TSG70 Opening Actions thread

[leif erikson]

Welcome to the TSG70 Opening Actions thread. This thread is used to discuss the game once you've started playing through your first 100 turns. There are no posting restrictions as such (apart from normal decency), although we encourage players to use the spoiler tags for screenshots. Here you can post questions related to the game and share your achievements/anger/frustration/victories while you play. Please remember that we are running a family friendly site, so express anger or frustration with this in mind.

STOP - Please do not continue reading this thread until you have completed at least 80 to 100 turns in your game.

Please use this thread to discuss your goals for the game and your opening moves through the first 100 turns. Anything after that should be posted in the After Action thread once you have completed your game.

- Do you think about a Deity game differently, how does it affect the beginning of you game?
- What did you consider in your decision of where to settle your capital?
- What were your initial priorities?
- What tech path did you follow and why?
- Were there any early wars and who started them?
- How did you use your UU?
- Was your UB helpful?
- How did you handle the Deity AI advantages?

 

[VengerBR]

Oh boy... Deity means I have slim no chance of winning, but still, I'll try to learn from this and see what you guys are doing.

At least Poland is a kick-ass civ. I'll move the Warrior southwest and most likely settle in the hill/river east of the wheat, unless Warrior finds something great.

 

[tommynt]

turn 117:
6 civs declared friendship
1 civ declared war - and got only cap left

now i m clueless what to do with my army ... any advice?

maya got oracle in turn 48 in my game - deity maya is just broken ..

all civs tech so fast that i think i have to kill quite some of them to have a decent chance of getting this CV

 

[Monthar]

Since this is a cultural game, I'd suggest using your army to take out whomever is producing the most culture. Then the civs with the wonders that have the most great works slots.

 

[VengerBR]

Is it 100% impossible to get GL in this game?

I got good culture ruins and Tradition - Wonder Building policies. Rushed Pottery-Writing and built GL the turn it was opened, and still... By turn 30, someone else already completes it. I even managed to snatch a worker from Pacal in the process... seriously, I'm starting to fear these Diety AI civ's.

 

[Monthar]

Well the AI does start with pottery, so they can either get writing from a ruin or research it before we even finish pottery. That means they have a significant head start on the GL. Couple that with their production bonuses, it pretty much is impossible to get it on deity. In fact most wonders will be impossible.

 

[FeiLing]

Since Deity isn't really my level I tried quite some weird stuff too. First I didn't settle before turn 3, found the marble and quite some stones and settled there. Avoided settling on the cattle hill - was a mistake since horse spawned beneath me. Then I went Liberty... not sure exactly why. As usual barb delayed settling anyway; settled one next to Sinai right in the face of Assyria. He kept calm so far (got 2 caravans to him giving me +10 beakers) even though he has built Statue of Zeus and maxed out Honor. The other city went down at the other Wine area for which I've taken the Pantheon too. Only Wonder I got was Pyramids (aye, I remember now why I wanted Liberty: GE Petra... was gone 10ish turns before I had the tech) - I'll probably instead pop a GS and bulb him for Machinery.

Turn 110. I got 3 poor cities now and a halfway decent capital. 4 Comp Bows and 1 Spearman.
Indonesia entered Renaissance just now. I'll enter Medieval in 2 turns (lol). Spain conquered Hanoi and my cultured ally Kyzyl (that sucks -.-). Got Consulates and are allied with Riga at least (190 Influence). Spain got denounced by most other civs, I'm friends with the whole Eastern world... too bad I will need to kill all of them eventually to have a chance to win (they have a lot of Wonders and will be going for a culture win too.
The Western world seems to be fighting each other. Gaja just has gone for Byzantine, Spain is hated by everyone and Assyria just settled in between all of them. They'll surely not appreciate that.

So... I doubt I can win... most likely I'm even gonna get crushed early or beaten hard by a Science Victory. However there is a tiny little bit of a chance left, as Spain started spreading her religion to me which has Cathedrals and Monasteries. So if I can buy those and then later get converted to the Mayan religion which has Mosques and Sacred Sites... yeah. And if that happens I only have to defend against the West/Spain while I must kill the East (Maya and Brazil at the very least), then I might have a chance to win. I don't really see it happening though

Building Amphitheaters now and plan to "legalize" Opera Houses later. Spain might declare on me though any turn now too...

edit) and then it happened... looking grim...

Spoiler :

 

[Maxym]

I am a ruler of a most pathetic of Polish Kingdoms.

Size 7 cap and two size 1 expos. No NC, no philosophy yet either, 15bpt and lost Krakow to Assyria twice so far. I got 6 comp bows and a warrior, so not really a terrifying army but I might take over Assyria with it and see what happens next. I think I will need to keep fighting to have a chance.

I got the last religion but beliefs I wanted went to Maya. They are my friends after I stole early worker from them, India and Spain also DoFed.

 

[tommynt]

Î guess dowing a civ with friendship agreement will ruin all my good reputation?!

So wait till 1 wears of denounce and attack?

