HalloweenWeed
Chieftain
What do you think the best (easiest) civ is? Now I am seriously considering the Iroquois! Hey, I know, YGBK! No, I just tried them and I was very surprised. In the past I have played Egypt (most), France, Siam (twice), America (ouch), and China (1). I had read that Egypt and Siam were favorites of quite a few ppls. But I just tried the Iroquois, and was happily surprised. I have been playing exclusively Domination. Of course, I did set the climate to "wet," and retried the game start until I got a few resources, riverside, and a lot of forest/jungle nearby. The Iroquois have the advantage of moving through forest and jungle like it's a road, but only within their borders. They can also use forest/jungle for trade routes, regardless of either mill or trade post improvements.
Previously, when I seen the AI control the Iroquois, they seemed weak, and were not a significant threat. Well now I think the AI just does not handle the Iroquois well. I just got my highest score ever playing the Iroquois, and after the slow start it got easy (I need to try on harder difficulty now). I was on small "Large lakes" map, and Lev4 "Prince". At first, since I had seen the AI did very poor on tech, I moved the Libraries and Universities up on my priority list a little. But I very quickly took the lead in tech, and never lost it - so there seems to be no tech penalty for the Iroquois.
At first since I had to build farms, and therefore clear some forests to do so, the very start of the game was a bit slow and tough. You should build an extra worker near the beginning for this, right after you get your military up to a defensible level, build a monument, and library. An extra worker also means more unit upkeep cost, so you must keep the military at a minimum level at that time. But then when I got a couple more cities started, it began getting easier - except for the usual "keep your ppl happy" and budget problem crunch times.
But then connecting the cities was much easier, and it was awesome moving around in my territory without the trees slowing me down - even mounted units (I don't' use them much). It was so much quicker to respond to attacks, barbarian or otherwise, it helped make up for having one less military unit. It required a whole different way of thinking about unit movement (within my territory) - it was quite refreshing. Eventually the money I saved on roads (at about the third city) made up for the extra worker, and then some. I was able to then build a larger military as result.
Strategy tips for the Iroquois: Try to save all forests and jungle*. Later you can build a trading post in the jungle, and use the University to get a little research boost from the jungle, which also acts as a road for you. (You can even still build a railroad through it later - to speed up movement.) So research lumber mill almost ASAP, and convert most of your forest tiles into mills. You still get a food point from them if they are grassland with the mill, two after the appropriate tech. The enemy will be slowed by the trees, and you won't - when you are attacked inside your territory. One drawback to that: Before the artillery the trees get in the way of ranged attacks sometimes. So set your defense accordingly. Depend less on ranged units for defense until late game.
*Clear just enough trees to give enough farms for a good plentiful food start for your new cities. Be smart in planning your next farm areas, maybe buy a couple of tiles to place farms, to save treed tiles. You might want to buy that tree tile next to your opponent's territory (especially if it is riverside/lakeside as normal), it will make a good buffer between you and him, and give you more production - whereas previously you didn't care enough about those tiles to bother purchasing it with precious money.
So what do you think? Did you try Iroquois?
EDIT 4/4:
Well I forgot to mention a couple of things, regarding Iroquois movement point expenditure. First, sometimes the Iroquois crosses rivers within their territory without a crossing penalty. But sometimes there is a normal crossing penalty, and I haven't figured it out. GTK that often Iroquois need not build bridges over rivers. Many times I have used this to my military advantage too. Next there's the forests = roads thing. This is not true. Precisely, if you have a forested hill (no road nor RR), and enter it from a flat road hex, you expend movement points just like it were not a road! (game bug) This means even though you have a trade route, when you move your military units they are slowed down in these cases. I have had to build roads in hilly forested hexes to counter this! In my present game, the bonus for using forested hexes as roads was entirely useless as I had to build roads 98% of the way anyway, until I conquered England. (Then later they all ganged up on me and I had a four-enemy war, I was not strong enough, they were sufficiently strong.)
Also, in my games subsequent to the OP above the edit, I have had trouble keeping up with the techs, and had to build many universities and man them in the mid-game, and lots of research agreements, to catch up on tech. But I also increased the difficulty level to 5 King, so comparing to 4 Prince in my OP above.
Previously, when I seen the AI control the Iroquois, they seemed weak, and were not a significant threat. Well now I think the AI just does not handle the Iroquois well. I just got my highest score ever playing the Iroquois, and after the slow start it got easy (I need to try on harder difficulty now). I was on small "Large lakes" map, and Lev4 "Prince". At first, since I had seen the AI did very poor on tech, I moved the Libraries and Universities up on my priority list a little. But I very quickly took the lead in tech, and never lost it - so there seems to be no tech penalty for the Iroquois.
At first since I had to build farms, and therefore clear some forests to do so, the very start of the game was a bit slow and tough. You should build an extra worker near the beginning for this, right after you get your military up to a defensible level, build a monument, and library. An extra worker also means more unit upkeep cost, so you must keep the military at a minimum level at that time. But then when I got a couple more cities started, it began getting easier - except for the usual "keep your ppl happy" and budget problem crunch times.
But then connecting the cities was much easier, and it was awesome moving around in my territory without the trees slowing me down - even mounted units (I don't' use them much). It was so much quicker to respond to attacks, barbarian or otherwise, it helped make up for having one less military unit. It required a whole different way of thinking about unit movement (within my territory) - it was quite refreshing. Eventually the money I saved on roads (at about the third city) made up for the extra worker, and then some. I was able to then build a larger military as result.
Strategy tips for the Iroquois: Try to save all forests and jungle*. Later you can build a trading post in the jungle, and use the University to get a little research boost from the jungle, which also acts as a road for you. (You can even still build a railroad through it later - to speed up movement.) So research lumber mill almost ASAP, and convert most of your forest tiles into mills. You still get a food point from them if they are grassland with the mill, two after the appropriate tech. The enemy will be slowed by the trees, and you won't - when you are attacked inside your territory. One drawback to that: Before the artillery the trees get in the way of ranged attacks sometimes. So set your defense accordingly. Depend less on ranged units for defense until late game.
*Clear just enough trees to give enough farms for a good plentiful food start for your new cities. Be smart in planning your next farm areas, maybe buy a couple of tiles to place farms, to save treed tiles. You might want to buy that tree tile next to your opponent's territory (especially if it is riverside/lakeside as normal), it will make a good buffer between you and him, and give you more production - whereas previously you didn't care enough about those tiles to bother purchasing it with precious money.
So what do you think? Did you try Iroquois?
EDIT 4/4:
Well I forgot to mention a couple of things, regarding Iroquois movement point expenditure. First, sometimes the Iroquois crosses rivers within their territory without a crossing penalty. But sometimes there is a normal crossing penalty, and I haven't figured it out. GTK that often Iroquois need not build bridges over rivers. Many times I have used this to my military advantage too. Next there's the forests = roads thing. This is not true. Precisely, if you have a forested hill (no road nor RR), and enter it from a flat road hex, you expend movement points just like it were not a road! (game bug) This means even though you have a trade route, when you move your military units they are slowed down in these cases. I have had to build roads in hilly forested hexes to counter this! In my present game, the bonus for using forested hexes as roads was entirely useless as I had to build roads 98% of the way anyway, until I conquered England. (Then later they all ganged up on me and I had a four-enemy war, I was not strong enough, they were sufficiently strong.)
Also, in my games subsequent to the OP above the edit, I have had trouble keeping up with the techs, and had to build many universities and man them in the mid-game, and lots of research agreements, to catch up on tech. But I also increased the difficulty level to 5 King, so comparing to 4 Prince in my OP above.
base, an extra 15% only yields up 6.5
