Turn Discussion Thread

[HUSch]

1. I would disagree. Military is everything. We want to have a force to attack Mavericks (either the island or on the other spire) as soon as we get the necessary techs. Example: We should build a stack of 20 or more City Raider-promoted siege units that we can upgrade to cannons as soon as Steel is available. Also we should be building CR-promoted maces to upgrade to rifles that can't get the CR promotion. We will need EI for transport as well. After the courthouse, Arcturus (or another city) should do nothing but build units. We need at least one city committed to building military at all times. (We might consider switching to Vassalage/Theocracy as soon as is feasible)

We can't win a combat with the units we can build, so building of units is stupid.
Next time if we want to go to war, we 'll (have to) change the civics to natio (you want vassal) and theo and then build better weapon. For this (Civic change) we should build now all needed buildings in our towns now. Every unit we build now cost 1 /turn and the additional upp-cost and give nothing. For 2-3 towns with military prod to change the civics is wrong. Best for change is the last turn of the (or a) GA.

4. We can fix our diplomacy. If we want to build a library and university in Rigel, let's tell Amazon, so they can build a culture building to offset our new culture.

We 've crea and reli + (I want) lib, uni, monastery in Rigel.
btw
Irgy said long ago, we 've promised reli for them, we should do this

 

[AlphaShard]

That may have been before they got there own religion. However that may help with the Culture issue for them.

We should send a message to Amazon telling them how we want to build them so we can get this going. Should we gift the missionary or just send them in?

 

[Trystero]

We can't win a combat with the units we can build, so building of units is stupid.
Next time if we want to go to war, we 'll (have to) change the civics to natio (you want vassal) and theo and then build better weapon. For this (Civic change) we should build now all needed buildings in our towns now. Every unit we build now cost 1 /turn and the additional upp-cost and give nothing. For 2-3 towns with military prod to change the civics is wrong. Best for change is the last turn of the (or a) GA.

Building units is NOT stupid. Our economy is strong and is getting stronger (with markets, new cities, etc.). We can easily save up money to upgrade older units. Rifles cannot get CR promotions. Having CR-promoted maces we can upgrade is highly advantageous. Units built now do not "give nothing". They are units we don't have to build when we get to Steel or Rifling. At 100% research we can tech Gunpowder in 4 turns and Chemistry in 6 turns. We don't want to be building units when we get Steel while Quatronia is conquering Mavericks cities with cannons.

And unit maintenance is not a big expense for us:

Spoiler :

This game is going to be won by military. We should build units.

Edit: And to be clear, I am not suggesting that ALL cities switch over to building units. I am simply arguing that we should continue with building units while we develop our cities (thus my earlier argument that at least one city be dedicated to this at all times)

I haven't heard any response about what other teams are teching. I suggest we simply tell the ETTA that we are going to research Gunpowder > Chemistry > Steel, and that they tech towards Rifling (PP > RP). I can already see by espionage that Quat is teching Printing Press.

And I think offering Amazon a missionary to offset the culture from a library in Rigel is an excellent idea.

 

[AlphaShard]

It's never a bad idea to build units. City Maintenance was the highest at 63 and then Civic upkeep. Another reason perhaps for Sprial Minuret or even a Prophet for Shrine. I think Arcturus and Vega would be good cities to build some Mace from.

I'll tell you this though I am certain that CDZ will have plenty of Berserker's waiting to be Amphibious Riflemen.

Sol is our main Commerce site and should build monastaries/university/observatory/marketplaces.

 

[Trystero]

I'd forgotten we don't have a shrine yet. The Spiral Minaret (extra commerce) or Angkor Wat (run priests for fastest GP) would be good: Double production speed with stone, and don't expire until Computers.

 

[BLubmuz]

I'm still around, lurking the thread.

Please don't be attracted by "shiny bright things" like WWonders. They can be useful, but the SM, like Sankore, needs lots of religious buildings to be useful, BTW. I think we have 2 or 3 ATM.

A Shrine will help a lot, but we need a GPro for it.

I see our REX will be soon completed.
Please remember we need about 1.2 workers per city, mainly with all that jungle to clear.

A good "shiny bright thing" can be the HS. We have marble.

Do we have decided where to build the NE?

 

[Trystero]

I'm not too attracted by shiny things at the moment. I've argued there are better uses for our hammers. Mostly just thinking of ways to get a Great Prophet faster. Running a priest (from a temple) in the NE city might be the best solution. I'm not sure where we'd build NE. I presume Sirius might be a good choice. We really don't have a GP farm at the moment. Especially since we aren't running many (or any?) specialists.

