TSG42 After Action Report
- Thread starter leif erikson
- Start date
MiniMe
For Glory
This didnt go very well, probably because I didnt really have time to play, and really shouldnt have. But did anyways ;-)
Probably as a result, most things never went the way I wanted. Went liberty, and realized later on I should have gone tradition.
Hoping to get more time for the next game, but not so sure I will.
Probably as a result, most things never went the way I wanted. Went liberty, and realized later on I should have gone tradition.
Hoping to get more time for the next game, but not so sure I will.
I did record 1. session, but as uploading parts to youtube take 1 day, no1 bothers watching anyway and my 2nd session got interupted by a mp game request i didnt bother record rest.
ll upload part 3 of this today
edit: part 3:
http://youtu.be/Ux64MSontYo
2nd time for GOTM. Have a lot fun. Again, thanks to leif erikson and everybody for stroy sharing.
Diplomatic Victory Turn 218 (UN 15 votes)
Final Pop 30, 19, 18, 26, 16, 15, 8
Diplo = Science / need to reach Globalization as fast as possible + 1 GE to build UN.
I decide to go with basic Tradition / Rationalism.
Turn Count
4 City
00 Palenque settle in place / Incense, Spice
36 Tikal SE near mountain / Marble, Silver, Spice
61 Chichen Itza North riverside / Copper, Wine
83 Uxmal South desert riverside / Incense, Spice
War
Early war with Austria, somehow her empire is very puny, so I let her live for trade partner and future RA.
Later war with Sweden
131 Capture Stockholm (Sweden)
143 Capture Helsinki (Sweden)
181 Capture Sigtuna (Sweden)
Religion
Pantheon = Fertility Rites +10% Growth (Don't pick Sacred Path to avoid more culture to hurt timing of Rationalism)
Founder = Tithe
1st Follwer = Religious Community
2nd Follwer = Pagoda
Enhancer = Itinerant Preacher
Technology
67 Theology (turn on Mayan Long Count)
105 Acoustic (Renaissance) Timing with Oracle to open Rationalism
152 RA with Austria
161 RA with Greece
163 Scientific Theory (Industrial) <- my mistake here to delay Industrial era for cheaper faith spent on Pagoda, which greatly impact on beaker output
183 RA with Austria (doesn't matter because RA mature after reach Globalization)
184 Replaceable Parts (Modern)
203 Atomic Theory (Atomic)
204 Ecology
205 Telecommunication, Globalization
Great Person
72 GS from 1st Mayan Long Count - Academy
86 GProphet (2nd MLC) - Enhance Religion
101 GE (3rd MLC) - Manufactory (should have picked GE as 2nd GP to rush Hanging Garden or Petra)
117 GM (4th MLC) - Trade Mission with Religious CS
133 GArtist (5th MLC) - settle
152 GG (6th MLC)
155 GS (Leaning Tower of Pisa) - Academy
164 GS (Porcelain Tower) - Academy
180 GS (1000 faith) save
183 GAdmiral (7th MLC)
198 GS (Palenque 800 GPP) save, GE (1000 faith) save
203 Bulb 2 GS
205 Bulb GE to rush UN
Social Policy
1. Full Tradion
2. Open Rationalism on turn 105
3. Left one policy out, detour to open Order and +25% science from factory
4. Complete Rationalism on turn 205, 2 free technology for Telecommunication, Globalization
Wonder
67 Finish Great Library in Palenque (delay a bit) to get free Theology.
83 Finish National College (delay 4th city).
92 England finish Hanging Garden beat me which hurt a lot in long term (should prioritize more)
94 Great Pyramids (Tikal)
105 Oracle (Palenque) to open Rationalism
114 Sweden finish Chichen Itza beat me by 4 turns which upset me a lot, so I decide to claim their cities for more beaker output.
118 GMOD (Tikal)
136 Notre Dame (Chichen Itza)
144 Terracotto Army (Palenque)
153 Sistine Chapel (Palenque)
155 Leaning Tower of Pisa (Chichen Itza)
164 Porcelain Tower (Palenque)
190 Big Ben (Chichen Itza)
192 Forbidden Palace (Tikal)
202 Taj Mahal (Palenque)
204 Oxford University (Tikal) bulb Ecology
216 Statue of Liberty (Chichen Itza)
Summary of possible improvement
- Better focus on a bit of military in raging barb map for more free CS influence
- Better use GE for Hanging Garden or Petra, effect will snowballing more than 4 hammer tile yield
- If not focus on faith early, I would rather pick other follower belief instead of Pagoda and focus to reach Industrial to focus on science/beaker output.
- Bulb GS and/or build Oxford early aim for key science tech especially Plastics (overflow from last 2 GS is too much)
Diplomatic Victory Turn 218 (UN 15 votes)
Final Pop 30, 19, 18, 26, 16, 15, 8
Diplo = Science / need to reach Globalization as fast as possible + 1 GE to build UN.