 

[Lord Yanaek]

- Do you think about a Deity game differently, how does it affect the beginning of you game?

Sure. On Deity, i don't often consider any early wonder (well, Oracle is the exception) and will forget Religion more often then i do on any other difficulty. I also know that early trade routes to AIs can bring me lots of and AIs often have excess workers willing to work for an emerging nation Unfortunately, on this map i couldn't get any early trade route with AIs, they were too far away so i'll have to wait until later to catch back

- What did you consider in your decision of where to settle your capital?

As i said in the announcment thread, start position is neither bad nor great. I was mostly considering settling on spot or moving to the hill esat of wheat for production, with a slight hesitation for setlling on the dyes. Warrior moved to the south hill on T0 and revealed snow down there, but also a 2nd wheat and 1 deer for ring 3 should i setlle on spot. That's what i did. You don't need setlling on hill as badly when you have wheat/plain as you already have the 5 needed for 2 scouts in first 10 turn and i really did'nt like snow.

- What were your initial priorities?

Exploring with my 2 scouts, defending against barbs, setlling 2 more cities, getting some buildings. Lots of stuff to do and so few ressources
I wasn't planning to get a religion, really, but after my 1st scout met Kat, i changed my mind. Built shrine after 2nd scout and got 1st pantheon (goddes of festivals), but only 4th religion (with spain, india, maya, byzance and indonesia on the map, it was quite an accomplishment). Took religious art and Pagodas on upgrade (monasteries had been taken already by a Indonesia, he has no whine, don't think he has incense) but strangely Pagodas were left out. At least they will stay even if i can't defend against AI pressure.
Didn't built any worker, my scout captured 2 in a single turn from Assyria on T21. Shame on him for not even having a warrior near his expo. One got captured by barbs while escorting both to my lands, but camp was near me so i took him back later. Got a 3rd one from a barb camp and bought 4th after founding (Initiation Rites)

- What tech path did you follow and why?

Mostly Pottery (for granny more than shrine at first) - Animal Husbandry (wanted to see horses and be able to build a caravan) - Archery (bought an archer as barbs were annoying in my game) - Mining (can't really do without) - Philosophy (NC, Oracle and Classical era) - Theology (Medieval era) - Civil Service c5food and Education (will come later of course, but that's the plan)

- Were there any early wars and who started them?

Apart from my requisition of 2 assyrian workers (got white peace about 10 turns later even thought it was a late DoW and he is on Honor) Gaja attacked Theodora, made peace, made friend, backstabbed her, got everyone mad at him
Oh, yeah, and Isabella went nuts, DoWing me out of the green

I've never seen any of her units. When i tried to make peace, she refused even discussing it but some turns later she came asking for peace in exchange for Lodz. I countered with a White peace and she accepted Maybe AIs can bribe each other to go to war after all.

- How did you use your UU?

This is a copy-paste from some generic template isn't it? Winged Hussars before T100, would love to have them by now

- Was your UB helpful?

Who doesn't like more production that not only doesn't cost gold, but gives you more. Lodz is now my best producer thanks to 4 pastures.

- How did you handle the Deity AI advantages?

Can you really handle it. You just have to live with it, and not try to get wonders that you'll fail in the end.
Speaking of Wonders, i really wasn't confortable with Oracle knowing Pacal was there. Built it before NC, but i did manage to complete it by T80 or so.

Got a nice timing on Philosophy right with a regular SP for instant Consulates BTW

Spoiler :

Final note, Pedro is Renaissance T103 (this is 300 BC ), i think i've never seen Korea or Babylon get into Renaissance so fast. Of course, he has 2 biggest cities in the world. Well, Spy going to his 1st expo to get some easy techs without risking being killed

 

[Novalia]

Î guess dowing a civ with friendship agreement will ruin all my good reputation?!

So wait till 1 wears of denounce and attack?

do a bunch of stuff to get one of them to denounce YOU.. spread your religion to them.. demand gold.. bully their CS.. tell them not to settle near you... settle a city in their face.

surprised you havent won by now

 

[budweiser]

A mis-click lost me my first worker. Some time later, the Maya ended my misery.

 

[tommynt]

t140 or so and my war is doing well

my eco and science is well - lets say "decent".
Without tithe (taken in like turn 30 or so lol) and a useless 15%grow when in peace) my religion even when at least stable in my land is kinda useless

And these power ais u did choose for this game tech like mad - most wonders are taken before i even come to tech - and i m not s sucky techer ...

lets talk about tech - city spots available here are - well - not great ...
there is this one observatory spot with some horses - but apart that ...

at least my empire is huge - so I think i ll be good in science in like - modern era?
ah yeah one of taken cities got writers guild in in - without river - so no garden and less op writer fairy spam

really wonder how others will do with this pretty hard map

 

[WxDan]

Fairly uneventful so far. After taking a peak with my warrior and settler, I decided to settle on the Dyes. Built 2nd and 3rd cities to the north and west next to mountains. I stole one worker and grabbed another one out of a barb camp. Just finished National College and education is about 15 turns away, so I'm a shade behind on tech.

