Unit Preview and Poll: Byzantine Cataphract

[Ozymandias]

... You know, due to the different helms, the three units DO look different enough that I would recast my "vote" (the leftmost, if only one) FOR ALL THREE, as cavalry alternatives of this sort are always welcome.

There were evidently more than one "type" of cataphract during the long years of Byzantine glory; certainly I'd use one for "regular" and another for "elite". And I'd use the third as an equivalent-era unit for some Civ that never made it that far historically.

-- See, Utahjazz, it's true: "No good deed goes unpunished."

Seriously, they're all great; I'd use personally use them all; is it a pain to make all three? (2 notes: (i) I remain the self-proclaimed "graphics ignoramus" so I truly don't know if it's a pain or not; and (ii) I don't recall ever urging anyone to do an "all options" set of anything )

Best,

Oz

 

[mrtn]

Originally posted by ozymandias
... I don't recall ever urging anyone to do an "all options" set of anything ...

I do.
I (among others) got Kindred to make two versions of the Arthurian Knights (with and without helmet), so there are precedents.

 

[utahjazz7]

And the winner is . . .

I will animate the first version of the Cataphract--the one on the left. It has received a majority of the votes. The animating will take a good bit of time to complete, as the render times are pretty long, and I'm pretty busy these days. Well, I'll post updates as they come along.

 

[aaglo]

Beautiful!

 

[Steph]

Originally posted by mrtn
I do.
I (among others) got Kindred to make two versions of the Arthurian Knights (with and without helmet), so there are precedents.

Or Bebro's Rafale Air and Rafale Marine or Tiger HAC and Tiger UHT, or Balou's Parachutiste and peace keaper

 

[StabbingNirvana]

um ... my account is "invalid" or something and therefore, i cant vote. id say the right one is the best but also the left one is good. either one is fine by me

 

[utahjazz7]

Well, I have put together a good palette for this unit, and I completed the default animation . . . further updates when there's news.

 

[Raw is War?]

Looking good

 

[SuperBeaverInc.]

Nice Utah . When do you think you will have this done?

 

[utahjazz7]

Here's what I have done so far: default, fortify, and attack.

 

[Yoda Power]

I think uploading is down

edit-its working now

Utah the unit is great, but the attack is very odd IMHO. He should be stabbing, not hitting with the spear.

 

[aaglo]

Very nice, UJ7. It's nice to have a different aproach with a spear-wielding unit

The cataphract attack is a tricky one, since the weapon they use is a 2-hand spear, right? And while mounted, you really can't stab with a 2-hand spear while mounted.

In this light this attack is the only possible performable attack IMO.

And besides, spears aren't used only as a stabbing weapon - they are excellent as clubs too (relatively heavy head with long reach). In asia they sometimes use spears like swords.

I really don't know how else to make an attack with this unit.

 

[Ozymandias]

Originally posted by aaglo
The cataphract attack is a tricky one, since the weapon they use is a 2-hand spear, right? And while mounted, you really can't stab with a 2-hand spear while mounted.

Not without stirrups anyway, which these units didn't possess.

BTW IIRC wouldn't these guys have disrupted their opponents first with arrows then closed to conclusively conclude matters? -- If you're chasing a guy on foot, whacking him with a good staff in the back of the head in the heat of battle is probably as effective as running him through, and doesn't risk getting your lance stuck in a corpse.

Morbidly Yours ,

Oz

 

[tjedge1]

I like the attack myself
I also like all of them, though I voted for the one on the right. I would use them all if they were made. More units for fantasy mods.

 

[Xen]

the attack is relativlly authentic- these spears were long, heavel bladed beasts in real life,and were used in all manners of way-the result is most like fencing on horseback, with a spear, combinations of both cuts, and thrusts all over the place...

 

[Ozymandias]

Originally posted by Xen
the attack is relativlly authentic- these spears were long, heavel bladed beasts in real life,and were used in all manners of way-the result is most like fencing on horseback, with a spear, combinations of both cuts, and thrusts all over the place...

Xen,

I'm genuinely delighted to come across well-informed specialists in any historical era and area -- if I may ask, how is it that you're so well informed on Byzantium?

Best,

Oz

 

[Xen]

Originally posted by ozymandias


Xen,

I'm genuinely delighted to come across well-informed specialists in any historical era and area -- if I may ask, how is it that you're so well informed on Byzantium?

Best,

Oz

lot-o-ways... here are sme good sources, but just the tip of the ice burg really...
- http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~dee/MA/BYZ.HTM

- http://www.ne.jp/asahi/luke/ueda-sarson/NotitiaPatterns.html

- http://byzantium.seashell.net.nz/articlemain.php?artid=mtp_military

and my favorite -

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...128913?v=glance&s=books&vi=reader#reader-link

 

[Louis XXIV]

Is it just me or does the Horse's armor look like Sheep's wool?

 

[Mithadan]

I think the attack would be a little more dynamic, maybe, if the horse was running while the dude was whacking away with his big ol' spear. But maybe that's entirely innacurate? Beats me...!

 

[Kryten]

Originally posted by Mithadan
I think the attack would be a little more dynamic, maybe, if the horse was running while the dude was whacking away with his big ol' spear. But maybe that's entirely innacurate? Beats me...!

Well, I once tried to make the Horse Archer a bit more 'dynamic' some time ago.
Unfortunately, although it looks great as a preview, people didn't like the idea of it 'running-on-the-spot' in the game.

So instead of this:

they prefered this:

(Philistines! )