The Rights of Men

[brennan]

Says he won't create a strawman... creates strawman..

 

[Ryika]

I'm sure you will provide evidence of that then, right? Also, Sarkeesian has actually had harassment, people threatening her life and such, not sure why you want to make a joke about that though, given it's seriousness.

Of course I will - it's from the UN-Speech she gave in mid-september (the one with the horrible "cyber harassment"-report that the UN then had to take back, partly because one of the citations led to someone's Harddrive...). Here's the quote:

"I have been the target for three years nonstop of egregious online harassment at all levels. I think it's important to recognize that harassment is, as someone had mentioned, it's not just what is legal and illegal, right? Harassment is threats of violence, but it's also the day to day grind of 'you're a liar', 'you suck', making all these hate videos to attack us on a regular basis and the mobs that come from those hate videos, etc."

I will not go through the pain of searching the part of her speech now, but you can find the video on youtube and the quote probably over the internet.

About Sarkeesians Harassment: Yes, as any public figure she has probably gotten tons of harassment and "death threats" (that never translate into real danger), that is hardly surprising and unfortunately what people have to deal with on the internet. People like thunderf00t and Sargon of Akkad, both activists on the exact opposite site of the "debate" get the same treatment and even a neutral person like Dave Rubin (The Rubin Report) has spoken about the hatemail he gets.

That's not unique to Anita Sarkeesian, that's not unique to an ideological position, that's not unique to women and that has nothing to do with people who disagree. If you can't deal with people telling you that your research is crap, then you shouldn't be a public person.

 

[useless]

I'd consider someone, unwarrented, coming up to me, be it physically or through social media and insulting me everyday to be harassment.

And sorry, just because the threats have yet to result in actual concrete action doesn't make them any less evil or insidious.

 

[Ryika]

I'd consider someone, unwarrented, coming up to me, be it physically or through social media and insulting me everyday to be harassment.

Anita Sarkeesian regularly posts on Twitter, often very inflammatory and bigoted nonsense herself, so it's no wonder that she gets responses.

And sorry, just because the threats have yet to result in actual concrete action doesn't make them any less evil or insidious.

It does not make them less evil or insidious, but it does diminish the "I get death threats!"-response. Those threats are unfortunately internet background noise and the proper way to respond to them is not to respond to them at all, NOT to put them into the foreground to make more money on Patreon or, in Sarkeesians case, to get attention whenever she loses relevance.

 

[useless]

Pointing out that there are issues regarding the portrayel of women in video games isn't bigotry or even new.

Ah yes the old "she's bringing it on herself" conveniantly forgetting that Sarkeesian wouldn't even be famous if it wasn't for the hatred she got, totally unwarrented for what was essentially a feminism 101 look at video games.

 

[Ryika]

Pointing out that there are issues regarding the portrayel of women in video games isn't bigotry or even new.

That's not what I'm talking about, it's gems like this:

"There’s no such thing as sexism against men. That's because sexism is prejudice + power. Men are the dominant gender with power in society."
https://twitter.com/femfreq/status/533445611543363585?lang=en

(Also look at the replies she gets, most people tell her that she's talking nonsense in a somewhat civil manner.)

Ah yes the old "she's bringing it on herself" conveniantly forgetting that Sarkeesian wouldn't even be famous if it wasn't for the hatred she got, totally unwarrented for what was essentially a feminism 101 look at video games.

No, I did not say she brought it on herself, what I said is that she's doing a good job at showing the same behavior, admiringly by using less swear words than many people who attack her.

But either way, I already said that she gets harassment and that in an ideal world nobody would get harassed, but that's not what the internet is at the moment. Everyone gets harassment, it's that simple.

But people disagreeing with her or calling her out when she talks nonsense is still not harassment.

 

[brennan]

...says he won't create a strawman... creates a strawman... rofl.

Can we not go through the whole... look-feminists-get-harassed-and-receive-death-threats-yes-but-they-give-as-good-as-they-get-well-I never-claimed-they-were-perfect dance again?