I found archery in my first ruin and built a few archers early, thinking I had to worry about Assyria. He's headed the other direction towards Theodora at the moment. The Mayans aren't causing problems yet, so better than I expected. Long term I'll still be surprised if I can survive.

 

[drifter238]

I've having a surprisingly peaceful start as well. Built 4 cities quick (mostly around Wine which got the pantheon bonus) - teching at a decent clip (GE went to build NC in cap around T80 - bought university in cap around T120).

Playing a Liberty Domination plan - slowing building/upgrading units versus wonder/guild chasing (no DoWs yet, so units are a bit green). Once Dynamite hits, the wars begin. Lots of good targets to the east - but nothing is going to be easy - already very out-tech'ed and city defenses are high. Things will definitely hit the fan if it turns into a multi-front war.

First Deity try in awhile though, so it's at least fun to still be kinda competitive.

 

[Moriarte]

Interesting map. One might say this is perfect for peaceful CV. I like it when the cities are close and when two of them will get observatories in future.

On a map with no Brazil, India, Maya and Assyria (tourism maniacs, usually) i might have followed that peaceful path for once. But not this time. This time it looks like i will let them grow and get some culture/tourism for me and then i will swiftly take 4-5-6 cities with arties. (Assyria and Maya). Might go even further, but it's too early to tell.

For now i hammered 2 settlers, rush bought another one, all that was done in early 50'ies. Got 2 wokers from Maya, but it took about 20 turns to get them home, since barbs were controlling the isthmus to the east and my spear was about to die.

Few early friendships with CS were handy (barb camps) to get a religion and boost my culture by a little bit. Got a religion in 70'ies, and thought for 10 minutes, whether to take religious art or not. Went for +15% food instead. (and tithe) All the good stuff was taken, of course.

Anyway, the plan is to find the right balance between military and culture, which is always tricky. To be fair, though, everyone is so close to me, shouldn't be too much trouble to pacify some of them.

Pre-built Oracle to 9 turns from completion, but switched to NC now. Don't want to fall behind too much. It seems no one else is building it, from what i see. Might actually get it later, who knows. Pacal is hammering Chichen here, while Theodora is on a highway to hell, jammed between Indonesia, Spain and Assyria. Eastern part of the world is patting each other on their backs and signing DoF's though. No trouble will be coming from them, that's for sure.

It's a long road ahead. My only concern is Ashurbanipal, who seems overly peaceful for my liking..

EDIT: Full tradition and getting consulates in about 15 turns, then i'll be mixing Aesthetics and rationalism, i suppose.

Spoiler :

 

[golem]

Turn 121 - finally Education, but I am lucky to be alive.

Made three cities fast and let them growth, the third near Assyria for religion. I had income about 40G in turn 70, all went pretty good - and then Assyria DOW me. Six CBs, three Swordsman - I lost most my units, but I pesuade Isabela to DOW Assyria for all my luxuries. Not sure how much it help, but they did not come with new units and I survived. When I see I hae nothing I DOW Isabela to take it back. MY reputation is lost, but desperate people do desperate things. Next I made peace with them, but turn 120 Assyria DOW me again.

Religion - no chance to get it, just Panthenon (God of wine). Went tradition, Now allied with four city states - but in fact I do not know how to go on.

 

[golem]

turn 117:
6 civs declared friendship

How do you do that? I never manage more than three. Maybe I am missing something important.

 

[tommynt]

just "luck" i think - also meeting civs fast is important

my scout going east stumbled into scouts from other civs very soon

 

[Muaziz]

Game still in progress (woohoo! I am still alive!).

Social Policies: went full Liberty (which is unusual for me, but really wanted the Settler), then 2 in Patronage (to be Friends with all the City-States), then full Rationalism.

Befriended all the Civs except Indonesia and Assyria. Currently in a VERY long war with Assyria (as is Gandhi), but they have Gatling Guns, Cannons and Rifles so it is very slow going. I finally researched Dynamite for Artillery and to obsolete his annoying Great Wall which prevented me from attacking him 100 turns earlier.

The only Wonder I built (so far) was Pyramids. I needed some extra workers, and at lest 3 City-States wanted me to build it. The only way I have any chance for any Wonder from here on out is with a GE. Maybe if it gets to it, I will GE bulb the Hubble Telescope.

T120 Edu. T132 Astro. T175 Radio (Oxford tech for Ideologies). T202 Plastics (with free tech from Rati finisher). My NC was very late since I expanded twice before building it (had to hard build the Libraries too) and obviously didn't get GL which fell on t34!!

Not sure if I have any chance of winning with any VC, but I am only slightly behind tech-wise (thanks to trades routes early and then a lot of Research Agreements).

PS: Mostly ignoring VC for now, although I do have 3 Great Works and 2 Policies in Aesthetics. I doubt I will be able to finish it though since getting the Freedom Ideology bonuses is likely to be more important.