VQ05 - The Conquistadors

[ChrTh]

There was an exploit in Civ3 for it; you could chain transports across the ocean so that troops could move from continent to continent in one turn, and since you still had movement points if unloaded in a city, you could actually start on a city on one continent, and attack on a different continent the same turn.

 

[seezachswim]

I got it and should play sometime tonight.

 

[ChrTh]

BTW, GreyFox, that was another great write-up. Scribeworthy, I would say

 

[GreyFox]

BTW, GreyFox, that was another great write-up. Scribeworthy, I would say

... I counted like that 10 spelling mistakes, 30 grammtical errors, and a gazillion typos. ...

Note to Seezachswim: I think we should try to take as many barbarians cities as possible, so keep pumping up cats and conqs. and ferry them over. Both the New World Islands. But careful about defense back home ... make sure there are ample defenders at least in the southern border cities.

Did our variant says we must control the entire New World? Might be hard though.

 

[seezachswim]

The Calm before the Storm- Zach stood on the hill that overlooked the newly conquered city of Vandal. From his vantage point he could see the countryside for miles. He could see the great riches that Vandal held and forsaw a time when Vandal would become an integral part of the great Spanish empire. As he gazed contentedly at the stunningly beatiful gems that the Spanish had taken from the nearby mines, he saw a blight on the horizon. "What is this he said to himself?" Suddenly a young boy came running up to him. "The barbarians, sir!" "Well, what about them?" asked Zach. "They've come to retake the city of Vandal!" "I was expecting that," said Zach. "Tell the troops to ready themselves for battle and show those scum what were made of." "But, sir, you don't understand, its not just another barbian party of simple warriors, that is easily slaughtered. The entire barbian army must be out there, huge columns of macemen, and longbows. There numbers are at least tens times as much as ours!" Zach stood back, with a stunned look on his face. This can't be he muttered, in all of my previous experiences the barbians were no more than a unorganized rabble that was easily crushed. Zach thought to himself. After a few moments he said, "come with me lad, there is much work to be done."

The siege of Vandal part one- Night had fallen. The Spaniards had no more than two regiments of conquistadors and one battlaion of catapults. As the men looked at the ever growing mass of barbians, there fear grew. They knew that they had little chance against the ever growing horde of monsters that stood outside the town. As they stood waiting for the horde, their leader, general of Spain, Zach the conquerer, turned to speak to them. "men," he said, "I know that the barbians are many and we are few. But, I tell you this, when the history books are written, it will be us that are remebered, not them. We claimed this land in the name of Spain, and vowed to fight until we had conquerered it all. For Spain!", he cried. "For Spain!", said the men. And Zach, seeing that the Barbians were unready for a frontal assult, said, "CHARGE!!". The men, suddenly brave again, whipped their steeds to a frenzy, charging at the barbian masses with reckless abandon. The barbians, cowards that they were, saw this and turned to flee. But it was to late, Zach and his thunderous army of conquistadors were upon them like water in a lake. The barbians died by the hundreds in front of the charging conquerers. For hundreds of yards, the Spaniards rode down the barbians like cattle, killing at will. Eventually though, their momentum started to halt. Zach, seeing this, ordered the retreat. Suddenly, disaster struck. The entire second regiment of cavalry did not hear the order. They continued on. And they, were met by a suddenly revitalized barbian army. Macemen surged up and struck down the calvalry, ending their charge. The longbows seeing their opporunity, fired at the melee, killing some of their own, while also killing the Spanish. Several minutes later all of the Spanish men of the second regiment were dead, unable to hold back the tide any longer. All Zach had left was one wounded Cavalry regiment and a few catapults.

Seige of Vandal part two- The sun had risen. The Spanish army saw the carnage of the previous nights battle. Thousands, tens of thousands of barbians lay slain, outside the city. The barbian army, had created a gigantic fire for the dead. Its flame rose up and seemed to touch the sun. Its putrid stench could be smelled for miles. In the city of Vandal the remainder of the Spanish army was waiting for the attack, knowing that they would soon be thrown into the fire along with their fallen comrades. Zach looked at his men, he knew that not one of them would survive the next assult. He ordered for the boy who had told him of the impending army intially. The boy came to him, looking tired. Zach said, "go back to Spain, and tell the people of our fate." "But how," said the boy? "Their is a small caravel waiting in the docks, go there and tell the crew to leave immediatly," said Zach. "But,..." replied the boy. "GO!," said Zach. The boy ran. He reached the ship and told the captian what the general said to him. The captain nodded. He informed his crew to ready the sails. Within a half hour they were on there way, leaving behind the city of Vandal. As they were leaving, they saw the final battle of Zach and his proud army. The barbians came at them with tens of thousands of men, like ants covering a scrap of food. They were killed by the thousands, as Zach and his noble men fough valiantly until the very end. As the boy watched, he saw Zach go down, surrounded by macemen on every side, and arrows sticking out of his side. The boy wept as they sailed away.

