Ansar
Détente avec l'été
scoutsout said:
lurker's comment: I think they are waiting for Electricity so they can start irrigating with no limits.
TGOM 02 - The Grumpy Old Monk and the Ancient Crone go to Alpha Centauri
- Thread starter Bede
- Start date
lurker's comment: I think they are waiting for Electricity so they can start irrigating with no limits.
cleverhandle
King
Got it.
I just got back from an all-day training session at work, so I'm not quite ready to analyze all the details quite yet. But I'll try to do that and post any questions later tonight and then play the turns tomorrow.
I just got back from an all-day training session at work, so I'm not quite ready to analyze all the details quite yet. But I'll try to do that and post any questions later tonight and then play the turns tomorrow.
Beg borrow or steal a cup or two of coal. Skip the bank and put a factory in Bedeville if that is going to be our ToE town, then start a pre-build and find another for the Hoover Dam and put a factory there and start a prebuild.
We were really lucky in the Smith's build as we had the help of our Golden Age. We are not going to be so lucky with Darwin.
Well done on Cleo's demise. The General is hereby inducted into the Order of Royal Cleo's Asp.
We were really lucky in the Smith's build as we had the help of our Golden Age. We are not going to be so lucky with Darwin.
Well done on Cleo's demise. The General is hereby inducted into the Order of Royal Cleo's Asp.
gmaharriet
Ancient Crone
It seems I do have a problem with my reinstallations of Civ. I have been able to play ongoing games alright (so far), but new games randomly crash to desktop. I ran a test and out of 30 new games, 4 crashed on turn 1 or 2, and 26 played alright for ~25 turns (where testing stopped).
I have no way of knowing if there is a time bomb hidden somewhere later in the game and will leave it to the team's decision whether or not to play my next turnset if I'm still waiting for the arrival of a new copy just ordered of Civ 3 Complete which is supposed to delivered by Wednesday this week. I may need a skip or swap if my turn comes up before then.
I have no way of knowing if there is a time bomb hidden somewhere later in the game and will leave it to the team's decision whether or not to play my next turnset if I'm still waiting for the arrival of a new copy just ordered of Civ 3 Complete which is supposed to delivered by Wednesday this week. I may need a skip or swap if my turn comes up before then.
cleverhandle
King
I would run a memory test (like memtest86) if you haven't already. Civ is a fairly taxing game on your CPU/memory - it may be pushing your memory too far.gmaharriet said:
And I just finished my set - the report will be up shortly.
gmaharriet
Ancient Crone
I don't know how to run a memory test, but this is a brand new computer (got it yesterday) with P4 3.? CPU, 1gig of RAM, 160 gig HD and best graphics card I could get (but can't recall the specs).cleverhandle said:
I had problems with the installation as having some corrupted areas on both CIII and C3C. I had to do the minimum intall on CIII, patched to 1.29f, skip a few .flc files on the C3C install and then patched to 1.22 .
Neither game CD had ever been touched except the original move to my CD drive and back to their jewel cases...just once each...so I can't imagine how they could have become damaged. I'm exceedingly frustrated!!!
cleverhandle
King
OK, there are some things that need pointing out before the report...
Trade Rep: Our rep was hosed somewhere along the line. I don't think that's life-threatening at this point, but it's still a pain.
Banks vs. Universities: Banks only operate on commerce coins allocated to taxes. We're running at max or near max research and have been for some time - so Banks will do little or nothing for us except on the last turn of research when we adjust the sliders. That's not a bad thing (especially with Smith's paying the maintenance), but given the choice our cities should be building Universities before Banks. We have several cities that were doing (or had already done) just the opposite.
Watch your sliders!: We were running 10% lux when I picked up the game even though we had 6 luxes. We don't need the extra happiness and 10% on a slider makes a big, big difference at this stage of the game.
And I still think y'all build too few granaries (Bede disagrees with me here). In theory, you can join in workers from corrupt edge towns. In practice, there's always a job for those workers to do and you just forget to build more.
Report coming up...
Trade Rep: Our rep was hosed somewhere along the line. I don't think that's life-threatening at this point, but it's still a pain.
Banks vs. Universities: Banks only operate on commerce coins allocated to taxes. We're running at max or near max research and have been for some time - so Banks will do little or nothing for us except on the last turn of research when we adjust the sliders. That's not a bad thing (especially with Smith's paying the maintenance), but given the choice our cities should be building Universities before Banks. We have several cities that were doing (or had already done) just the opposite.
