Strange religion-civ combos.

[TheJopa]

Especially since the Order has the "ideal" or at least considers it ok to sacrifice the many peasants to further the rightesouness of the few. The Vampires could work that angle.


Not really a religion-civ combo, but in a game as the Amurites, I have a lich running around, doing nothing but casting vitalize....... Odd, dontcha think?

For Calabim- yes, they could convert to Order to stop demons. I can imagine keeping what Vampires really do (drink souls, not just blood) a secret, while using their immense power to keep Infernals at bay. And they don't need to feed so often, they could simply take few dissents.

But Order Calabim (or whenever they turn good) should lose the ability to Feast.

Lich- It isn't common, but especially as the Amuriters, I could see liches simply as men seeking immortality. They don't need to be evil at all. Necromancy practice would usually corrupt them but not necessarily. And Arawn is neutral god. Your lich is just an archmage pledging as an eternal protector of the Amurite nation. His nature magic lets him preserve part of himself he let behind.

Sheaim FoL - Well, yes, definitely a ruse. Plus, Sheaim can be RP anyway you want as most of their population is unaware what are they in for. They just seek power. In my game I vassalised them and turned them RoK. Their leadership, including Os-Gabella was overthrown and executed, and general population never knew what really happened. They remained a nation pursuing knowledge, even in death magic, but nothing they knew about the Armageddon.

Ljosafarl or Khazad with anything - That is really OK. These two nations are strongly defined by their 'ethnicity'. They can follow any religion they want with no problems. Missionaries from the other nations came and converted most of the populace. Those clinging to the old ways simply remained a minority.

Anyway I like this thread

 

[MagisterCultuum]

I don't think that a Lich could be Good. Neutral is fine though.


The Ljosalfar and Khazad are pretty closely tied to FoL and RoK. I don't think they are bound to these religions, but not everything makes sense for them. The Order actually fits the Dwarves' theme pretty well (at least their hero, Maros, joined the Order), but AV and OO don't really. For some reason I think that the Empyrean fits the Ljosalfar pretty well, although I'm not sure why. Esus is wrong for them though; if they adopt that, then haven't they really just surrendered to the Svartalfar?

 

[Rex rgis of Ter]

For some reason I think that the Empyrean fits the Ljosalfar pretty well, although I'm not sure why.

The Ljosalfar represnt the Summer Court. Summer is usually sunny (at least in Texas). Also, Arendel seems like a leader who is obsessed about honor and truth, but that might just be me. And of course, they are fighting Esus.

 

[Mewtarthio]

For Calabim- yes, they could convert to Order to stop demons. I can imagine keeping what Vampires really do (drink souls, not just blood) a secret, while using their immense power to keep Infernals at bay. And they don't need to feed so often, they could simply take few dissents.

But Order Calabim (or whenever they turn good) should lose the ability to Feast.

Why's that? They only need to enforce draconic laws, with the punishment being death by vampiric feasting. I'm certain they could get a lot of people to eat that way, and if anyone complains, they can just say, "Look, we're fighting to save the world here. Sometimes you've gotta make sacrifices!"

Esus is wrong for them though; if they adopt that, then haven't they really just surrendered to the Svartalfar?

Yes. Yes they have. Mwahahahahaha!

On a more serious note, the average Ljos citizen wouldn't know about the corruption of the nation. They'd think they were still fighting the evil Svarts.

 

[Mailbox]

I think of good liches as Baelnorns. Men who swore to sacrifice themselves in order to protect and serve their nation beyond death.

 

[it-ogo]

Calabim and feasting are good with Order. Order is always can find volunteers to sacrifice their lives for the benefit of the righteous cause. Body for army, soul for Mercurians: perfect carreer.

 

[zxcvbnm]

Interesting, very interesting. The problem is just that the Order is deontological, not utilitarian.

 

[Mewtarthio]

Calabim and feasting are good with Order. Order is always can find volunteers to sacrifice their lives for the benefit of the righteous cause. Body for army, soul for Mercurians: perfect carreer.

Especially with Unyielding Order. I picture long queues in which people march down, in uniform step, to the waiting jaws of the vampires, each being killed and consumed in perfect, efficient rhythm...

 

[WhitewolfIV]

I think the strangest combo would be Lunan and Runes.

