Software Piracy

[Frewfrux]

Okay. I need to know, where are these people that are making 5 dollars a day, yet need a personal computer in their home to do their jobs?

I mean, we can talk about it in theory all day...

I NEVER said anything about $5/day. I have no idea where people make $5/day. Did I say something about this and not realize it?

 

[Efexeye]

I NEVER said anything about $5/day. I have no idea where people make $5/day. Did I say something about this and not realize it?

No, you didn't. So forget the 5 dollars a day.

Where are these people that HAVE to have a personal computer, in their homes, for work, yet are too poor to buy games for it? I don't understand!

 

[Control Group]

It sounds cold to say it, but I agree. Why do I have to subsidize some poor shmuck in China who wants to play the game? He should pay the same price as I do.

It is not up to US companies to make things "fair".

And this, Efexeye, you and I are in 100% agreement on.

Things aren't fair. Stuff happens, and it's the same stuff that flows downhill. Bad things happen to good people.

But I'd best be careful, my libertarianism is showing.

 

[Siggy19]

Okay. I need to know, where are these people that are making 5 dollars a day, yet need a personal computer in their home to do their jobs?

I mean, we can talk about it in theory all day...

Hey chatting in theory is fun !

The example I was thinking of was software engineers in India, where I suspect they get something like 10% what they would get in America. And that is why I used the example of selling the game for $5.

Having a decent computer would be reasonable for them, but also having limited wonga for buying games with.

 

[Frewfrux]

Where are these people that HAVE to have a personal computer, in their homes, for work, yet are too poor to buy games for it? I don't understand!

Here in North America. I'm talking about my specific situation (which I am sure is not unique).

My work can only be done on a computer. I live below the poverty line. I can not afford computer games. My computer is esential for my living because it is how I bring in money for me and my wife.

I'm talking about myself and using my situation as an example that the statement about owning a computer and, therefore, being rich is not true and subjective.

 

[Efexeye]

Hey chatting in theory is fun !

The example I was thinking of was software engineers in India, where I suspect they get something like 10% what they would get in America. And that is why I used the example of selling the game for $5.

Having a decent computer would be reasonable for them, but also having limited wonga for buying games with.

Well, I hate to prove you wrong, but my company outsources some of our code development to India, and, while being less expensive than it is here, it is certainly not 90% cheaper! Along the same lines...how are these people affording computers on which to do this software development in the first place, anyway? Besides that, how did they afford to go to college to get trained in software development? See the point I'm making here?

As an aside, my boss will be back in the office soon, so I may not be posting any more or as much. I will check back later, though (I always check the boards before I fire up cIV!)- I think this thread is a great example of a rational, reasonable debate- something sorely missing from most messgage boards.

 

[Siggy19]

But I'd best be careful, my libertarianism is showing.

Are Libertarians member of the Liberal fringe of the Arian Nation ?

Funnily enough, Liberals and Libertarians generally have the same policies, but expect different people to pay for them.

 

[Efexeye]

Here in North America. I'm talking about my specific situation (which I am sure is not unique).

My work can only be done on a computer. I live below the poverty line. I can not afford computer games. My computer is esential for my living because it is how I bring in money for me and my wife.

I'm talking about myself and using my situation as an example that the statement about owning a computer and, therefore, being rich is not true and subjective.

Okay, so, for you, the GAME is the luxury. Can't afford? Don't buy!

EXACTLY what you did!

Side note: What kind of work do you do, where a computer is absolutely necessary? You don't have to answer if it's too personal, I'm just curious.

 

[Frewfrux]

And this, Efexeye, you and I are in 100% agreement on.

Things aren't fair. Stuff happens, and it's the same stuff that flows downhill. Bad things happen to good people.

But I'd best be careful, my libertarianism is showing.

You're both right, life isn't fair. But it is a good idea for those who have been given more through our life situation to give to those for whom life has been least fair.

Do you not agree?

 

[Siggy19]

Well, I hate to prove you wrong, but my company outsources some of our code development to India, and, while being less expensive than it is here, it is certainly not 90% cheaper! Along the same lines...how are these people affording computers on which to do this software development in the first place, anyway?

What's the point of talking out of my ass if I am not full of...

As an aside, my boss will be back in the office soon, so I may not be posting any more or as much. I will check back later, though (I always check the boards before I fire up cIV!)- I think this thread is a great example of a rational, reasonable debate- something sorely missing form most messgage boards.

Dag-blasted bosses.

 

[Efexeye]

You're both right, life isn't fair. But it is a good idea for those who have been given more through our life situation to give to those for whom life has been least fair.

Do you not agree?

No, I absolutely do not. I haven't been "given" anything. I have worked for everything I possess.

That's why I don't give money to beggars. Sure, I feel sorry for them, but it's a matter of principle.

In theory, I agree with your statement. In practice, however- it doesn't work.

 

[Frewfrux]

Okay, so, for you, the GAME is the luxury. Can't afford? Don't buy!

EXACTLY what you did!

Side note: What kind of work do you do, where a computer is absolutely necessary? You don't have to answer if it's too personal, I'm just curious.

Right, I did not buy.

I'm bound by an NDA (Non-diclosure Agreement), but I can say that I basically manage information. So much information that I can't do it by hand and need a computer to do it. In fact, due to software compatability issues I have to have a minimum spec computer (I can't just use my 486). Technically, I am self employed so my employer doesn't cover that cost.

(The nature of the work also means that my "employer" owns my thoughts...an interesting debate with regards to Intelectual Property)

 

[Efexeye]

Right, I did not buy.