Watch your sliders!: We were running 10% lux when I picked up the game even though we had 6 luxes. We don't need the extra happiness and 10% on a slider makes a big, big difference at this stage of the game.
And I still think y'all build too few granaries (Bede disagrees with me here). In theory, you can join in workers from corrupt edge towns. In practice, there's always a job for those workers to do and you just forget to build more.
Report coming up...
cleverhandle
King
Executive Summary: Quiet on the homefront while we build up after coal-poaching, but things are heating up elsewhere. (Why don't I ever get to fight? 
)
Pre-Turn - Set lux to 0 (see above post) and research to 100. Set scientists to taxmen, and we now have Elec in 3 @+11gpt. Change out of Bank builds (see above). Salamanca, Bedeville, Clever Springs->Factory. Smelly->University. EB->Granary. Fiddle with citizens and cops in Caughnawaga in order to short-rush Walls->Settler to get a coal-poacher out next turn for 48g. Move some units out of EB to help with border garrisons.
221 (1060 AD) - Caughnawaga Settler->Market. Lurkersville Barracks->University. Some workers clearing southern jungle finish and move back towards the core to begin railing when the coal comes in.
222 - Napa Settler->Cannon. Check Abe's money situation and decide to renegotiate the iron deal, which we can now bump up to 56gpt. Shaka is the last one without Steam, so let that go for 5gpt+25g+WM. Fiddle with scientists and sliders so that Elec comes in next turn at +196gpt.
223 - Eotin Bay Granary->Harbor. MM sliders and specialists - SciMeth comes in in 5 turns at +63gpt (90% research). Spend some cash on the temple at El-Amarna.
224 - Harriet Bay Cavalry->Factory. VValley Cavalry->Cavalry. El-Amarna Temple->Library. Waystation Barracks->Temple. Greece completes Bach's in Athens, Babs and Persia switch to Universal Suffrage. Join a worker to Bedeville. Found Tonawanda on the small island our cavs were camping on. Poach some coal:
I could have put the Coal Shack on the river, but this location will lower the flip risk in Asyut and I figure this will be a temporary city anyway. Workers begin railing.
225 - Continue the peace treaty with Hammi. The Incense for Dyes deal with Alex comes up for renewal - I figure we really want the dyes for as long as possible, but don't want to be exporting resources when the time comes to declare on him, so I give him Medicine for Dyes+WM+40g. Farm4 Cannon->Cannon. Now that we poached Alex's extra coal, Hammi has none.
226 - Farewell Isabella:
Salamanca Factory->Bank (prebuild for ToE). Bedeville Factory->Palace (prebuild for Hoover). Smelly University->Factory. Cronetown University->Cannon. Babs learn RP. Let Abe have Medicine for 12gpt+20g+WM - weak, but everybody else with any money already knows it.
227 - The lux deal with Shaka comes up for trade - give him Medicine and Incense for Spices and Gems. Babs declare war on the Greeks! That should burn some of both of their forces before we come in to clean up, but we'll have to pay out for Dyes when Hammi takes Sparta. Owego Market->Aqueduct. Farm5 Cannon->Cannon. Persia learns Corp and trades it up for RP. Finish the Temple in Waystation to reduce flip-risk.
228 - Clever Springs Factory->Military Academy. Waystation Temple->Library. SciMeth comes in, set research to RP in 5 turns @ +1gpt (100% research). Switch Salamanca to ToE, due in 20.
229 - Mayhem City Uni->Court. Eotin Bay Harbor->Cavalry. Niagara Falls Cannon->Cannon. Tyendenaga Uni->Factory. Farm2 Cannon->Cannon.
230 (1150 AD) - Scoutsville Cavalry->Court. Napa Cannon->Cannon. Panama Aqueduct->Court.
Comments:
Military: I eased off of military builds to get some factories working since we still have a pretty substantial force of cavalry and cannon around. But cutting through Hammi's infantry isn't going to be easy - we'll want more cavalry and armies from the Military Academy soon enough. It will be interesting to see how Hammi conducts his war against Greece. If Hammi cuts through Greece all the way up to our territory but lets Alex keep cities elsewhere, I would start planning to go right after Hammi rather than take on Greece first.