 

[Trystero]

BTW BLubmuz: Congrats on the laurels in SGOTM12! We didn't do as well, but I learned a lot and had fun.

Edit: The problem with HS is that it obsoletes with Steam Power. That is probably the tech we will want to pursue after Steel/Rifling, so we can build dikes.

 

[AlphaShard]

I'm not too attracted by shiny things at the moment. I've argued there are better uses for our hammers. Mostly just thinking of ways to get a Great Prophet faster. Running a priest (from a temple) in the NE city might be the best solution. I'm not sure where we'd build NE. I presume Sirius might be a good choice. We really don't have a GP farm at the moment. Especially since we aren't running many (or any?) specialists.

I'd like to second that motion as well I'm not wanting it for just the sake of it. I rather go for a wonder that will give us money then building a Wonder that will be obsolete with a tech that gives us our Unique Building. I think we would get more use out of SM or UoS then HS. I don't bother with HS even in solo games, just build more workers.

 

[HUSch]

From Spiral we got nothing like Sankore, we need for gain religious buildings.
You can count our temples, I think we 've none and there was/is no reason to build them.
Monasteries: 1 or 2; how long til science
Cathedrals no chance to build now.

Hagia is expensive and gain only if you build it the first moment and real good (Imo), if you play marathon in SP.

Because of our splitting land Liberty and 3GW is also not my favorite.

Mausi would be good, if we build also Taj, we get 2 GAs at most from Specialists I think. Til Eiffel or ... I see no good wonder for us.

Specialist can be our problem (longtime), so the reason for building wonder may be getting the GPs.

 

[BLubmuz]

Too late to build wonders to seek GPeople.
The cost of building a WW to have a GPro for a Shrine will hardly be compensated at this stage of the game. If we can hire a priest where we have (or we build) a Temple and then the NE we can have more chances.

Agreed about HS, too late. Also Liberty (unless in the spokes) or 3GD are not worth. But i hope to finish before the 3GD comes in play.

 

[Trystero]

Agreed - I think it's better to run a priest for the Great Prophet (shrine). I also agree that few wonders will be worth the hammer expense.

BLub: take a look at the game when you get a chance and see where you think NE should go. I think Arcturus should get Ironworks when we get to that point.

 

[AlphaShard]

I did play a bit of this turn, I whipped the Observatory out in Rigel. I put a Missionary in at Arcturus, and an University for Sirius. I moved two of the workers on Bode to hills for mining, finished the Plantation at Altair and began a new road for that city and one for the future Capella. Still have a free worker on Anjen and Sol.

I noticed a sign for watermill by Rigel, now is this for the commerce and hammer bonus? I rather a workshop or cottage there.

 

[Trystero]

I'll take a closer look at our cities this turn to see if I have any suggestions. My only recommendation at the moment (see the Amazon diplomacy thread) is that we switch research to Gunpowder.

 

[AlphaShard]

I think Gunpowder is a good idea as well. We should see if we can get the other teams to research Steam power and Guilds.

 

[HUSch]

Gunpowder is best, but before we go at this, ask the other, perhaps Ama or CDZ research it.
For us is also the way to steam important, so PP is a good shot.

Alpha
you are right watermill is neither fish nor beef. The sign is a proposal, what I thought will be good. Change it, if you see better improvement.

Actually look at the change of working in Beta Cent, like my plan with 12 work at both mines.

 

[Trystero]

According our espionage, Quatronia is already teching Printing Press. Hopefully we can get the other teams to commit to actually putting commerce into research.

 

[AlphaShard]

Hey I got an idea let's steal Guilds from Mav's, they got it from Mer.

To steal tech we need at least 1,900+ points. We could binary Espionage for about 3 to 4 turns to do that but then we could just tech Guilds in 3 turns also with binary.

 

[Trystero]

Aren't Amazon researching Guilds? Are we that desperate for Guilds that we need to spend commerce to steal it?

 

[AlphaShard]

Aren't Amazon researching Guilds? Are we that desperate for Guilds that we need to spend commerce to steal it?

I don't know what Amazon is researching and no were not desperate enough for it. I just thought it would be a quick and easy and it's neither. Our Spy was captured so we'd have to make a new one and we'd have to devote a lot of commerce to it.