Feminists have made death threats, bomb threats and are reigning world champs at harassment (see the impending collapse of the Graham Alan Elliott trial for a prime example - a man's life ruined for years for daring to object to feminist bullying tactics.)

 

[brennan]

I have to point out that a feminist is making the men's rights thread all about feminism yet again.

 

[Flying Pig]

No, I did not say she brought it on herself, what I said is that she's doing a good job at showing the same behavior, admiringly by using less swear words than many people who attack her.

But either way, I already said that she gets harassment and that in an ideal world nobody would get harassed, but that's not what the internet is at the moment. Everyone gets harassment, it's that simple.

But people disagreeing with her or calling her out when she talks nonsense is still not harassment.

I'm going out on a limb to say that nothing a person can say in a video game review can make them deserve to be made to fear for their safety. I'm also going to say that no reaction to someone who makes you fear like that can be so excessive to be in any way comparable to making those threats in the first place.

 

[brennan]

Yeah yeah, bad stuff is bad. Can we not let the derail work please?

 

[Ryika]

I'm going out on a limb to say that nothing a person can say in a video game review can make them deserve to be made to fear for their safety. I'm also going to say that no reaction to someone who makes you fear like that can be so excessive to be in any way comparable to making those threats in the first place.

And I'm going to say that sacrificing children is not a good thing to do, because it ends the life of a very young being just to please gods that have a high likelihood to not answer, not like your sacrifice or not exist in the first place. And eating worms is gross btw.

What exactly does any of this have to do with what I have said? The fact that I explain why stuff happens and that it does not happen to only one kind of person does not mean I'm endorsing it.

But disagreeing with a person, telling a person that she's talking nonsense, making video-responses to refute ones arguments is still not harassment.

Anyway, back to topic! Where were we?

 

[useless]

Why are you so intent on controlling where this thread does and does not go, especially when you are not the op? If you want a feminism free thread, make one.

 

[brennan]

This is an RD thread about men's rights. You are banging on about Anita bloody Sarkeesian for the billionth time. If you want to start a thread about Anita Sarkeesian then start one.

(If you had the slightest bit of sense you'd realise that I have no interest in controlling the content of the thread and am merely pointing out that every post you make exposes the lie that MRA's are obsessed with feminists rather than the reverse.)

 

[bhavv]

 

[jackelgull]

Why are you so intent on controlling where this thread does and does not go, especially when you are not the op? If you want a feminism free thread, make one.

This thread is off topic right now, unless you want to bring the Anita Sarkeesian talk back to some point about how online bullying is a men's issue, and I believe it is not so. Men and women seem to face online harassment on a similar basis, the nature of the threats seem to be different. Men are more likely to have their masculinity questioned and accused of being homosexuals, while women are more likely to receive rape threats. At least, that has been my experience.

And just to clarify, I did not make this thread intending to shut one viewpoint out of the conversation. I made this thread precisely so viewpoints would not be shut out of the conversation. I ask all posters to respect that, please.

 

[brennan]

Jokes about male body image may be in the process of becoming really unfunny.

http://news.sky.com/story/1403431/one-million-britons-may-use-steroids-regularly

It's the female gaze obviously...

 

[Flying Pig]

This thread is off topic right now, unless you want to bring the Anita Sarkeesian talk back to some point about how online bullying is a men's issue, and I believe it is not so. Men and women seem to face online harassment on a similar basis, the nature of the threats seem to be different. Men are more likely to have their masculinity questioned and accused of being homosexuals, while women are more likely to receive rape threats. At least, that has been my experience.

That's true, but I think there's also a difference in the quantity and aggression of online anger directed at women compared with that directed at men.

 

[brennan]

Studies show most online bullying is conducted by women as I recall... remember the banknote case?

 

[useless]

Is that a tacit acknowledgement that the Male gaze exists?

Edit: I'm sure you'll be able to post that study then, right?

 

[jackelgull]

Is that a tacit acknowledgement that the Male gaze exists?

I'm not sure I understand what you're trying to say.