The History of Jerusalem?

[Mark Young]

I was wondering f womone could help me with this.
A friend and I were discussing the history of Jerusalem earlier tonight and he reckons that up until about the mid 1800's it was pretty much deserted until the Jews moved back in.
But I was under the impression that it was always settled as it was an important place to the muslims.

Can any help me and let me know what really was going on in Jerusalem from the time of Saladin until the 20th century?

btw I looked in the history archive's but didn't find anything there that was relevant.

 

[Knight-Dragon]

It was the the third holiest site in Islam, after Mecca and Medinah. I think Jerusalem was continuosly settled during all that time.

It did change hands often though.

 

[Mark Young]

So if it was the 3rd Holiest city then that by definition would of meant that it was important and would have been looked after and not left to ruination.

Also does anyone know when the Mosque of Omar was built?
I vaguely remember something about it bieng in the 1800's but I'm not 100% sure.

 

[pawpaw]

i believe it holds holy sites for all 3 religions-jewish, islam and christianity-very important to all 3

 

[pawpaw]

after saladin jerusalem fell to the egyptian mamlukes in the 1200's and was rebuilt and regained much of its religious and commeral importance. this continued under the ottomans after they took it in 1516 ( i think ). but the late 1500's it began to decline ( like most of the ottoman empire ) till around 1800. renewed christian and jewish pilgrams lead to the building of many churches and by 1900 the jewish community was the largest in the city help any

 

[Benderino]

Yes, however their has always been a Jewish community living within her walls, big or small.

 

[Pangur Bán]

Originally posted by XIII
It was the the third holiest site in Islam, after Mecca and Medinah. I think Jerusalem was continuosly settled during all that time.

It did change hands often though.

Well, this is what Palestinian nationalists will tell you, but the third "holiest city in Islam" seems to have been Damascus up until recently.

 

[Benderino]

How so? I didn't know that, but that is enlightening information, indeed.

 

[Yago]

Well, this is what Palestinian nationalists will tell you, but the third "holiest city in Islam" seems to have been Damascus up until recently

I do not think so. It seems more or less so, that there's an overwhelming opinion, that Jerusalem is the third holliest city. Iirc, the prophet ascended heaven in Jerusalem, that seems quiet important to me.

But I'm sure many other islamic cities are/were important too. Which would be the most importatant cities of christianity ? Jerusalem, Istanbul, Rome, Moscow, Canterbury, the place were the relicts of St. James lie ?

To the poulation issue. I think Jerusalem was a smaller city in the 19th. century. But then, Berlin had quite a population growth in the 19th century too. In earlier day, cities where smaller. So, what's the deeper meaning of that ?

 

[Benderino]

I'd say Rome is the most important (Vatican especially) but since I'm not Christian, I can't really talk. I do know that Jerusalem is the #1 spot for the Jews, for sure.

 

[Pangur Bán]

Originally posted by Yago


I do not think so. It seems more or less so, that there's an overwhelming opinion, that Jerusalem is the third holliest city. Iirc, the prophet ascended heaven in Jerusalem, that seems quiet important to me.

Yeah, it's an overwhelming modern "opinion" formulated because of nationalism, not because of truth. Jerusalem, of course, is sacred to Moslems.Traditionally Muhammed ascended to heaven in Jerusalem, but I have it on good authority that that's not actually in the Koran; if so, it is then just an apocryphal myth. However Damascus was a much more popular pilgrimage centre. ANd, pray tell me, how else is one supposed to measure these things?

Since moslems didn't actually keep a league table on the subject (you'd get the impression that they did), the suggestion that Jerusalem has some eternal status as 3rd holiest place is purely politics. We, as neutrals, should not go repeating such things mindlessly; that just makes us the political tool of someone else's political cause.

 

[Pangur Bán]

Originally posted by Yago


But I'm sure many other islamic cities are/were important too. Which would be the most importatant cities of christianity ? Jerusalem, Istanbul, Rome, Moscow, Canterbury, the place were the relicts of St. James lie ?

Rome, without question, is, after Jerusalem, Christianity's most sacred city! Not just because of the Catholic Church, but because of St Peter and St Paul.

