Landmonitor
Prince
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3. Ireland
4. Guyana
5. French Guyana
What 5 Civilizations Should Always Be In Civ?
- Thread starter Head Serf
- Start date
"America has the longest lasting continuous government in the history of the world."
Can't find where in this thread that is said, but it's obviously not true. Great Britain has had a longer period of continuous government (ie. not interrupted by revolution, civil war, anarchy, conquest, etc) than the US of A. Since 1689 there has been a continuous and undisputed succession of monarchs and their governments.
Can't find where in this thread that is said, but it's obviously not true. Great Britain has had a longer period of continuous government (ie. not interrupted by revolution, civil war, anarchy, conquest, etc) than the US of A. Since 1689 there has been a continuous and undisputed succession of monarchs and their governments.
(I say Great Britain as the states involved are the Kingdoms of England and Scotland 1689-1707, the United Kingdom of Great Britain 1707-1800, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland 1801-1922 and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland 1922-present... therefore only the territory of Great Britain and not today's United Kingdom has had a single continuous government.)
Molon Labe
I committed the faux pas.
I read a few pages and then skipped to this point, and I think the poster about America having the longest continuous government mispoke. America has the oldest written constitution of any nation, which is quite a feat given it's relatively young age. I believe that is what he was probably referring to.
It's easy to bash America, and more than a little popular in some circles but its contributions and cultural influence is undeniable.
I would find it hard to justify only 5 civilizations being constant because I don't think 5 alone have influenced the development of civilization alone. History reveals many civilizations, be they short-lived or widespread and advanced, have left indelible fingerprints on the shape of the world and the people who live in it.
It's easy to bash America, and more than a little popular in some circles but its contributions and cultural influence is undeniable.
I would find it hard to justify only 5 civilizations being constant because I don't think 5 alone have influenced the development of civilization alone. History reveals many civilizations, be they short-lived or widespread and advanced, have left indelible fingerprints on the shape of the world and the people who live in it.
Powerslave
Prince
The United States of America have been around, in some form or another, since the 1500s. That's really not so bad, in terms of historical legacy. Granted, back in the 1500s, what existed was mostly just European colonists and native American tribal nations (who had a fascinating history prior to their genocide).
That said, I agree completely with Akka. Greece, Egypt, Persia, Babylon/Sumeria, and Rome, would be my choices. India and China desperately belong on that list, too, but I couldn't fit them. Maybe China instead of Rome.
The Sumerians were the first civilized peoples of which we know. The Babylonians -- their successors -- are responsible for much of what we take for granted today. As has been mentioned, they held the number 12 to be sacred and mystical, thus 60 minute hours and 24 hour days. We also have 28 day lunar cycles. Astrology is Babylonian in origin. The Babylonians feature heavily in Jewish history, as well.
The Egyptians made a strong, lasting empire out of two rivers. Out of the millennia that they existed during, they enslaved many people, built several wonders -- including the only ancient wonder that is still standing today -- and conquered many nations. They are responsible for the invention of many scientific and cultural ideas. There would be no written language without Egyptian hieroglyphics, and there would be no Internet without written language.
In reality, the Greeks were just Egyptians who were more philosophical. The Greek pantheon is simply the Egyptian pantheon with different names, then filled in with some new deities and events. The Greek civilization grew powerful in philosophy, science, culture and military might, eclipsing any Egyptian origin. Pi, democracy, modern philosophy, and modern architecture are all Greek in origin. It all started in Greece, baby.
Rome is where Europe was birthed. In another sense, you could say Germany or France. I would agree with you. However, to go back to its furthest roots, you have to go to Rome. Rome conquered all of Europe, standardized the language, and made everyone one religion. That's an accomplishment. I'm not especially enamored of Rome, but I admire their professional army. In all other respects, the Romans were simply Greeks with a different haircut.
Until Alexander the Great conquered Persia, it was a thriving empire. Cyrus the Great, the founder of Persia, was probably the first enlightened monarch of the classical world! Cyrus freed all the slaves in Babylon, instituted the first human rights laws, and, generally, kicked some serious ass when he went to war. Later leaders, such as Darius I, continued this enlightened rule, but Xerxes probably deserved what he got from Alexander. Alas, but all great empires must come to an end, and Persia's time had come. From Persia, we get humanitarian philosophical ideals, math, science, Zoroastrianism, and a strong cultural heritage that still exists today (scimitars, Ali Baba, genies, etc).
England is just Romans on an island. France is just Gauls and Romans with an attitude problem (though I love France). Germany has more of a claim to be in the top 10 than most other European nations: English is just a German dialect, the Germans are famous engineers, and the German war machine is legendary. German tribes sacked mighty Rome. German mercenaries participated in and tipped many historical wars. German scientists and philosophers have historically changed entire European thought patterns (Nietzsche, Freud, Marx, Engels, etc). How can one say that a bunch of Romans on an Island compare to this?
The U.S., for all of its greatness, is just a bunch of Englishmen on an even bigger island. BFD.
China/Asia is so influencial, I wouldn't even know where to start. However, given my own acknowledged Indo-Eurocentrism, I knocked them down to "runner-up" status. I love Asian history, but I can't really relate to it like I can Indo-European history.