Workers: The workers in the core are busy improving Salamanca to give us the best possible shot at ToE - if SciMeth gets out before US completes, we're going to need all the shields we can get. After Salamanca is optimized, I would move them on to Bedeville for the Hoover prebuild before continuing the rail network elsewhere. The other workers are doing a pretty good job on the rest of the network so far.
Tech/Commerce: I would suggest finishing RP, setting the sliders to tax, and pressing our attack after upgrading cannon to arties and getting a few infantry divisions rolling. Persia won't be able to keep up once Babylon is damaged, and we can engineer a war between Xerxes and Shaka easily enough.
The save is here.
)Pre-Turn - Set lux to 0 (see above post) and research to 100. Set scientists to taxmen, and we now have Elec in 3 @+11gpt. Change out of Bank builds (see above). Salamanca, Bedeville, Clever Springs->Factory. Smelly->University. EB->Granary. Fiddle with citizens and cops in Caughnawaga in order to short-rush Walls->Settler to get a coal-poacher out next turn for 48g. Move some units out of EB to help with border garrisons.
221 (1060 AD) - Caughnawaga Settler->Market. Lurkersville Barracks->University. Some workers clearing southern jungle finish and move back towards the core to begin railing when the coal comes in.
222 - Napa Settler->Cannon. Check Abe's money situation and decide to renegotiate the iron deal, which we can now bump up to 56gpt. Shaka is the last one without Steam, so let that go for 5gpt+25g+WM. Fiddle with scientists and sliders so that Elec comes in next turn at +196gpt.
223 - Eotin Bay Granary->Harbor. MM sliders and specialists - SciMeth comes in in 5 turns at +63gpt (90% research). Spend some cash on the temple at El-Amarna.
224 - Harriet Bay Cavalry->Factory. VValley Cavalry->Cavalry. El-Amarna Temple->Library. Waystation Barracks->Temple. Greece completes Bach's in Athens, Babs and Persia switch to Universal Suffrage. Join a worker to Bedeville. Found Tonawanda on the small island our cavs were camping on. Poach some coal:
I could have put the Coal Shack on the river, but this location will lower the flip risk in Asyut and I figure this will be a temporary city anyway. Workers begin railing.
225 - Continue the peace treaty with Hammi. The Incense for Dyes deal with Alex comes up for renewal - I figure we really want the dyes for as long as possible, but don't want to be exporting resources when the time comes to declare on him, so I give him Medicine for Dyes+WM+40g. Farm4 Cannon->Cannon. Now that we poached Alex's extra coal, Hammi has none.
226 - Farewell Isabella:
Salamanca Factory->Bank (prebuild for ToE). Bedeville Factory->Palace (prebuild for Hoover). Smelly University->Factory. Cronetown University->Cannon. Babs learn RP. Let Abe have Medicine for 12gpt+20g+WM - weak, but everybody else with any money already knows it.
227 - The lux deal with Shaka comes up for trade - give him Medicine and Incense for Spices and Gems. Babs declare war on the Greeks! That should burn some of both of their forces before we come in to clean up, but we'll have to pay out for Dyes when Hammi takes Sparta. Owego Market->Aqueduct. Farm5 Cannon->Cannon. Persia learns Corp and trades it up for RP. Finish the Temple in Waystation to reduce flip-risk.
228 - Clever Springs Factory->Military Academy. Waystation Temple->Library. SciMeth comes in, set research to RP in 5 turns @ +1gpt (100% research). Switch Salamanca to ToE, due in 20.
229 - Mayhem City Uni->Court. Eotin Bay Harbor->Cavalry. Niagara Falls Cannon->Cannon. Tyendenaga Uni->Factory. Farm2 Cannon->Cannon.
230 (1150 AD) - Scoutsville Cavalry->Court. Napa Cannon->Cannon. Panama Aqueduct->Court.
Comments:
Military: I eased off of military builds to get some factories working since we still have a pretty substantial force of cavalry and cannon around. But cutting through Hammi's infantry isn't going to be easy - we'll want more cavalry and armies from the Military Academy soon enough. It will be interesting to see how Hammi conducts his war against Greece. If Hammi cuts through Greece all the way up to our territory but lets Alex keep cities elsewhere, I would start planning to go right after Hammi rather than take on Greece first.
Workers: The workers in the core are busy improving Salamanca to give us the best possible shot at ToE - if SciMeth gets out before US completes, we're going to need all the shields we can get. After Salamanca is optimized, I would move them on to Bedeville for the Hoover prebuild before continuing the rail network elsewhere. The other workers are doing a pretty good job on the rest of the network so far.