1. Rune's god is representative of earth while the Lunan spend most of their time at sea and. . .

2. Rune's god is the aspect of the harvest, which rewards hard work and repitition. The Lunan are pirates thus theives and bandits who steal from other people.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Its odd alright, but not the strangest. That distinction really belongs to the options that are impossible (Order Infernals, AV Mercurians, Order or AV Grigori)

 

[Ur_Vile_Wedge]

ehh? how does that last one happen, Grig are with Cassiel and he's agnostic (or do you play unrestricted leaders?)

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Well I said it was impossible Although you could do it in unrestricted leaders if you want to.

The inability to adopt a religion is actually from the religion weighting of -100 rather than the trait. This also stop Basium from adopting AV, or Hyborem from adopting anything but AV. (Before this change Basium could convert AV, though not easily. You would need to found an AV temple with a (captured?) ritualist and convert immediately, before the religion is removed from the city at the start of the next turn.

 

[smjjames]

I'll give this a shot, I kind of like the Balseraphs, so I'll try that:

AV/Balseraphs: I'm not exactly sure how this would fit because I don't see the Baleraphs as truly evil, they are not out to destroy creation.

Octopus Overlords/Balseraphs: There are repeated references to mind control in the pedia entries related to this. This would actually be the easiest to imagine (for me anyway). Since Perpen is a mind mana sorcerer to the highest extreme of bieng the most powerful in the world (or even in all of creation), he could actually BE the Overlords and controlling his people in this way. At the same time, the genetic manipulation practices of the Balseraphs fits perfectly into the drown and the stygian guard, heck, even the kraken could be a hideously mutated freak or some immoral project involving successive generations of freaks or whatever to produce the kraken. I'm not exactly sure how Keelyn would fit into this.

FoL/Balseraphs: They would probably use nature for thier own benefit, even to the point of experimenting with natural poisons and drugs. They would also try to mutate nature to suit them, or if they can't easily, mutate themselves to fit it.

RoK/Balseraphs: I'm not really sure how this would be made to fit.

CoE/Balseraphs: no idea, honestly

Empyrean/Order: I kind of like KillerClowns's idea back on the first page for these two as they are similar.

 

[KillerClowns]

...FoL/Balseraphs: They would probably use nature for thier own benefit, even to the point of experimenting with natural poisons and drugs. They would also try to mutate nature to suit them, or if they can't easily, mutate themselves to fit it...

Love it. "Those Balseraphs... they've been loyal followers of the Ways of the Forest, but... why do they pick those brown mushrooms? Everyone knows they make you hallucinate..."

But CoE/Balseraph is too flamingly obvious to ignore. I mean, the Balseraphs are already known slave-traders and a society built on lies. If anything, the more I think about it, the more flavorful CoE seems for the Balseraphs. Crooked carnival games vastly outnumber the fair ones, and those fair ones are merely a lure to get people to gamble higher stakes. Promises of enjoying the most depraved of lusts could be true, but more often prove to be lures for enslavement... or worse. If you know the right people, the right signs, a thousand pleasures await in secret brothels and hidden clubs. If you don't, every day is a gamble... and a rigged one at that. I'm seeing a cross between the seediest parts of Las Vegas and Caligula's Rome.

AV/Balseraph: I can easily see the Balseraphs, pushed to the limit of madness, embracing a form of destructive, perhaps even masochistic insanity and depravity. Eventually, their only pleasure would be in destroying everything, including themselves, until there is nothing left to destroy and they all lie in hell, still smiling with glee as the demons of hell inflict unspeakable tortures.

EDIT: And while I'm here:

RoK/Lanun: "You ask why an old sea-dog like me would worship a god of dirt and stone? Lemme tell ya. Couple of years back, a runty Stonewarden comes preaching. I says to him, 'you can talk fancy, and Hells, you can do magic... but can you sail?' He says to me, 'not yet.' I laugh, but he just sits there and says, 'show me.' So I take him on board for a journey. No piracy, just going back to Innsmouth to pick up some supplies. I figured the runt would snap faster then that thin-skinned Elohim we hired a while before and we'd be dumping him in the ocean. We gives him the worst jobs, but he does them with this real quiet dignity. Never complains. While we're getting drunk, he's keeping everything in top shape. We laugh, and he doesn't even seem bothered. We try and give him work he's too short for, and he finds a way around it. And he learns real fast. If he wasn't working, he was learning. Stuff that takes most new guys a year to learn he picks up in a week. I turn my back and suddenly he can tie knots as well as any old sailor. Pays attention, you see. He didn't love the sea... I tell ya, we learned plenty of Dwarf curse words during that one storm. But he loved the good, honest work. So we finally made it to shore, and I says to him, 'I wish all my new crewmates were like you.' And he says 'they could be.' About then, I decided I'd found me a god to worship. Or. more importantly, for my crew to worship."