I decide to go with basic Tradition / Rationalism.
Turn Count
4 City
00 Palenque settle in place / Incense, Spice
36 Tikal SE near mountain / Marble, Silver, Spice
61 Chichen Itza North riverside / Copper, Wine
83 Uxmal South desert riverside / Incense, Spice
War
Early war with Austria, somehow her empire is very puny, so I let her live for trade partner and future RA.
Later war with Sweden
131 Capture Stockholm (Sweden)
143 Capture Helsinki (Sweden)
181 Capture Sigtuna (Sweden)
Religion
Pantheon = Fertility Rites +10% Growth (Don't pick Sacred Path to avoid more culture to hurt timing of Rationalism)
Founder = Tithe
1st Follwer = Religious Community
2nd Follwer = Pagoda
Enhancer = Itinerant Preacher
Technology
67 Theology (turn on Mayan Long Count)
105 Acoustic (Renaissance) Timing with Oracle to open Rationalism
152 RA with Austria
161 RA with Greece
163 Scientific Theory (Industrial) <- my mistake here to delay Industrial era for cheaper faith spent on Pagoda, which greatly impact on beaker output
183 RA with Austria (doesn't matter because RA mature after reach Globalization)
184 Replaceable Parts (Modern)
203 Atomic Theory (Atomic)
204 Ecology
205 Telecommunication, Globalization
Great Person
72 GS from 1st Mayan Long Count - Academy
86 GProphet (2nd MLC) - Enhance Religion
101 GE (3rd MLC) - Manufactory (should have picked GE as 2nd GP to rush Hanging Garden or Petra)
117 GM (4th MLC) - Trade Mission with Religious CS
133 GArtist (5th MLC) - settle
152 GG (6th MLC)
155 GS (Leaning Tower of Pisa) - Academy
164 GS (Porcelain Tower) - Academy
180 GS (1000 faith) save
183 GAdmiral (7th MLC)
198 GS (Palenque 800 GPP) save, GE (1000 faith) save
203 Bulb 2 GS
205 Bulb GE to rush UN
Social Policy
1. Full Tradion
2. Open Rationalism on turn 105
3. Left one policy out, detour to open Order and +25% science from factory
4. Complete Rationalism on turn 205, 2 free technology for Telecommunication, Globalization
Wonder
67 Finish Great Library in Palenque (delay a bit) to get free Theology.
83 Finish National College (delay 4th city).
92 England finish Hanging Garden beat me which hurt a lot in long term (should prioritize more)
94 Great Pyramids (Tikal)
105 Oracle (Palenque) to open Rationalism
114 Sweden finish Chichen Itza beat me by 4 turns which upset me a lot, so I decide to claim their cities for more beaker output.
118 GMOD (Tikal)
136 Notre Dame (Chichen Itza)
144 Terracotto Army (Palenque)
153 Sistine Chapel (Palenque)
155 Leaning Tower of Pisa (Chichen Itza)
164 Porcelain Tower (Palenque)
190 Big Ben (Chichen Itza)
192 Forbidden Palace (Tikal)
202 Taj Mahal (Palenque)
204 Oxford University (Tikal) bulb Ecology
216 Statue of Liberty (Chichen Itza)
Summary of possible improvement
- Better focus on a bit of military in raging barb map for more free CS influence
- Better use GE for Hanging Garden or Petra, effect will snowballing more than 4 hammer tile yield
- If not focus on faith early, I would rather pick other follower belief instead of Pagoda and focus to reach Industrial to focus on science/beaker output.
- Bulb GS and/or build Oxford early aim for key science tech especially Plastics (overflow from last 2 GS is too much)
has anybody else tried to wade through tommynt's vids yet? i made it through the first one and there are some things to be said about it. just wondering if anyone else has seen them yet. i'll spoil some text when i see if others have seen it or not.
I've only watched the first 20 minutes. Two scouts as first build was a good idea this game obviously. I often build two scouts and it usually pays off, but sometimes it doesn't and scouts can get eaten by barbs and AI enemy units. at lower difficulties maybe it's a better idea than at higher difficulties?
Also, nice move borrowing money and buying first settler quickly and plopping him down on a high food site considering the starting position was not so great for food.
Also, I noticed that very early he had a chance to meet Austria and decided not to. I should do this too! why waste a turn meeting someone you can't use yet? better to look for more ruins and city states.
Also liked third build for Mayan UB Pyramid - that's an awesome UB
well, it's kind of hard to watch that video. for one, it's in german and for the most part i recognize what he was doing but some things happened really quickly and i couldnt see exactly what it was, like getting a free tech from a ruins but i didnt see what tech it was. also it was silent and then the last 20 minutes or so have gone black from some software adjustment he made. not sure why he left it that way in the video.
