instead of the one picked by the AI.

Yup to this. There is enough randomness with maps and opponent civs. We should be able to expand cities without the "help" of an RNG or the AI love of flatness, and shouldn't have to go broke doing it right.

Thanks for the thread Smokeybear.

 

[CrispyCritter]

Yup to this. There is enough randomness with maps and opponent civs. We should be able to expand cities without the "help" of an RNG or the AI love of flatness, and shouldn't have to go broke doing it right.

Do we really need yet another edge over the AI? (I'm assuming that the AI cities are expanding using the identical algorithm as we get expanded.) We already do better than the AI at buying tiles.

 

[Optional]

This screen you may like as well; I was convinced the game would select the deer-forest next, but it opted for bland plains tiles instead:

2 , 1 or 1 , 1 ? Perhaps the governor didn't like the deer-forest because the base terrain was tundra? Or maybe it's indeed the tile not being flat. It can be that the idea behind this is a sense of realism; flat terrain being more easy to cultivate than rough terrain, so therefore more expensive to acquire.

 

[Smokeybear]

Or maybe it's indeed the tile not being flat. It can be that the idea behind this is a sense of realism; flat terrain being more easy to cultivate than rough terrain, so therefore more expensive to acquire.

That gets back to the old argument about how cities expand. Yes, farmers will always take the flat ground with either grass or plains, because unless you're one of those freak civs, they prefer it for cultivation. But growing cities do not live and prosper by farms alone, and that is where the governator fails. It does not take into account that the city often already has far more farms than it needs or can utilize, and is in desperate need of other resources like deer, lumber, mines, and all the rest that occur on non-'flat' tiles. I fail to see any realism in an automated city expansion system that ignores that reality. City managers since the first cities existed, were not that dumb. "Oh my, we desperately need lumber and iron and meat and furs! Uh, all of you go out and plow more farms, and hurry!"

 

[King_Course]

Click on link for screenshot:

stupid governor pet tricks pic

So the tile-selection governor has already selected one utterly worthless desert tile on the upper right, and is about to pick another one on the upper left. Note the sweet river/hill tile on the far right, under my cursor... that is the one I would want it to pick, and the one it should have automatically picked LONG before it even considered those crappy useless desert shingles. Especially since I have 'production' selected for tile management, and I'm trying to build wonders here, fer Set's sake! Of course the tile picker is too stupid to know that and take common sense into consideration, hence the pink hex in the screenie.

So, what- is being 'flat' the only requirement for a tile to beat out a perfect, wonderful, incredibly productive hill tile for consideration? That has to be the case, since it sure isn't picking them because they're covered in food or gold or anything actually useful. #$!%& devs. It's enough to drive one more insane than one already is.

I can't really understand why anyone would let himself get so emotional over such a minor detail. In a computergame. And you have 6k gold even lol.