Turn Discussion

[donsig]

I'm not clear on why the game is paused. Is SANCTA trying to:

1. find a turn player
2. decide if they want to continue playing
3. work on strategy and tactics
4. figure out how to continue their streak of good luck

I can understand a pause for reason #1 but not for the others. Anyone on SANCTA care to enlighten us?

 

[Ronnie1]

We are discussing points 1 and 2....

strategy is set if we continue, luck is luck....

The air in the sancta lounge is kinda thick and smelly, not really sure if there is enough population left to make continuation viable unfortunately.

 

[Unconquered Sun]

...not really sure if there is enough population left to make continuation viable unfortunately.

Same goes for team Cav.

 

[donsig]

Oh, so are we now saying it's ok to give up playing when the game doesn't go your way?

 

[Dreylin]

Oh, so are we now saying it's ok to give up playing when the game doesn't go your way?

Well this is the second demogame I've ben involved with, and the first definitely ended that way - see PAL in recent Apolyton BTS Demogame - however that is not what has happened here. Infact, it's the things that have been unexpectedly going SANCTA's way that has lead some to accuse the team or the turnplayer of cheating.

The mods investigated and ruled based on the possibility of cheating, but the lack of evidence of such. It became clear afterwards, however, that that would not be enough for some other players who have already decided that someone is guilty. That atmosphere makes it unpleasant to play on, since whatever SANCTA does from here, there will be some who will continue to believe that the team got where it is by underhanded means.

All in all, from my point of view at least, a lot of the possibility for enjoying this game has been taken away and that is what SANCTA are discussing at the moment.

 

[Indiansmoke]

Well in sports when someone gets lucky he apologizes to the opponent, he does not brag about it or take the piss out of it.

That is what created feelings here, you got lucky and then went on to post nice irritating stories.

So don't act like it is only everybody else's fault.

 

[dutchfire]

Oh, so are we now saying it's ok to give up playing when the game doesn't go your way?

I believe we're saying it's ok to accuse others of cheating when the game doesn't go your way

 

[Dreylin]

Well in sports when someone gets lucky he apologizes to the opponent, he does not brag about it or take the piss out of it.

That is what created feelings here, you got lucky and then went on to post nice irritating stories.

So don't act like it is only everybody else's fault.

Ah, but this isn't sports it's the Internet; here everyone boasts about how good they are and how bad and thoroughly n00bish their opponents are ... although usually not elloquently, I'll admit.

 

[Ronnie1]

I was also under the assumption that a little role playing "FUN" was part of the MTDG experience. This is/was my first experience with MTDG, and most likely my last given the way this has gone down.

 

[DMOC]

Yeah, interest is down in Saturn's forum too. We have had 5 posts in the last month. Total. (From Nov 4th to today.)

 

[damnrunner]

Sancta has won a lot of battles at ridiculously good odds and from the perspective of other teams their attacks looked fairly suicidal and only appear to make sense if the "knew" they were going to win at low odds. As Inidansmoke mentioned, all the chatter about sacrificing virgins and the gods of RNG only furthered this perception.

I think it is understandable that people asked the moderators to look into it. The moderators found no evidence of wrongdoing and offered some new rules to reduce chance of possible future cheating.

While there have been further discussions in the forums about cheating, I don't think it was overly accusative. It was mostly focused on asking the moderators for clarification on what they found and how the new rules would work. Part of this was the theoretical question of, is cheating possible to which the answer was yes.

I hope we can go forward with the game and from Sancta's perspective I don't see why they would not want to. They won a huge battle with minimal losses. They were accused of cheating, but were found to be in the clear. To me it sounds like they should be sitting pretty.

Yes there will probably be new accusations if they win another set of battles with very low odds - but with the new anti cheating rules it should be a lot easier to confirm or deny any accusations.

 

[HUSch]

What is, when another team wins more battles with low chances; there will be allways accusations, you must see the reality of it. The cheat-accusation is part of the game, but only sametimes publicely.

To Sancta
There is the situation of their turnplayer Memphus, who is accused and has lost his interest in the game, I think.

 

[mwin]

This was the problem. Where does it stop? You never accused Santca in open forum. You went through Sulla to do it. Actually, krill suggested to move the discussion to open forum. For some reason Admins/Sulla never took that suggestion seriously. Why start a discussion in open forum after the verdict? You could have easily asked these questions in your own forum. If not you should have started it before verdict. Most of the questions you raised were discussed in Sancta’s forum before verdict….

While there have been further discussions in the forums about cheating, I don't think it was overly accusative. It was mostly focused on asking the moderators for clarification on what they found and how the new rules would work. Part of this was the theoretical question of, is cheating possible to which the answer was yes.

 

[cav scout]

I would like it if we could move forward. SANCTAs position in the game (as well as the game as a whole) is still very viable. There are some players who have invested alot of time and energy into this MTDG and it would be a shame to end it on a bad note.

 

[damnrunner]

This was the problem. Where does it stop? You never accused Santca in open forum. You went through Sulla to do it. Actually, krill suggested to move the discussion to open forum. For some reason Admins/Sulla never took that suggestion seriously. Why start a discussion in open forum after the verdict? You could have easily asked these questions in your own forum. If not you should have started it before verdict. Most of the questions you raised were discussed in Sancta’s forum before verdict….

Team Kaz has not been discussing the most recent allegations in our team forum. We were waiting to hear what the Admins determined. We then had some team members who wanted clarification about the new rules and whether cheating was theoretically even possible. Bringing up these questions in our forums prior to the Admins' determinations would not have served much of a purpose or even have really be feasible as we would not have known the Admins' proposed new rules.

I just don't see how an open discussion about cheating makes the game so unpleasant that Sancta would consider dropping out.

Anyhow is anyone actually still accusing Sancta of cheating? To my knowledge no one on Team Kaz is and we are happy with the new rules. Of course if Sancta continues to win battles at ridiculous odds we may want to revisit the issue. But if you are not cheating this likely won't happen as "luck is luck" as Ronnie1 put it

Now I know I just said we may want to revisit the issue and this will likely be interpreted as "see - they are out to get us." The fact is we are not. We are about playing a fair game where good play results in good results (and Sancta has played a very good game). But lets say their was a bug in the game which gave one team better combat odds for some random reason. This team would not be cheating, but I think all parties would want that bug fixed in the name of fairness. For the same reason, whenever one team consistently has good luck it does raise some legitiamte questions.

The good news is as the game goes on - the luck in the game will start to balance out. So far there has really not been much combat in the game thus far all of the luck has gone Sancta's way.

 

[azzaman333]

I doubt the game will be going on much longer for SANCTA, due to very little interest in continuing for various reasons (the major one being that constantly being accused of cheating does not make for an enjoyable game)

 

[DMOC]

I hope that a second demogame can start soon.

 

[plako]

SANCTA has indicated that they don't want to continue. I request game to be paused until this issue has been resolved one way or the other.

What is the atmosphere in the teams? Is there strong will to continue or is it just the sense of duty driving this game forward? The end result seems quite clear. I can play this game to the end, but I'm also alright declaring Cavs as the winner and move on.

 

[HUSch]

What's that?
I don't/can't understand the people, who play here.

 

[DaveMcW]

SANCTA has indicated that they don't want to continue. I request game to be paused until this issue has been resolved one way or the other.

lurker's comment: SANCTA can retire or let their 24-hour clock tick down every day if they don't want to play. Pausing to delay the game is poor sportsmanship.