The Community Deity Game #2 - Assyria

[beetle]

Starting on T1, Pantheons going quick.

The first pantheon went on T4 in my play. A religion enhanced before I had a pantheon, and then the last religion went around T65. I had made friends with the nearby religious CS and even popped a faith ruin. All for naught.

I am very jealous of Budweiser, ST412, and anyone else who happens to send their starting warrior due south.

I ended up OCC for too long and at one point I was wondering if I would get any expos at all as my 1st, 2nd, and 3rd choices for spots disappeared. I ended up with four in a stretched out line, could be okay, even picked up a NW. NC was quite late.

I am having trouble with the southern AI who forward settled on me. Two DOWs so far, and I reloaded to prevent a third (not like he was being subtle) because the crazy AI to the East had just DOW'd me out of the blue. Had all kinds of trade going too, so that also caught me off guard.

It is about T160, and I just took a city using siege towers from the crazy AI to the East, love the UA. I thought it was too late for the UU, but I might get one more even, which would give me achievement C.

 

[budweiser]

I am very jealous of Budweiser, ST412, and anyone else who happens to send their starting warrior due south.

I don't want to sound like I am bragging, but I am very pleased that I could defeat a deity game without building any units.

In my game, I was attacked once very late. That's why my troops are positioned the way they are in the screen shot.

 

[beetle]

After finding the neighbours, I experimented with a new kind of start: 5 scouts on a Small Continents map... and from then I made the 2nd big decision: NOT to build units. Instead, I concentrated on a diplo game (for the remainder of my playthrough) that was not optimal in the sense of safe duplication, BUT was as optimal as I could get using total risk strategies. I told myself that I would post the loss if I was DoW'ed and had nothing to deal with it.

The above is from one of consentient’s spoilers from the recent-ish Portugal DCL, which I think served as his inspiration for Achievement D. Maybe he mentioned the don’t-build-units challenge elsewhere as well?

- no achis that prevent from using UU/UA/UB
- no contradictory achis as in all should be achievable within reason in a single game
- no achis that effectively remove a core aspect of the game.

I agree with these points, as it is sometimes hard enough to keep the game interesting without removing features! I think we should be flexible about the “within reason” qualifier, but unless someone proves it to the contrary, I agree that the achievements for this CDG are mutually exclusive. OTOH, I really liked how the achievements in CDG #1 complicated the designated VC. I am sure all agree that to be okay!

I don't want to sound like I am bragging, but I am very pleased that I could defeat a deity game without building any units.

Yes, it is a good trick to be able to pull off! Did you tally any other achievement points?

 

[budweiser]

Yes, it is a good trick to be able to pull off! Did you tally any other achievement points?

No because at first I didnt build any scouts so I was afraid to wander too far with my warrior. In order to do the other achievements, I would have needed to find some Mil CS faster than I did.

I did lots of bribes of AI to fight, but didn't track or manage who was killing who.

 

[Blatc]

For future maps, can we please be sure to mention in the OP if the map has been tweaked or not.

Also, as Grendeldef said, no achievements that prevent from using UU/UA/UB.

Edit: I realize it's not your map ST, but from the OP: "Everything is default by the looks of it."

 

[stormtrooper412]

Well I meant settings, as in, no raging barbs, disabled ruins, stuff like that, I did mention I haven't played a single turn.

My game through T157, still no units, probably not going to break 230 because I really suck at endgame

 

[beetle]

For future maps, can we please be sure to mention in the OP if the map has been tweaked or not.

I agree with mentioning in the OP if the map has been tweaked or not.

I would not say in the OP, not even in a spoiler, what the tweak is. Do you agree with that? With the tweaked DCLs, it was always interesting to have speculation as to what was tweaked, and then the reveal later of course.

 

[Wild_Woojsha]

I was hoping someone would be able to pull off the no units. So I can pile on the scouts though and create an Assyrian Scout Carpet? That is what I will do then . Still though, the idea of getting all 5 of these sounds horrifying but at the same time, can it be done??? 230 turn science victory is impossible enough, but then being a warmongering backstabber with nothing but scouts, scouts upgraded to comp bows, and whatever the Military CS's give you?

Achievement B involves somehow ensuring that the runaway conquers 3 capitals and completely eliminates a CIV, and then you have to somehow obtain some city from them and liberate it with a pile of scouts?

Also, I wonder about Heathen Conversion, the Piety reformation belief that allows you to touch barbs with a missionary to convert them to your side. That's the only way I can see pulling this off. From my being a scumbag and studying the screenshots of those who have played, I see a potential to pull this off. I will be trying it for sure actually, as soon as I get a chance. I still need to beat CDG 1 though, but wow does this one look awesome.