The return- When the boat returned to Spain, the boy told everyone of their ordeal. The people saw this and constructed a great heroic epic in the city of Seville, to remeber the battle of Vandal, and the great general Zach. The Spanish people saw this statue and were struck by the plight of Zach and his army. They vowed to return to the new world and vanquish the evil barbians that had beaten them.

 

[seezachswim]

turn 0: change a couple of builds. Vandal looks to be quite a nice city spot.

turn 1: moves troops next to barb city.

turn 2: dang, Vandal gets attacked by 4 barbs in the inturn, losing one conquistador.
The barbs still have a damaged maceman a fully healed maceman, and a longbow next to the city. I start the Heroic Epic in Seville.
I hope this is ok with everyone, we need a solid troop producer right now. I take the other barb city with no losses.

turn 3: Several big things happen this turn. Vandal is retaken by the barbs. They attacked with no less than 4 more units. I decide to go ahead and trade astronomy to mansa because he will get it in a few turns any way. I was excpeting to be able to then trade it for
replaceable parts as well, but julius, ceaser, and qin all got the "we fear you are becoming to advanced" crap. ARRGH!!. it appears that we will need a better city defender than a conqustador if we are to retake and hold Vandal.
I also adopt free markets as well.

Turn 4: I forgot to mention that we popped a great artist on turn 1 or 2 and I used him to create a great work in Cordoba.

Turn 5: Julius decides to trade with us again, and I trade him nationlism for rep parts, wasting about 2 turns of research.

Turn 6: Set research to Steel, the barb city that we didn't lose comes out of revolt and has a maitenence cost of -11 per turn.

Turn 7: It dosn't look like we'll be retaking Vandal for awhile. And how did it get culture anyway? I didn't think barb cities could build cultural buildings.

Turn 8: I'll leave it up to the next leader on wether or not to take anymore cities with that southern force. After the fiasco at Vandal I think it would be wise to be extremely cautious.

Turn 9: I land two galleons worth of units next to Vandal, on a hill. I'm going to try and absorb some of their units before continuing.

Turn 10: ceasear comes asking me to cancel my deals with mansa. Hmmm, of course I will ceasar, NOT.

Turn summary, The barbs are going to be a lot more tough than we thought. The next leader probably needs to build another galleon or two to help ferry more troops. Our gnp is improving as well, new cities in the new world will hurt though.

 

[GreyFox]

Nice write-up, zach!

Geez, i am sorry, I get the fun of taking Vanda, and you have to suffer the consequences. I think I underestimated the barbs in the New World, and did not bring in sufficient troops before attempting to take Vanda.

I think we have learn a lesson here ... ... we need to concentrate our forces before attempting another barb city taking.

 

[SpriteSODA]

Lurkers Comments:
Well to things -
I never trade Astronomy at terra cus its endangering my attempts to rule the new world.
And another thing - Mansa is a terrible ally, and will never help you.

 

[Maquis]

dang, Vandal gets attacked by 4 barbs in the inturn, losing one conquistador.

I was afraid of that... I should have stressed the point, the barbs will do whatever they can to recapture their cities. We'll need to make sure to bring some good defenders in the next wave of troops!

Let's hope the AI doesn't start ferrying their big stacks over now... we have to be very cautious!


Roster time:

Maquis -
GreyFox -
seezachswim - just played
bobrath - Up!
ChrTh - on deck

alt: eektor

 

[ChrTh]

Would we be better off razing a couple of the barb cities first instead of holding onto them? Then after the barbarian forces are reduced load up a couple settlers?

 

[SpriteSODA]

mmm my last SP game was terra, and I noticed that after i've conquered my first barb city, all the barbs of the surrounding exept 1-2 which remained at each city, came over and tried to retake the city. after they were delt with, the path was clear. Conquer a city, keep it, and then it will be peice of cake.
Bring big force to survive the wave.

 

[SpriteSODA]

bah double.

 

[bobrath]

First off, time once again for my gripe about GoTos.....
{rant mode on}
WHY ARE THERE ANY ISSUED? I understand that you want Galleons to be heading back for convoy duty, but handing off with with 5+ turn GoTos issues is poor form. Please, please, please don't do it again.
{rant mode off}

Turn 0
I once again extort gold from Cyrus, getting us 70g this time. He hates us.. but what's he going to do? (BTW wiping him out would be a nice thing, we've still got far too many unhappy faces for returning to the fatherland penalties).
I also noticed that Tianjin flipped at some point. Good for us, eases QSH's pain a bit.

Turn 1
Mansa ends his GA

Turn 2
Steel completes and I begin research on Military Tradition to let us get a Defensive pact with Mansa.

Turn 3


Turn 4
With Steel in, Ironworks is available to us. I'd suggest building it in Seville since it has the Heroic Epic, but I'm too busy cranking out Conquistadors.

Turn 5
JC ends his GA

Turn 6
JC gets another GA (thanks to completing the Taj Mahal). Power graph shows he's putting it mostly into military units. Need to be careful with him too now.

Turn 7
Military Tradition comes in and I go with Divine Right so that we can make a play for Versailles in the New World.

