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The HRE was Holy, partialy Roman, and an Empire!

:lol:

anyway, back on topic, more arguments against the HRE, someone... or for, if you would prefer...
 
Gaius Octavius said:
All right, I'll be the first to say it... The Holy Roman Empire is "something wicked."

:D
Click to expand...

What can I say.. damn right, I suppose. :D

Ah, by the way, has anybody mentioned Poland just yet? ;)
 
cybrxkhan said:
:lol:

anyway, back on topic, more arguments against the HRE, someone... or for, if you would prefer...
Click to expand...

I'm alittle tired out over discussing the HRE and unless anyone posts otherwise in this thread now we all are against the OP and the HRE.

SomethingWicked said:
What can I say.. damn right, I suppose. :D

Ah, by the way, has anybody mentioned Poland just yet? ;)
Click to expand...

Well you did now.:p hmm...maybe Gauis' laws are right:hmm:
 
Okay, since everyone hates the HRE because they were no Holy, Roman, or an Empire, I now declare that I hate The Native American Empire because they weren't Native, they weren't American, and they weren't an empire. All they were was a bunch of tribes, sometimes fighting each other, and sometimes living in peace. They were never unified, and Sitting bull never was a leader of ALL Native Americans. I say they shouldn't be in, and Canada should be in instead. Now I'm gonna start spamming threads in the BTS forum about how I will loathe Firaxis for making such a bad mistake by not including Canada instead of NAE!
 
They are called the Holy Roman Empire because THAT WAS THE NAME THEY TOOK FOR THEMSELVES! Some leaders were pious, some were not, some took the Rome succession to heart, others couldn't care less.
HRE was no more or less an "Empire" than most other european powers in it's day. England had a "King", but it was the nobles who owned the land and could overrule the King when needed (magna carta). The King also didn't have the right to revoke lands from noble houses, or he would cause a war. So his word wasn't law, he got along by greasing the nobs.
Almost every other feudal power worked the same way. The HRE refers to a collection of powers that allied themselves under one banner in name at least while squabbling for control of the heap. Guess what, that's what feudalism was.
HRE is in. It should be in. It was pretty powerful in its time, about a millenia, and no less united than Native Americans, Greeks, Vikings, Chinese or Japan. It was a feudal empire, it served it's time, get over it.
 
Why does it matter that the Holy Roman Empire wasn't Holy, Roman, or an Empire? The Emperors referred to themselves as the Holy Roman Emperor, so that is what it is called. I agree, the Holy Roman Empire wasn't truly Roman, which is why Firaxis distinguishes it from the Roman Empire. Whether it is truly Holy or Roman is irrelevant anyway because it is merely what they called themselves. It's like saying debating whether the United States of America are truly united states or if it's a confederation of states. It simply doesn't matter because it's just the name of the Civilization; it doesn't mean that it is not worthy of inclusion in the game.

Again, the Byzantine Empire - which nobody seems to have a problem with - was invented by modern historians to distinguish it from the Roman Empire. It always considered itself the Roman Empire and expected to reconquer the West to reestablish the Roman Empire. Byzantine is not a real Civilization; the term never existed until the last couple hundred years!

The Holy Roman Empire, whether truly Holy, Roman, or an Empire, often claimed most of the territory in Western Europe. Whether or not you believe it is really an empire, rulers continued to refer themselves as the Holy Roman Emperor for a thousand years after Charlemagne. Someone who is considered the father of western Europe surely deserves inclusion in the game, but why would he be included as a German or French leader when Germany and France didn't exist?

Also, I don't see many people point out that Frederick belongs as a leader of the Holy Roman Empire rather than Germany now.
 
Not a canuck. Just someone who studies a variety of histories and writings and isn't above lifting a favorite word or two when it seems appropriate (also incredibly humble).
But I'm sure you'll agree you're being silly pining for your precious Poland and your dislike of the HRE is completely out of spite. I'm glad I've been able to enlighten you with the help of other posters and you will be enriched from this experience. Eh?
 
The main point is that the HRE was germany if they were separate civs then well germany only existed in the dark ages and modern times, not the middle ages. The Byzantines are different because they were essentially a different people, they developed a distinct culture and religion, and were just very different from the older Roman Empire. The Hre is part of Germany is the main point, Saying the HRE was neither holy, roman, nor an empire, only serves to further prove that the Hre shouldn't be included. You are litterally adding in a second germany, it means squat if they were powerful, who cares they were a dynasty just becuase the song dynasty were powerful, influential, and highly advanced does not mean they are a different civ than China. The HRE was dominated by Germans and marked the sole history of germans for a large chunk of their history. The HRE did encompass at times other people but that is saying the EU is a different civ, they are a political entity and do not define a distinct culture and ethnicity.
 
I want the fourms to spawn a great poster, that uses his special post ability to stop all HRE threads.

And no I did not read any of the other posts on this thread.
 
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