 

[beetle]

That is what I will do then... I will be trying it for sure actually, as soon as I get a chance.

Glad you are taking this on!

...being a warmongering backstabber

Why is backstabbing required?

...and then you have to somehow obtain some city from them and liberate it

The AI you help capture caps does not have to be from whence you get the city to liberate. It does seem likely, but don’t make the achievements any harder than they are!

It occurs to me that the requirements for “B” can be loosely interpreted. Heck, just gifting the runaway a timely lux is enough. Or just DOWing the same target even if you never actually fight.

If your economy and diplomacy are going well enough, might the runaway AI sell you some crap city on ice that qualifies for liberation?

 

[Wild_Woojsha]

Glad you are taking this on!



Why is backstabbing required?



The AI you help capture caps does not have to be from whence you get the city to liberate. It does seem likely, but don’t make the achievements any harder than they are!

It occurs to me that the requirements for “B” can be loosely interpreted. Heck, just gifting the runaway a timely lux is enough. Or just DOWing the same target even if you never actually fight.

If your economy and diplomacy are going well enough, might the runaway AI sell you some crap city on ice that qualifies for liberation?

It says the only way to achieve C is to restore a CIV to life. That means somebody is going to have to kill them off, and that will probably be whoever the military runaway is. Either way, I will be playing a peaceful-Ghandi-friends-with-everyone style game since All I will have is scouts unless I manage to get Heathen Conversion somehow. So I will have to backstab somebody. Well maybe not, does it count as a backstab if I denounce them in advance?

I am not really sure what qualifies as a backstab. As for B, it can probably be achieved on its own without any help except for maybe a 1gpt gift to lawyer the achievement unless the AI's don't do it. Then some gifts to help them "Run Away" would be necessary to make sure they actually do it. Just like Herding big ol' Kitty Cats lol..

Anyways, back to C. I think A and C are the hardest on this map by an extraordinary amount when it comes to full completion. Fast Science Victory is hard enough without all these darn achievements, but trying to get C to happen is next to impossible in that time frame and with D being achieved. C could be achieved if the dumb runaway was willing to sell me their final city in the middle of the Ice. That is the only way I can think of doing it. Otherwise, it'll involve backstabbing Ghandi-style!

 

[beetle]

Denouncing during a DOF displays the same bright red diplo penalty (with everyone) as DOW during a DOF. Both also display the same text in the Global Relations summary screen. But I am still not following why you could not wait for the DOF to be over before liberating a city when the timing is right.

In my game, one civ was killed by T150. So one might get lucky enough and have an early candidate for C even with an early SV.

I agree A is hard enough on its own, without B and C complicating things. In particular, I have seen an AI take 3 caps, but never before T230. Good Luck, Commander!

 

[Wild_Woojsha]

Denouncing during a DOF displays the same bright red diplo penalty (with everyone) as DOW during a DOF. Both also display the same text in the Global Relations summary screen. But I am still not following why you could not wait for the DOF to be over before liberating a city when the timing is right.

In my game, one civ was killed by T150. So one might get lucky enough and have an early candidate for C even with an early SV.

I agree A is hard enough on its own, without B and C complicating things. In particular, I have seen an AI take 3 caps, but never before T230. Good Luck, Commander!

I still don't know the specifics of Diplomacy, that is why. I can still count my actual Deity Victories on one hand, although they have been glorious. I would have more, but I don't have enough time to play this game, just talk about it on here.

I think the best way to achieve C will be to wait until the turn before launch to either conquer or buy the final city of a Dead Civ and liberate it. Then it doesn't matter what happens or what the consequences are.

For me though, the hardest part will be not getting invaded with a pile of scouts and getting the victory by Turn 230. I am pretty good at timing it all now, but I still struggle with the end game and getting enough Great Scientists to bulb my way to victory. I may very well be able to pull off everything but A with my plan, but who knows.

These Deity Challenges though are like steroids to a powerlifter when it comes to improving how we play this game. I've improved from Warlord to Emperor in the short time I have joined and only struggle on Immortal and Deity. Emperor and Below are not even a challenge anymore, even if I screw around I win regardless.

 

[vadalaz]

T100

Spoiler :

Carthage is doing well in my playthrough. They eliminated Egypt by T70ish and settled the whales spot in the north on T57. Had to bribe Dido to attack Theodora around T90 as the elephants were approaching. I'm still eligible for the no military units achievement and I finally got a military CS ally, so I have 2 options now:

- try to stay peaceful on these 4 cities, and hope Dido doesn't crush me. This gets me achievement D and makes sub-230 relatively easy, as long as I don't get swarmed by elephants
- get crossbows right now, either settle a 5th city somewhere or just take Carthago Nova, and try to get an Egyptian city in a peace deal to resurrect Ramesses. This slows down science though, and it can take ages before Dido agrees to give up a city in a peace deal

It's been a good game science-wise so far, T77 4-city NC, T94 Education. I got Oracle and Hagia Sophia, could've gotten HG as well but didn't go for it because 3 AIs went Tradition.

Spoiler :

 

[stormtrooper412]

Nice

I honestly dread the endgame at this point. if I do get there I see potential troubles:

1. happiness from ideology pressure. The AIs are really giving it all into culture. The only hope is to let the culture runaway have the first pick and follow them

2. late game invasion means insta game over since I'm also doing the 'no-units' run. No way to pass Sci funding since all AIs went culture. Thankfully nobody was really mad over it.

3. kind of impossible for me to finish before 270

 

[beetle]

I am very jealous of Budweiser, ST412, and anyone else who happens to send their starting warrior due south.

I was so jealous I restarted from T0. I did not get close. I have no idea how so many people are settling the NW! I went back to my T160 game.

 

[vadalaz]

T150

Spoiler :

Decided to go for the peaceful play. I don't like staying on 4 cities but I really couldn't afford having a war with Carthage. Dido keeps being annoying though - lost LToP to her by 2 turns (T133).

Almaty kept gifting me Mohawk Warriors so I teched Steel and upgraded them just to keep my military score up. My army consists of 3 longswords, a pikeman and a crossbow-scarcher now. Not much, but it's something... Dido appears to be friendly for now, and I have DoFs with Arabia, Byzantium and Persia.

World's Fair in a few turns, winning it seems kind of unlikely with such low hammers, but I'll try. Next proposal will have to be Science Funding, gotta get that achievement. I think I should be able to pass it with diplomats.

Spoiler :

 

[beetle]

Next proposal will have to be Science Funding, gotta get that achievement. I think I should be able to pass it with diplomats.

I have never used diplomats before Globalization. How does that work? Do they still net you an extra vote? And then two extra votes post-Globalization?

The only achievement I think I will get is recalling a civ to life, but I keep postponing the attempt. I just bribed the crazy eastern AI to DOW the crazy western AI. Just a small ocean between them...

The closest influencers went Autocracy, so no help for SV. My tech is slower than I would like, but just fast enough that the Autocracy SP double-fast steal seems to be a waste.

I am waiting for the +15xp Tier 2 tenet before I start building units, but I still have a couple in Rationalism before that, so very much a waiting game. I don't expect to launch before T300, but I am looking forward to significant carnage between SS parts...

I finally took a city from the southern AI who has been griefing me all game. Stolen tech saved me all of one turn of research! I think his cap is first on my hit parade, mostly for spite and because he was the runaway in Budweiser’s game. My army for now is very thin, having lost a couple of units, so I made white peace for now while bid my time...

 

[stormtrooper412]

do you get to choose or the tech is a random one? I have never used Assyrian war machine

 

[beetle]

I really think turtling is the wrong way to play Assyria.

I agree with that. I pretty much turtled with them for the DCL so I definitely want to be more aggressive this time around. I already struggle with DOM, but even more so on large maps (like the previous CDG, and the Assyria DCL).

do you get to choose or the tech is a random one? I have never used Assyrian war machine

I am pretty sure it is random. But, because of spies, in this game I know there was one and only one tech available. I have taken two cities, one twice, and stolen two techs. In both cases, I had a spy at work in the respective AI caps. After taking the city, the next turn the spy reports no technology available to steal.

I actually don't think Assyria is very good for Deity warmongering. Timing for the UU is quite limited and the sapper promotion does not stick on upgrading. The Royal Library buff is 10 xp when you need 15 for a promotion. The UA gets you less than an extra spy would.

That said, I really like having canons and arty with double cover. I have trouble keeping those alive until I have AA guns.

 

[vadalaz]

I have never used diplomats before Globalization. How does that work? Do they still net you an extra vote? And then two extra votes post-Globalization?

You can buy another civ's votes if you have a diplomat in their capital. It's usually expensive or impossible to get them to vote on a proposal they don't like, like Sci Funding in this case, so the trick is to bribe them to vote for the other proposal. This way you spread their votes at least, and it becomes easier to outbid them.

Spoiler :

Passed Sci Funding but lost PT, by a couple of turns again. I think I should still be able to finish before T230 but it'll be close. If I get very lucky with CS gifts I might recall a civ to life as well. I suppose I should try upgrading the few units I have and slam them all into a conquered capital a couple of turns before victory.