troytheface said:
The more clear definition would be attack UU's with a bonus defense.
That's what you argue, but by including units that have strong defense
and speed you muddy the waters.
Speed is a secondary issue in so far as this theory claims
If you say so...then why do you keep including...
The movement is like a bonus, in particular for the Samarii which i contend may be the best UU in the game
But does the Samurai's strength come from its defensive value, or its speed? (or both?)
If you like the Legions then that's fine. There's nothing wrong with that. If you like units with good defensive stats, then that too is fine. If your theory that defensive strength is a Good Thing, but
continue to include units that are also fast, then you are mixing terms; making your argument harder to follow (and even harder to support).
Take away the Samurai's speed and what have you got? A Musket/Medeival Infantry in one, that I will skirmish to death with fast units. Take away that extra defensive hit point and what have you got? A Knight.
Comparing Legions to Samurai is like comparing apples to hand grenades. Both will boink you in the head, one will hit a little harder. It's not that I think you are necessarily "wrong", but your argument is just not consistent enough for me to take anything of value from it.
Ision's point is that "greater movement or greater attack will trump greater defense". By including units that have "bonus defense" but
also have speed, you are using units that really have 2 strengths. Breaking the UUs into classes:
Group 1: UUs that are defensive in nature, or have equal Attack/Defense value, and movement value of 1.
Hoplite <-not good for warmongering
Bowman <- deadly archer rush, runner up candidate.
Legion <- candidate for best of class
Swiss Merc <- not good for warmongering
Enkidu Warrior <-very cheap, runner up candidate.
Javelin Thrower <- 50% costlier than Bowman
Group 2: UUs that have an attack bonus compared to their counterparts:
Immortal <- Inspires fear
Berserk <-not to be trifled with
Numidian Merc <- not bad in combined arms...defensive in nature.
Musketeer <-still defensive in nature, ties for worst in class with NuMerc
Group 3: Fast Units with a Defensive Bonus
3 Man Chariot <-potentially dangerous
Samurai <-best of class
Cossack <-Might as well be Cav, but not to be taken lightly.
Group 4: Fast units with an attack bonus
War Chariot <-potentially dangerous, same A/D/M as a horse, 2/3 the cost...
Mounted Warrior <-dangerous
Sipahi <-dangerous
Group 5: Units with a movement bonus over their counterparts
Impi <- pillaging nightmare, still worst of class
Gallic Swordsman <-dangerous
Keshik <-dangerous in rough terrain
Ansar Warrior <-dangerous
Rider <-dangerous
Group 6: Units that replace non-combat units
Chasquis Scout <-to be respected
Conquistador <-to be respected in rough terrain
Now - explain your theory using from units from that first group, and I'll listen. But if you think that the first group is to be feared more than groups 4 or 5, I don't think many would agree.