This is actually a huge problem. They are separated from national or cultural identities, and the leaders themselves have no personalities. There's nothing to relate to; there is no "there" there. I don't know or care who any of the other leaders are.
We do not speak spanish and more
- Thread starter pacbarros
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This is actually a huge problem. They are separated from national or cultural identities, and the leaders themselves have no personalities. There's nothing to relate to; there is no "there" there. I don't know or care who any of the other leaders are.
m15a
Emperor
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IMO, the leaders not being tied to present day identities and being bland/unrelateable are different issues. Or rather, the first is not an issue while the second is*. There are plenty of works of fiction (including video games) that don't rely on the audience being of the same group as the characters. And having the factions mirror present day ones so closely would not be realistic or interesting IMHO.
* This actually doesn't bother me so much but I think that's because I read a lot of the text on the Civilization website. But I can understand why others are bothered.
The leaders don't need to be tied to present day identities.
But they need to have SOMETHING else to relate to in its place.
m15a
Emperor
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Yup. Totally agree, and that's a good way to put it. I think I have the same sort of issue with tech and virtue choices. It's hard to connect with the choices and there are even more choices to make than in Civ V (because the tech tree is so nonlinear). I feel like I'd be better able to wrap my head around the tech web in a historical setting (even though it'd makes less sense story wise).
Anyway, I'm going way off topic.
So, if it's the future, and people don't necessarily speak the same language as before, why hasn't English changed at all?
Why even bother with the language at all if you're just going to mess it up, and then cover up the errors with "it's the future!".
If every leader simply spoke English, this wouldn't be an issue.
Why even bother with the language at all if you're just going to mess it up, and then cover up the errors with "it's the future!".
If every leader simply spoke English, this wouldn't be an issue.
Louis XXIV
Le Roi Soleil
Most of the leaders do seem to speak at least a little English.
That being said, even the American leader isn't speaking exclusively English, which was also a design decision in the same boat.
That being said, even the American leader isn't speaking exclusively English, which was also a design decision in the same boat.
cooldude1128
Prince
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Linguistics student, here. These guys pretty much covered it. Well done!
I'm not a linguistics student, I'm barely into high school. I just thought it was obvious.
ZombieBunny
Chieftain
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Its interesting to see how much value people put into having their national identity represented in a fictional game about colonizing an alien planet.
I see what they went for with the design idea, that something bad happend on earth and theres been a lot of cultural mixing due to it. But I can see why some people might find it a bit disturbing, but the truth is that most nations fall soon or later. Things keep changing and we adopt, its whats made us all so successful as a species in the first place.
I see what they went for with the design idea, that something bad happend on earth and theres been a lot of cultural mixing due to it. But I can see why some people might find it a bit disturbing, but the truth is that most nations fall soon or later. Things keep changing and we adopt, its whats made us all so successful as a species in the first place.
Oddible
signal / noise > 1
There is no Brazil in the game. Brasileiros of course would be outraged by the thougt that future pan south American conglomerate wouldn't be speaking English with a Portuguese-Brazilian accent. Relax.
VengerBR
Chieftain
I'm also Brazilian.
While the names are silly, what I take from it is that the Brasilia civ isn't really Brasil... it's more a futuristic blend of all south american nations... So I guess they have an excuse. As I said, the names are indeed silly, but it doesn't bother me too much.
While the names are silly, what I take from it is that the Brasilia civ isn't really Brasil... it's more a futuristic blend of all south american nations... So I guess they have an excuse. As I said, the names are indeed silly, but it doesn't bother me too much.
Oddible
signal / noise > 1
Seriously? Every time these nationalistic threads pop up I'm a bit embarrassed for the folks getting all outraged. They're just symbols folks, like the shoe or the top hat or the dog in Monopoly. If you want a game with nationalistic realism, go play the Paradox games.
Who cares? At least you get your own faction. Most of Europe is not represented in this game. Anyhow, the factions are just bland templates for modifiers now like they were in previous civs. Not a big problem imo. If you want just mod in a true Brazilian civilization.
Teproc
King
No one is represented in this game ! It's a sci-fi setting with NONE of our current nations. Geez, this is by far the most annoying complaint about this game and it's been going on for months now.
ombak
Prince
Not to mention they're represented in so many other games that complaining about it here just comes off as whining.
I'm not in one game! Waaaaaaaaaaaah!
Come on.
Can we get back to talking about language and linguistics?
I liked the point above about the "Alencar de Araripe" name. It's the name of a Brazilian revolutionary, but even most Brazilians won't know it (though they should recognize Alencar at least as a real name).
So they took a Spanish-speaking revolutionary (Bolívar) a Portuguese-speaking (Alencar de Araripe) and made the character that inherited both of their names speak both languages. What's wrong with that?
Last night he was hostile to me and I got to hear him say "Desembucha" when I contacted him, that was worth a good laugh (it's Portuguese and it's just a way of saying "out with it").
LeppidKingAgain
Chieftain
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You would be surprised what is not obvious and to whom...
But, if they didn't want us to connect them to nations, or whatnot, why did they explicitly base them off of real world geopolitical regions? Why make them speak some pseudo-unintelligible language, when English would've sufficed? Why is it okay for Spanish and Russian to be mangled, but English stays completely the same, with maybe a couple of foreign words thrown in at the start as a lip service, for 300+ years?
It's a valid complaint! It's obvious they were attempting something of that sort here, backing of and saying "No no no, it's the FUTURE. They're not REAL NATIONS." is a cop-out.
Why not go the SMAC route, and base them on various philosophies, or something else, instead of.. this?
And, can you imagine if you played the Slavic federation, and the whole game your capital was named Ycourage ? It breaks immersion, and the "it's not a real language" doesn't help much.
m15a
Emperor
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I think you're combining two different threads of discussion (both happening in this thread). There's the historical connection, between real world nations/cultures and game factions, and then there is the *personal* connection, between the player and the factions.
The factions in the game are supposed to have a connection with the current world, transformed through history. (And your arguments regarding that may be valid.) But they are not supposed to be representative of the people that play the game. Players of this game (or any Civ game really) aren't expected to choose which leader to play just because they are the same nationality/culture/etc. as the leader. That personal connection might be an added bonus, but it's not required. Civ games aren't like The Sims where you get to customize your character to resemble a range of real world individuals. Civ games are about playing the part of someone that isn't you (since, well, very few of us are world leaders).
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