I'm bound by an NDA (Non-diclosure Agreement), but I can say that I basically manage information. So much information that I can't do it by hand and need a computer to do it. In fact, due to software compatability issues I have to have a minimum spec computer (I can't just use my 486). Technically, I am self employed so my employer doesn't cover that cost.

(The nature of the work also means that my "employer" owns my thoughts...an interesting debate with regards to Intelectual Property)

Is it absolutely impossible to manage that data by hand? If the computer makes it EASIER, but is not ESSENTIAL, I would argue that the computer is a luxury, not a necessity.

Can't you write the cost of owning/operating a computer off on your taxes, especially as an independent contractor?

 

[Control Group]

You're both right, life isn't fair. But it is a good idea for those who have been given more through our life situation to give to those for whom life has been least fair.

Do you not agree?

Yes, I do. It's a good idea. I work hard for the money I make, but I also realize that my parents provided me with a solid head start (at the cost of a lot of tuna casseroles when I was a kid...which I had the gall to complain about at the time).

However: such giving should never be compulsory. People with more giving to people with less is a good idea, and more of it would make the world a better place. People with guns demanding that people with more give to people with less is robbery, even if we call the people with guns "governments."

No, I absolutely do not. I haven't been "given" anything. I have worked for everything I possess.

That's why I don't give money to beggars. Sure, I feel sorry for them, but it's a matter of principle.

In theory, I agree with your statement. In practice, however- it doesn't work.

Actually, it works fine, as long as you're free to make the choice you've made - to not give. Generosity and charity, in practice, work just fine. Right up until they're mandatory, which is (I think) what you're referring to.

 

[Frewfrux]

No, I absolutely do not. I haven't been "given" anything. I have worked for everything I possess.

You were given your birthplace. You did not work for that. The situation into which you were born had nothing to do with your efforts.

That's why I don't give money to beggars. Sure, I feel sorry for them, but it's a matter of principle.

Ah, that's why you weren't actually telling the truth when you said I could have your manual if I wanted...I see.

Giving money to beggers is not your only option. You could give money to people who know how to use it for the less fortunate. World Vission comes to mind.

In theory, I agree with your statement. In practice, however- it doesn't work.

Everything works differently in practice. Giving away money (to huricane victums for instance) has interesting, unitended effects. I would sugest giving money to the poor, not so that they have more, but so that you know that money is not what is controlling you.

"Where your money is, there your heart will be also." Don't remember where that's from.

 

[Frewfrux]

Is it absolutely impossible to manage that data by hand? If the computer makes it EASIER, but is not ESSENTIAL, I would argue that the computer is a luxury, not a necessity.

Uh...do you know how much information a computer can hold? Or how fast a computer processes that information compared to a human?

Yes, my job would *theoretically* be possible without it, but it would probably take a year to do what I do in one day.

Can't you write the cost of owning/operating a computer off on your taxes, especially as an independent contractor?

Yes I can. And I do. But a tax write off does not mean you get money back. It just menas that you don't have to pay quite as much at the end of the year.

 

[Control Group]

Is it absolutely impossible to manage that data by hand? If the computer makes it EASIER, but is not ESSENTIAL, I would argue that the computer is a luxury, not a necessity.

As someone who isn't bound by NDA, allow me to interject:

A company I used to work for, MGIC, maintained at the time (1998ish) around 24 terabytes of policy and premium data (stored pretty much as plain text), dating back to the early sixties. I have no idea how much they maintain now, but it's obviously more.

There is literally no way to perform any meaningful operations on that volume of information without computers. MGIC did, on occasion, hire independent contractors, though I don't have any idea if they were expected to provide their own equipment.

I only mention this insofar as it is certainly possible for individuals to need a computer or computers to do what they do.

 

[Efexeye]

You were given your birthplace. You did not work for that. The situation into which you were born had nothing to do with your efforts.

Ah, that's why you weren't actually telling the truth when you said I could have your manual if I wanted...I see.

Giving money to beggers is not your only option. You could give money to people who know how to use it for the less fortunate. World Vission comes to mind.

Everything works differently in practice. Giving away money (to huricane victums for instance) has interesting, unitended effects. I would sugest giving money to the poor, not so that they have more, but so that you know that money is not what is controlling you.

"Where your money is, there your heart will be also." Don't remember where that's from.

1. That, you're right about. But I'm not complaining that they don't sell Pocky or original Kerokeropi dolls in my local supermarket.

2. I wasn't lying! I just haven't sent the PM yet! But since you feel the need to accuse me of lying, the manual is back up for grabs!

3. AHAHAHAHAhahahah. Ahaa...haha. That's funny. Did you know that those little cans you drop coins into in the supermarket, the ones with pathetic pictures of kids on them? Did you know that the charities they support lease them, and that some private individual that pays 5 bucks for the right to do so, gets to keep the money in there?

4. Nice. Naive, but nice.

 

[Efexeye]

As someone who isn't bound by NDA, allow me to interject:

A company I used to work for, MGIC, maintained at the time (1998ish) around 24 terabytes of policy and premium data (stored pretty much as plain text), dating back to the early sixties. I have no idea how much they maintain now, but it's obviously more.

There is literally no way to perform any meaningful operations on that volume of information without computers. MGIC did, on occasion, hire independent contractors, though I don't have any idea if they were expected to provide their own equipment.

I only mention this insofar as it is certainly possible for individuals to need a computer or computers to do what they do.

Yeah, but when you worked there, did you buy your own computer? Or was it the company's?

 

[Frewfrux]

2. I wasn't lying! I just haven't sent the PM yet! But since you feel the need to accuse me of lying, the manual is back up for grabs!

Sorry, my bad. Got carried away with all the typing. I apologize.