The ordering afterwards (which would include numerous places in the Holy Land) would be pretty arbitrary.

 

[gael]

Was Rome not made a holy city for christians through politics aswell?

 

[Benderino]

I just thought that St. Peter's cathedral was there, as well as the Pope. Those are very significant, I'd say.

 

[Pangur Bán]

Originally posted by gael
Was Rome not made a holy city for christians through politics aswell?

St Peter and St Paul were martyred there.

 

[Pangur Bán]

Originally posted by Yago

the place were the relicts of St. James lie ?

I think those are everywhere.

Seriously though, that saint's bones were rediscovered at Santiago de Compostela by a hermit in the 9th Century.

 

[Yago]

Santiago de Compostela

Lol, I was seeking for that Compostela part. But Rome ?

I'm not quiet so sure, wouldn't Constantinople much more important for chistianity ? I mean it's the city of the first christian emperor. With the hagia sofia. On the other hand, who cares, it's an orthodox city, not a catholic/protestant one. And for the political part, without the patriarch and emperor in Konstantinople, ahm... the clearer cut is the position of rome. (Yeah, I know the fractions between the emperor and the pope started very early and the definitive friction came sometime in the 1100 century, but still, one competitior out of the field). And somehow, taking it away from the turks never came up in western western Europe. I don't know for sure, but getting back Istanbul, didn't that play a part in the wars between Russia and the Ottoman Empire ?


And for Russian-Orthodox, wouldn't play Moscow an important role ? And Instanbul there too ?

The point I wanted to try to make, it's quiet problematic to have a list of cities important for religion. Even it seems clear cut that rome is number one. But I think, that for a roman-catholic/protestant world. I'm not quite sure about orthodox.

By the way, the bishiop who was guarding the remains of St. Peter demanded equal political status.

 

[Pangur Bán]

Originally posted by Yago


Lol, I was seeking for that Compostela part. But Rome ?

I'm not quiet so sure, wouldn't Constantinople much more important for chistianity ? I mean it's the city of the first christian emperor. With the hagia sofia. On the other hand, who cares, it's an orthodox city, not a catholic/protestant one. And for the political part, without the patriarch and emperor in Konstantinople, ahm... the clearer cut is the position of rome. (Yeah, I know the fractions between the emperor and the pope started very early and the definitive friction came sometime in the 1100 century, but still, one competitior out of the field).


And for Russian-Orthodox, wouldn't play Moscow an important role ? And Instanbul there too ?

Yeah, Moscow and Constantinople are sacred. Moscow less so.

But Rome leads them quite clearly I think. The martyrdom of St Paul and St Peter are two of the most important events in Christianity (and aren't they buried there???). Rome was also the senior Patriarchal Seat of the Church (even the Orthodox acknowledged that). After all, Constantinople and Moscow are the 2nd and 3rd Rome. Never mind the fact that it is still the seat of the Catholic Church, the biggest of Christianity's branches!

But, Constantinople is up there.That city, though, has no role in the Bible, and that is very important. Add to that the fact that most of Constantinople's relics are no longer there.

Alexandria and Antioch are also very holy BTW.

 

[HannibalBarka]

for muslims Jerusalem is the 3rd holiest city, and it has nothing to do with politics. By the way, Jerusalem in arabic is Al-quds and that means "The holy place";
Now for a lot of Arabs and Muslims, Damascus Baghdad or Cairo are great cities where arabic and Islamic civilization reched it peac; Just as for the French for example, Paris is Great, Rome or Jerusalem are Holy.

 

[G-Man]

Saying Jerusalem is the third holiest city is, to a large extent, a political saying. Islam has two very holy cities - Mecca and Medina. Jerusalem is just one site out of many with stories regarding muhamad attached to them. No where in the Kuran or in the religious writings does it say Jerusalem is num3.

As to the city, it was very small untill the late 19th century. The entire city was what today is known as "the old city". Only with the growth of the jewish population (Jeruslame is one of five cities that had a jewish community since biblical times) and the encouragment of a wealthy jewish traveler did the jews build nehibourhoods outside the city's walls, a process which started the city's growth. Untill then the city was just a very small town.