That said, I agree completely with Akka. Greece, Egypt, Persia, Babylon/Sumeria, and Rome, would be my choices. India and China desperately belong on that list, too, but I couldn't fit them. Maybe China instead of Rome.
The Sumerians were the first civilized peoples of which we know. The Babylonians -- their successors -- are responsible for much of what we take for granted today. As has been mentioned, they held the number 12 to be sacred and mystical, thus 60 minute hours and 24 hour days. We also have 28 day lunar cycles. Astrology is Babylonian in origin. The Babylonians feature heavily in Jewish history, as well.
The Egyptians made a strong, lasting empire out of two rivers. Out of the millennia that they existed during, they enslaved many people, built several wonders -- including the only ancient wonder that is still standing today -- and conquered many nations. They are responsible for the invention of many scientific and cultural ideas. There would be no written language without Egyptian hieroglyphics, and there would be no Internet without written language.
In reality, the Greeks were just Egyptians who were more philosophical. The Greek pantheon is simply the Egyptian pantheon with different names, then filled in with some new deities and events. The Greek civilization grew powerful in philosophy, science, culture and military might, eclipsing any Egyptian origin. Pi, democracy, modern philosophy, and modern architecture are all Greek in origin. It all started in Greece, baby.
Rome is where Europe was birthed. In another sense, you could say Germany or France. I would agree with you. However, to go back to its furthest roots, you have to go to Rome. Rome conquered all of Europe, standardized the language, and made everyone one religion. That's an accomplishment. I'm not especially enamored of Rome, but I admire their professional army. In all other respects, the Romans were simply Greeks with a different haircut.
Until Alexander the Great conquered Persia, it was a thriving empire. Cyrus the Great, the founder of Persia, was probably the first enlightened monarch of the classical world! Cyrus freed all the slaves in Babylon, instituted the first human rights laws, and, generally, kicked some serious ass when he went to war. Later leaders, such as Darius I, continued this enlightened rule, but Xerxes probably deserved what he got from Alexander. Alas, but all great empires must come to an end, and Persia's time had come. From Persia, we get humanitarian philosophical ideals, math, science, Zoroastrianism, and a strong cultural heritage that still exists today (scimitars, Ali Baba, genies, etc).
England is just Romans on an island. France is just Gauls and Romans with an attitude problem (though I love France). Germany has more of a claim to be in the top 10 than most other European nations: English is just a German dialect, the Germans are famous engineers, and the German war machine is legendary. German tribes sacked mighty Rome. German mercenaries participated in and tipped many historical wars. German scientists and philosophers have historically changed entire European thought patterns (Nietzsche, Freud, Marx, Engels, etc). How can one say that a bunch of Romans on an Island compare to this?
The U.S., for all of its greatness, is just a bunch of Englishmen on an even bigger island. BFD.
China/Asia is so influencial, I wouldn't even know where to start. However, given my own acknowledged Indo-Eurocentrism, I knocked them down to "runner-up" status. I love Asian history, but I can't really relate to it like I can Indo-European history.
King Flevance
Deity
dpaajones said:
Monarchy rules the pwnz0r!
EDIT: Oh yeah, my votes were:
1. America. (That is where the game was born.)
2. China
3. England
4. Germany
5. Greece (Actually, this one kind of ties with France for me though.)
Bast
Protector of Cats
Quagga said:
The British Empire technically started since Jamestown in early 1600's so which exact period are you talking about?
As far as I know, Latin was a language of science till around 17th century. French took over in the 18th century and then gradually German and English became popular in the 19th century. I do know that pre-WWII, German was a true language of science. It was perhaps on its way to even taking over English? But since then it's been all English with little rivalry from Russian but that's about it.
Swedishguy
Deity
1) Sweden!!!
2) America
3) Aztec Kindom
4) China
5) Rome
2) America
3) Aztec Kindom
4) China
5) Rome
Agarwaen
King
Rome
India
China
Russia
Egypt
India
China
Russia
Egypt
Swedishguy
Deity
Who voted for Babylon!?
Syagrius
Warlord
What the?? Never saw a more stupid way about making an assessment of the Roman People.Powerslave said:
gettingfat
Emperor
- Joined
- Nov 7, 2003
- Messages
- 1,417
Chinese - long history + regional superpower + still powerful in modern era
Rome - basically the equivalent of Chinese in Western world, except that they are less significant today (well, even Italy is not so powerful today)
Egypt - well, the game is called Civs, right? Hard to ignore it even it is not a major factor today.
England - occupy the centerstage for a couple of centuries. America is a valid choice, but if a choice has to be made then pick the mom instead of the kid (just personal choice, no reason).
Persia
Rome - basically the equivalent of Chinese in Western world, except that they are less significant today (well, even Italy is not so powerful today)
Egypt - well, the game is called Civs, right? Hard to ignore it even it is not a major factor today.
England - occupy the centerstage for a couple of centuries. America is a valid choice, but if a choice has to be made then pick the mom instead of the kid (just personal choice, no reason).
Persia
D'Artagnan59
The Gascon
1. Rome
2. America
3. England
4. China
5. Babylon
2. America
3. England
4. China
5. Babylon
Swedishguy
Deity
Babylon, Babylon, Babylon! What's so special about them?
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