Strategy ?: Hyborem among the Barbs

[wig]

Most of my games have been pretty straight-forward so far, but I've finally ended up in perplexing situation where I could use some advice. In my latest game, (.21c, Standard Terra world, Normal Speed, Emperor, 10 Civs, Raging Barbs, Permanent Alliances) I summoned Hyborem for the first time.

I pulled the Shiam randomly, and ended up on a peninsula hemmed in by good civs (Bannor, Luichurp and Malakin all border me, while the Elohim and Kuriotates were also present). The Order was founded early (turn 114) and quickly spread to two of my cities, as I kept open borders to keep decent relations going with the Alliance of Goodness. I was already beelining towards Ashen Veil, and decided that this would be an excellent time to try out the big red guy.

I had no problems reaching Corruption of Spirit first (Calabm went for OO, Doviello and Illians were the other Evil civs) and Hyborem burst into the world... on the 'New World' continent, surrounded by barbarians. Dis was founded 4 tiles away from Acheron's city

So I'm stuck on a civ-free continent, my only contact being my old Shiam civ, and at least two techs away from being able to reach the Old World (I did trade for Fishing with Flauros along the way). I read in another thread that civs rarely expand into the New World on terra maps, so I don't think I can wait for them to come to me.

What's my next move? I could go to war with the barbs, but from what I understand it won't really raise the arm counter very much, and will leave me susceptible to the horseman and other unpleasantries of Armageddon. I could research the sailing techs, but I'm already falling behind in the tech race and this won't help matters. I could convince the Shiam to go to war and try to get some manes, but they are relatively weak military-wise and that would probably just get the AV holy city sacked.

Is there anything I'm overlooking? As I mentioned, its been an interesting game so far, and I've learned a valuable lesson; always research the sailing techs before Corruption on a Terra map

 

[kenken244]

you can raise the armageddon counter just by making huge amounts of cities since the av spreads to each one that makes it go up and you can get extra manes by sacrificing ritualists or savants on demons altars witch gives you free manes

 

[Marnid]

I played in a similar situation, switching to Hyborem on a Terra map, I just conquered all of the barbarian cities (there was no archeron there) without even using my settlers, still had them when the game ended. Many of the barbarian cities in my game had eight people which get converted to your 'hell people' (?) when you conquer the cities. My economy was amazing, no food is soo good, I can really crank out great people/hammers/and gold. Only one horseman spawned before the game ended and he got killed the turn he spawned by the AI 'barbarian hunting' units.

 

[coko]

Sounds to me you've got a great situation, to expand and take control of a whole continent and wage war when you feel like it!

 

[Mesix]

I usually play on a pangea or fantasy realm map to ensure that all the civs are accessible. This is more for the AI benefit to ensure that the games is more of a challenge since I find that the AI does not tend to build enough ships to control the seas nor mount a worthy invasion of another land mass. It sounds like your experience is the same. When playing with the fantasy realm map I select high sea levels to ensure that the Lunan, OO civs, and builder of the great lighthouse all have some benefit from water terrain on the map.

 

[Sarisin]

I usually play on a pangea or fantasy realm map to ensure that all the civs are accessible. This is more for the AI benefit to ensure that the games is more of a challenge since I find that the AI does not tend to build enough ships to control the seas nor mount a worthy invasion of another land mass. It sounds like your experience is the same. When playing with the fantasy realm map I select high sea levels to ensure that the Lunan, OO civs, and builder of the great lighthouse all have some benefit from water terrain on the map.

Thanks for that tip, Mesix!

I also use the fantasy realm map most of the time, but I use the default settings - although I like to mess with the Logical, Irrational, Crazy settings for resources.

I like the games with all the civs available on land, and the fantasy realm map is great because it is a 'scrolling' map.

I never tried the high sea levels setting on the fantasy map content to have mostly lakes and small seas. But, I will try it next time. Thanks.

 

[wig]

I played in a similar situation, switching to Hyborem on a Terra map, I just conquered all of the barbarian cities (there was no archeron there) without even using my settlers, still had them when the game ended. Many of the barbarian cities in my game had eight people which get converted to your 'hell people' (?) when you conquer the cities. My economy was amazing, no food is soo good, I can really crank out great people/hammers/and gold. Only one horseman spawned before the game ended and he got killed the turn he spawned by the AI 'barbarian hunting' units.

Ok, this looks like the route I'll be going. I wasn't sure how big a problem being at war with the barbs was going to be once all hell broke loose.

I've seen very little of Hyborem and Armageddon, to be honest, so it's unfamiliar terrain for me. I'll killed him once with my Grigori heroes right after he spawned, and once he spawned on a different continent from my civ that I never visited. He hasn't appeared in my other games, mostly due to the evils civs getting mobbed or the apparent bug in patch .21c that prevents them from researching Infernal Pact.

Thanks for all the replies.

 

[Go Boks]

I would conquer/settle your entire continent first. Having AV and a large empire will make your tech shoot through the roof. Use city states or forbidden/winter palace (you might want to save one of those for the old world too though) to keep your maintenance under control.

 

[wig]

I would conquer/settle your entire continent first. Having AV and a large empire will make your tech shoot through the roof. Use city states or forbidden/winter palace (you might want to save one of those for the old world too though) to keep your maintenance under control.

My empire is growing nicely on the new world. After taking a few of the barb cities south of Dis, Hyborem turned his attention northward towards Acheron's den.

I was expecting a prolonged battle, being forced to soften up the wyrm before I could take him down, but I looked at my combat odds with Hyborem and realized I had an 88% odds vs Acheron.

I was expecting a prolonged animated battle, but Big Red felled the dragon with one swing of his axe (my first Acheron kill). The horde would be nice under different circumstances, but not terribly useful to my Infernals at this point (not much use for happy resources, and I'm a long way off from Weaponsmith).

The new world is firmly under control; I'm just slowing my expansion so I don't kill my science output. My first frigate are just about finished, then it's time to visit the old world and start some devangalizing

I do have a question about Ritualists; mine can't cast 1st level spells (wither/summon skeleton/scorch), but can use 2nd level spells (summon nightmare/RoF) just fine once I upgrade them. Is this normal?

 

[GeeJo]

That's correct. Currently they only way to get priests casting level 1 spells is to have them train under Govannon for a while.

 

[Go Boks]

Don't know as I don't use those units. I do know that disciple units in general do not operate the same way as mages, so it probably is normal. They essentially get access to specific spells as opposed to mana spheres.

 

[Sureshot]

ya, the only reason they have the sphere1 promotions is so they have access to the sphere2+ promotions of the same type.