 

[MagisterCultuum]

The real Balseraph religion is the Stewards of Inequity. This Mammon-related religion is, however, very similar to and likely closely aligned with/linked to the Council of Esus, although they care a little more about then ends of money and injustice than the means. Also, most Mammon followers don't know that they are worshiping him, and thats how he likes it.

(Hmm...I guess Perpentach's compulsion to be perfectly honest --in a literal sense, although rarely sticking to what others think he meant to promise--might be at odds with
CoE though. Eh, thats ok, after all his form of honestly is pretty deceptive.)



Of all the religions in FfH, Esus clearly fits them best. Still, AV is pretty good under Keelyn. (I tend to assume that Giggles is pretty much in charge when she converts.)

 

[Mewtarthio]

AV/Balseraphs: I'm not exactly sure how this would fit because I don't see the Baleraphs as truly evil, they are not out to destroy creation.

"Look, Mister Giggles! If you look close enough at the Burning Sands, you can sort of see faces in the flames! They look kind of like screaming people..."
"Your 'Mister Giggles' is dead. I, Buboes, destroyed him myself, as I shall destroy all of creation!"
"Oooh! Can I ride your pony, Mister Bubbles?"

RoK/Balseraphs: I'm not really sure how this would be made to fit.

The Runes of Kilmorph reward hard work and tradition. The Balseraphs are perfectly fine with that. They just have really screwy traditions and somewhat messed up definitions of "work."

 

[Algeroth]

OO/Balseraphs- I seriously doubt that someone would even notice them. This religion blends so nicely into Blaspheraphs empire. "Insane cult of monstrous sea gods, tainting the bodies as well as dreams of their followers? So what? Souds kinda boring... "

 

[Arctem]

OO/Balseraphs- I seriously doubt that someone would even notice them. This religion blends so nicely into Blaspheraphs empire. "Insane cult of monstrous sea gods, tainting the bodies as well as dreams of their followers? So what? Souds kinda boring... "

It would be quite believable if Perpentach's insanity was explained by him having been a prophet of the Overlords, or maybe is an Overlord, but lost mental stability in becoming human, or maybe he is possessed by different Overlords at different times (is there more than one?), explaining his constant mood swings, pardoning a hardened murderer one moment, sentencing a child who wandered onto his lawn chasing after a toy to death (Or some trial that ends in death. "Just jump over the spike pit for Uncle Perpy, and then you can go home.") the next.

 

[A_Hamster]

Order/Balseraphs: A society of selfish, undisciplined hedonists converting to follow a religion which calls for self-sacrifice and unquestioning obedience to a higher ideal for the greater good. Can't see them doing it sincerely. Now if the Balseraphs were simply engaging in the multiverse's largest guerrilla theater performance ... now that seems like a definite possibility!

As for Calabrim or the Svartalfar following the Order or the Empyrean, it's a bit of a stretch, but they are more interested in the here and now. Having the Infernals show up and turn Erebus into a low-rent version of Hell would hurt them too much. So adopting a religion that makes it easier to kick the Infernals back into the Pit is just protecting their best interests. (And for the Calabrim, being obstensibly good with the Order is just protective camouflage.)

Rok/Ljosalfar: In my current game as Arendel, I did just that. I needed the money and production bonuses, and since I'm playing on a Great Plains map there wasn't a single forest nearby and the Incense was in the back of the beyond. So RoK, then once I'd expanded to where the Incense was, then FoL. Now about half the map is covered in trees. Besides, there's just something amusing about having Soldiers of Kilmorph protecting your forests!

Liches casting Vitalize: Yes, that's another funny image, and something I was thinking of doing as Svartalfar, but I won by Conquest before I got any Archmages with Vitalize and Death III.

 

[thomas.berubeg]

It would be quite believable if Perpentach's insanity was explained by him having been a prophet of the Overlords, or maybe is an Overlord, but lost mental stability in becoming human, or maybe he is possessed by different Overlords at different times (is there more than one?), explaining his constant mood swings, pardoning a hardened murderer one moment, sentencing a child who wandered onto his lawn chasing after a toy to death (Or some trial that ends in death. "Just jump over the spike pit for Uncle Perpy, and then you can go home.") the next.

Perpentach is insane as a reult of him being the most powerful mind mage ever. in his mind, he has a copy of the peronality of everyone he has ever met. (more than one, of some)