Spoiler :
Haven't see the vid but do you mean he found the outlines of their territory and decided to not meet them?
It can sometimes be beneficial to meet AI's early. If you think you can be on good terms with them, it lets you DoF then earlier. Also, you can scout out their capital territory early. Sometimes, once their city starts to expand via culture you may not be able to see all their tiles any more (without paying for an embassy). Also, meeting more AI's can decrease the beaker cost for the techs they have.
However, if some AI's are going to be hostile, then it makes sense to sometimes avoid them for as long as you can. Also, if you are going to do things that might get you a diplomatic penalty (DoW, etc.) you might want to avoid other civs.
at what time in the video was that at? you can rewind to that point and then hit pause/play/pause/play/pause/play at those points that have something really interesting you want to get
Yes, generally it's a good idea, but I never considered the option not to meet them ASAP. tommy's video showed me that at the very start it's OK to meet them later and prioritize CSs and ruins
i tried that but the whole graphic of the new tech was nowhere to be seen. it displayed it in text but i dont know german and now it would be difficult to really go back and get the text without watching the whole thing over again. i forgot roughly when it was, turn-wise. im watchin the 2nd one now.
I didn't find it that hard to follow. you can actually learn some german watching it. e.g. "Please Wait", "End Turn" etc.
maybe tommy should be forced to play with a handicap and play in English?
all I know is that it's a good thing that tommy wasn't leading the Wehrmacht 70 years ago ... cuz we'd all be speaking German now!
Ribannah
Fighter Druid
As my game shows, it is not. But it is a huge and questionable headstart.
Knowing that you're going to do this in advance will change the way you play right from the start.
Yeah, I don't do that either, but it seems that tommy's style doesn't ever require being friendly with your immediate neighbours. so why not take advantage of their stupidity ASAP? It's not like Austria is going to be your friend long term here. So I can't really fault tommy for doing that. My complaint is with the game designers who let you get away with this over and over again with other civs. don't those civs talk to each other?
Arnold_T: i found the turn and ruin that gave the tech but i dont know which one because the tech graphic didnt pop. its at t12 about 5:45 with the scout.
Yeah, the video sampling misses some things eh? looks like it must have been Writing though (cuz at T14 when presented with new techs to research it's not there, and Drama and Poetry is there).
BTW there is a 'legal' way go get money from Austria in prince.
I was able to get her gold with DEMAND (98g) in the very beginning.
Also started scout - scout and my warrior was upgraded to spear.
So I demanded gold from CS and Austria.
Not something that works in deity
I was able to get her gold with DEMAND (98g) in the very beginning.
Also started scout - scout and my warrior was upgraded to spear.
So I demanded gold from CS and Austria.
Not something that works in deity
BTW there is a legal way go get money from Austria in prince.
I was able to get her gold with DEMAND (98g) in the very beginning.
Also started scout - scout and my warrior was upgraded to spear.
So I demanded gold from CS and Austria.
Not something that works in deity
Good point. Though i rarely ''think'' about it because my mp instincts are still floating in the air
, skipping turns without thinking more about AI's ballcourt.But it works.
Just watching him allying quite a bunch of cs before the turn 100 demonstrates how much powerful are cs allies early on. But you need a ton of gold and some luck with barb camps and quests too. On this map, with raging, all you need is to sit down near some and shoot arrows when they are close or in their territory. Another thing that i completely missed
You do not need luck, if a camp is near a CS it will give you the q to destroy it 100% (ok 95%).
You just need to wait an prepare to get it before others.
I always leave something at these possibilities, often CS archer kill the barb and you just need to get the 25 and 50 infulance by moving into the camp.
You just need to wait an prepare to get it before others.
I always leave something at these possibilities, often CS archer kill the barb and you just need to get the 25 and 50 infulance by moving into the camp.
Actually, this isn't against the GOTM rules. It's not against the HoF rules either. It's at T28 where he breaks the HoF rules - by accepting a peace deal from Austria before taking half of Austria's cities (or Austria's capital). The HoF rules are kinda weird I think, basically saying you're allowed to abuse the AI and steal their gold as long as you have a REAL war with them (and a successful war as well).
But the rules are the rules and I play by the HoF rules all the time (even in TSG games) just so I don't get mixed up which rules I'm supposed to be using (or not supposed to be using).
Personally, I think the best answer is to fix the game with a mod that eliminates trading for lump sum gold. or severly restricts it so that the AI is smarter about it. It's funny though there's another thread in the forum where people are arguing against using mods in the TSG/GOTM "because it changes the game from what the designers and developers gave us". I think it's pretty clear that there are a lot of areas where the game can be improved, and the sooner we can start to put features into a civ5 TSG/GOTM mod the better.