Turn 8
QSH has galleons now, but I don't notice his stack of scary going down.
Its a long freakin voyage across the sea. I decide to take the much less heavily defended Circassian instead. Bonus is that it has iron right next door so it will have good production as soon as it flips over to us.
Defenders are one mace and one longbow against our stack of 1 Conq, 1 Musket, 2 longbows, and 2 cats. We lose one cat and get 89 gold for taking the city.
I've posted a caravel between Circassian and Vandal to watch for reinforcements/counter attack. I also have a Frigate bombing the defense down slowly.

Turn 9
Mansa comes offering Rifling and 10 gold for Steel. I renogotiate to get him to include Divine Right and his World Map. We had one turn left on research of Divine Right, so not a huge savings there.
I also get him to sign a Defensive Pact with us. Of course the other civs give us a -1 because of this, but I'm feeling much safer now. We shouldn't ignore our home defense... but well I'm happy. BTW if we do go after Cyrus, we'll lose the DP, so be careful on that.

Decide to research Sci Method since the free Great Scientist is still available for Physics.
I spot two maces and a longbow en route to Circussian from Vandal:

We should be fine with this. I also killed a raiding Longbow in our southern new world.

Turn 10
Mansa will give us Constitution + world map + 10 gold for Military Tradition. Might be worth it just to speed up our research path a bit.

Thoughts on cities:
Pasagarde has the best chance for producing a Great Prophet. Be sure to monitor it to keep other specialists from being used. Only a 60% chance still tho.
Our captured barb cities have some nice town/villages built up. Be sure to protect them as they make a big difference in cost/profit on these far flung cities.

Pics from around the world (with one ugly suprise):

Yup, the Barbs picked up our culture in Vandal... oh and our good buddy Mansa went and settled an island just off the southern continent. Maybe we can convince him to sell us that city... Or since its not part of the actual continent does it count as part of the "new world"?

One galleon-load for our southern continent:

and two loads for the north:

The situation in Northern Barbs vs Our troops already landed:

And what's waiting at home for Galleons (two ships are in the process of building):

I also have a hindu missionary en route. Consider using our caravels for transport on the missionaries and to keep an eye on the barbs. I have one frigate outside two northern barb cities to just keep the cultural defense down.

At home, our southern border cities are still keeping the cultural pressure up to keep our resources and as a buffer to sneak attacks.

The Save:

 

[GreyFox]

Re: pan-turnset goto's, build orders:
I wouldn't say don't use them. I use them all the time. If we think abt it, what's so bad about them? People use them in their own SP games. So what makes them sinful in SG? Ans: They surprise the next player. So, conclusion is that as long as you remove the element of surprise, it doesn't matter. How? By mentionng them in turnset reports, or via in-game signs (some players get annoyed with in-game sign though).

On that matter, there should be a button to "Show all Incomplete Movement", and the city info bar should have an additional icon to indicate there are queued build orders in the city. Not only for SG. I sometimes lost track of my own build orders and movements in SP games as well.

--

Good turns, bob. Especially the Mansa DP.

Abt Mansa's new city, perhaps we will be forced to attack him ... or alternatively, a peaceful possibility might be to exchange one of our OW city with his NW city.

Good job taking the barb city. It is further west, so perhaps the barbs would take a longer time to rally, buying our reinforcement more time to get there.

--

 

[SpriteSODA]

mmm with the DP you wont be able to kill cyrus=\
oh and another thing - you do realise that you cant win till you conquer the new world - does that including the AI's cities over there?

 

[ChrTh]

Why can't we kill Cyrus with the DP? We'll just lose the DP in order to do so. No big whoop, I don't think we're going for a PA/Diplomacy victory here. Besides, chances are it'll disappear on its own anyway.

EDIT: I see it, but since I'm up in the SGOTM tonight I'm not going to be able to get to it until tomorrow night (roughly 36 hours from now). Maquis, let me know if you want to swap.

 

[bobrath]

We won't ever lose the DP until either someone attacks us (or Mansa) or one of us attacks another civ.

I'm not sure how easy/hard it is to get a DP back if you attack your way out of it. Other option to consider... get a Permanent Alliance with Mansa - but I'm not sure how that jives with our variant rules.

 

[ChrTh]

We won't ever lose the DP until either someone attacks us (or Mansa) or one of us attacks another civ.

Right. Chances are it'll disappear on its own anyway.

 

[GreyFox]

I think if a Civ starts to hate you, it can cancel the DP with you even though there are no wars being declared.

Is PA enabled?

So our options, to win at our variant rule, are:
(A) attack Mansa;
(B) enter PA with Mansa, if possible;
(C) trade one of our old world city with Mansa's new world city; or
(D) find a loophole in our variant (like the island is not connected to the new world ... ) ... lawyers, anyone?

--

 

[ChrTh]

I think we can cancel the DP whenever we feel like it (er, after the requisite 10 turns). It's really no different than Open Borders.

My guess is that PA is not enabled, but I don't know for sure.