Tech/Commerce: I would suggest finishing RP, setting the sliders to tax, and pressing our attack after upgrading cannon to arties and getting a few infantry divisions rolling. Persia won't be able to keep up once Babylon is damaged, and we can engineer a war between Xerxes and Shaka easily enough.
The save is here.
gmaharriet
Ancient Crone
Good turns, Clever!
I'm not the best at military needs, but I took a look at the save and it seems we have quite a few obsolete units stationed on the land bridge and our unit support costs are high. Would it make sense to either disband some of them or to switch Kiohero to a barracks (loss of 30 shields) and do an upgrade? or change one of the other builds there to a barracks and speed it up with disbanding? Currently the nearest rax are in Scoutsville and Smelly.
This is just a general question for the team, because I'm not good at warmongering and am never sure what to do about military units.
I'm not the best at military needs, but I took a look at the save and it seems we have quite a few obsolete units stationed on the land bridge and our unit support costs are high. Would it make sense to either disband some of them or to switch Kiohero to a barracks (loss of 30 shields) and do an upgrade? or change one of the other builds there to a barracks and speed it up with disbanding? Currently the nearest rax are in Scoutsville and Smelly.
This is just a general question for the team, because I'm not good at warmongering and am never sure what to do about military units.
cleverhandle
King
Indeed, our military is in a bit of disarray at the moment. Some of those obsoletes can be used to garrison against flips or quell resistors when we get around to fighting, but some could stand to be disbanded. I figured it would be easier to rearrange things once we have our rail network up. Until then, it can't be too bad of a thing to have a couple of extra units around. Despite the unit support, our economy is in pretty decent shape - we hit both SciMeth and RP in 5 turns, and for SciMeth we were the first (and still only) ones to get it. So I don't think there's any great urgency to shaving off a few coins from the budget. As long as we can take down Hammi I'm not worried about catching up to Xerxes in due time.gmaharriet said:
cleverhandle said:
Trade Rep is just fine as Hammi will accept my offer of 20gpt for his world map. If the rep was shot he wouldn't have done the deal no way no how and would have yold me I had betrayed someone in the past. So the rep is safe, let's keep it that way.
cleverhandle
King
Hmm... well, I've always gotten rather confused by the trade rep business so maybe I'm just mixed up. I was checking by offering a small lump sum for a tech - that's gets "they will be insulted." Then add a luxury or gpt and that get's "they would never accept".
Couple of things could be going on: if the budget is in deficit the other guys will never accept gpt (they have a spy in the Exchequer). Not sure about the luxo thing, however, but the easiest way to verify the rep is to offer 20gpt for a 1 gold loan. If they refuse that deal they will always tell you why in the dialogue box.
TimBentley
Deity
lurker's comment: America won't accept 1gpt for a WM after the way you treated Egypt. (By the way, offering an excessively lucrative deal doesn't always work; they would have accepted 20gpt.)
TimB is correct, somewhere along in there Cleo got a hosing according to Hammi.
Truly interesting
Opened the 950 save, checked the ongoing deals, there was nothing with Cleo other than the peace treaty, checked every trooper in the army and ship in the navy and all the worker bees, and there was no one inside Cleo's borders, dialed up Hammi and Hammi accused us of betraying the Egyptians even before Cleo got the boot.
:argh: I don't get it,
lurkers comment:
Your trading reputation is destroyed. This happened 840AD when Babylon captured Pi-Ramesses. Since you both where at war with Hammi, your delivery of iron to Cleopatra where cut off. If you fail to deliver a resource or a luxery due to a broken trade route, your rep will be destroyed even if you give for free.
Your trading reputation is destroyed. This happened 840AD when Babylon captured Pi-Ramesses. Since you both where at war with Hammi, your delivery of iron to Cleopatra where cut off. If you fail to deliver a resource or a luxery due to a broken trade route, your rep will be destroyed even if you give for free.
<slinks quietly away>General Mayhem
Monarch
- Joined
- Aug 30, 2004
- Messages
- 329
That would explain it, I always double check for possible rep-breakers before declaring war.
gmaharriet
Ancient Crone
It's not exactly something you could have prevented. Let's think of it as an "educational opportunity"...you can teach us the best way to play with a broken rep.Bede said:
