The European Project: the future of the EU.

[innonimatu]

And if a bona fide transfer union needs be for that, then one is going to be needed. But then a functioning transfer union will bring other measures of accountability and control to bear on individual member states. And how THAT plays out will likely make of break things.

We know how that went, form the Troika times. Lies upon lies. "Austerity will make you recover." Such was the "accountability" imposed for those generous loans.

NO! Keep your euros, be stuffed with them.

As for public sector pay: a medic who decides to work for out public service can expect to take home about 1000€ a month. Or he can emigrate to another EU country. You want to demand us to pay even less to medics? Or you want us all to die sick and the rest is mere pretense?

 

[EnglishEdward]

@Hrothbern

It is a nice diagram, but the proportion of GDP that goes to wages varies between countries.

And I suspect that the definition of public employee varies.

In the UK most well paid surgeons and other medical specialists are public employees,
but I am not sure that such would be the case in countries with insurance based health.

 

[Hrothbern]

@Hrothbern

It is a nice diagram, but the proportion of GDP that goes to wages varies between countries.

And I suspect that the definition of public employee varies.

In the UK most well paid surgeons and other medical specialists are public employees,
but I am not sure that such would be the case in countries with insurance based health.

There are not that many "simple" overviews with many countries on the wage premium of civil servants.
Whether health and social care is privatised plays a role ofc.
What I do know is that it does matter whether civil servants, especially clerks were part of austerity actions or not (also making the structures lean from overhead, middle management or not). And we had a lot of austerity moments since the oil crisis of 1973.
In all those waves in my country people like nurses were protected, but the clerks, the bureaucrats, the managing clerks, etc, got the full heat. Austerity waves had less negative effects on industrial workers.

 

[Kyriakos]

Morelike Ack!

Disappointed at the dutch PM. He shouldn't speak badly of Erdogan, unless he plans to stop being Merkel's donkey and agree to real sanctions against Turkey.
Atm it just seems he worries about losing some of his own far-right voters to the authentic far right dutch party, whose leader apparently posted this sketch - and Erdogan, being the moron he is, wants to sue him as if this will accomplish anything.

 

[Hrothbern]

Morelike Ack!

Disappointed at the dutch PM. He shouldn't speak badly of Erdogan, unless he plans to stop being Merkel's donkey and agree to real sanctions against Turkey.
Atm it just seems he worries about losing some of his own far-right voters to the authentic far right dutch party, whose leader apparently posted this sketch - and Erdogan, being the moron he is, wants to sue him as if this will accomplish anything.

Can you quote what Rutte said ?

 

[Kyriakos]

Can you quote what Rutte said ?

I can, but only in greek. I am sure you will do better
Basically something about freedom to use cartoons. And -between the lines- "please, far-right voters, come to me instead"

 

[Hrothbern]

I can, but only in greek. I am sure you will do better
Basically something about freedom to use cartoons. And -between the lines- "please, far-right voters, come to me instead"

no, no, no

Quote
do it in Greek if you have to

 

[Kyriakos]

https://swarajyamag.com/insta/turki...lders-for-posting-a-cartoon-of-him-in-twitter

"
Erdogan’s lawyer Huseyin Aydin filed a criminal complaint to the Ankara prosecutor’s office for “insulting the president,” a punishable under Turkish law.

“Suspect Wilders, in his content targeting our first [directly] elected [by public] president, used expressions insulting the honour and dignity of our president, and committed the crime publicly by targeting his personality, dignity and reputation,” state-run Anadolu news agency quoted the complaint as saying on Tuesday.
"


Your heroic (but very eager for those skinhead votes nonetheless ) PM seems to have made this great post which puts an end to things: "“In the Netherlands, we consider freedom of expression as the highest good. And cartoons are part of that, including cartoons of politicians,” Rutte told reporters."
Like I noted, how very donkey-like.

"
Erdogan already hit back at Wilders over the cartoon this weekend, saying: “There is this so-called Dutch deputy who speaks ill of us. Unlike him, we don’t condone racism, and fascists have no place in Turkey.”

Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu also condemned the cartoon, saying that “the racist losers of Europe have shown their true colours when faced with reality.”
"

 

[local_hero]

I must say that it's utterly pathetic passing a law that makes it punishable to insult the president.

"Boho, my critics don't like me"

 

[Hrothbern]

https://swarajyamag.com/insta/turki...lders-for-posting-a-cartoon-of-him-in-twitter
Erdogan’s lawyer Huseyin Aydin filed a criminal complaint to the Ankara prosecutor’s office for “insulting the president,” a punishable under Turkish law.
“Suspect Wilders, in his content targeting our first [directly] elected [by public] president, used expressions insulting the honour and dignity of our president, and committed the crime publicly by targeting his personality, dignity and reputation,” state-run Anadolu news agency quoted the complaint as saying on Tuesday.


Your heroic (but very eager for those skinhead votes nonetheless ) PM seems to have made this great post which puts an end to things: "“In the Netherlands, we consider freedom of expression as the highest good. And cartoons are part of that, including cartoons of politicians,” Rutte told reporters."
Like I noted, how very donkey-like.

"
Erdogan already hit back at Wilders over the cartoon this weekend, saying: “There is this so-called Dutch deputy who speaks ill of us. Unlike him, we don’t condone racism, and fascists have no place in Turkey.”

Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu also condemned the cartoon, saying that “the racist losers of Europe have shown their true colours when faced with reality.”
"

"“In the Netherlands, we consider freedom of expression as the highest good. And cartoons are part of that, including cartoons of politicians,” Rutte told reporters."

I reacted on this line in your first post:

He shouldn't speak badly of Erdogan

So... where did Rutte speak badly of Erdogan ?

 

[Kyriakos]

"“In the Netherlands, we consider freedom of expression as the highest good. And cartoons are part of that, including cartoons of politicians,” Rutte told reporters."

I reacted on this line in your first post:


So... where did Rutte speak badly of Erdogan ?

Out of tact I tried to pretend I didn't get what you meant. Really, that is your issue?*
Don't worry, no one seriously accused Botke of saying anything against Erdogan.

*likewise, I still pretend I don't get what you thought you were getting to.

 

[Hrothbern]

I must say that it's utterly pathetic passing a law that makes it punishable to insult the president.

"Boho, my critics don't like me"

According to Turkish media, 36,000 criminal investigations took place last year into alleged insults against Erdogan, ANP news agency reported. Insulting the president has been punishable in Turkey since 1926, but most complaints have been filed against Erdogan in recent years. The maximum sentence for this offense is four years in prison.
https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2020/10/2...laagt-geert-wilders-aan-om-spotprent-a4017532

 

[Hrothbern]

Out of tact I tried to pretend I didn't get what you meant. Really, that is your issue?*
Don't worry, no one seriously accused Botke of saying anything against Erdogan.

*likewise, I still pretend I don't get what you thought you were getting to.

I am very simple Kyr
I do not like oil on the fire with such sensitive issues
So I do want clear in this thread that Rutte did not say something badly on Erdogan as in a soap.

 

[Kyriakos]

I am very simple Kyr
I do not like oil on the fire with such sensitive issues
So I do want clear in this thread that Rutte did not say something badly on Erdogan as in a soap.

No one cares about Rutte, Hroth.

 

[Hrothbern]

No one cares about Rutte, Hroth.

I do care about the PM-ship, the PM of my country because that PM represents my country and my fellow citizens. Has nothing to do with Rutte.

 

[Kyriakos]

I do care about the PM-ship, the PM of my country because that PM represents my country and my fellow citizens. Has nothing to do with Rutte.

You are in Holland. I mean in Europe as a whole

 

[r16]

ı think 11 000 have been punished in various degrees . When lmamoğlu won in lstanbul , the PM said he would be a lame duck , unable to achieve anything with the A-K-P majority in the city council . Some CHP MP said that was not so , instead the PM would be the lame duck . Out of this , there is an investigation and the Parliament next year might vote on whether to strip the MP of his immunity so that he could be tried in court .

 

[local_hero]

According to Turkish media, 36,000 criminal investigations took place last year into alleged insults against Erdogan, ANP news agency reported. Insulting the president has been punishable in Turkey since 1926, but most complaints have been filed against Erdogan in recent years. The maximum sentence for this offense is four years in prison.
https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2020/10/2...laagt-geert-wilders-aan-om-spotprent-a4017532

Such a waste of time and money. I hope we get a world soon where grown man babies don't lead governments.

Won't derail this any further.

 

[r16]

what de-railing ? The EU and the UK are like fighting a war in Libya over who will take the most from New Turkey .

 

[Hrothbern]

You are in Holland. I mean in Europe as a whole

We are only 17 million people living in "ons kikkerlandje" (translated "our small frog country").
One of my first lessons at primary school describing the medieval period was about the poor serfs poking at nights with poles in the canals to prevent the frogs from making their loud noises, so that the nobility in the castle could sleep.