What is a district, why is it so hard to repair?

[shaglio]

That cost is "you already have more than the average number among civs", not "multiple-of-the-same-district".

So then I'll amend my question: Is the cost to repair a district calculated from the base cost or the increased "you already have more than the average number among civs" cost? That could be part of the problem right there if it's the latter.

 

[AsH2]

Increased district costs is a necessary deterrent for quick overexpansion..

Actually, it's encouraging quick expansion.

So then I'll amend my question: Is the cost to repair a district calculated from the base cost or the increased "you already have more than the average number among civs" cost? That could be part of the problem right there if it's the latter.

That's just about +25%, while "normal" district costs increase are up to +900%.
From https://civilization.fandom.com/wiki/District_(Civ6)

Spoiler :

Production cost
The Production cost of a District is progressive, starting from a "base price" in the beginning of the game. Each technology or civic you research increases the price by the following formula:

FLOOR(BaseCost(1+9∗FLOOR(100∗MAX(CompletedTechs/67,CompletedCivics/50))/100))

In simpler language, the price is determined by the percentage of the total techs or civics you've researched, whichever is greater. The more techs or civics you have researched, the more expensive District construction is.

Thanks all, we think we have a handle on this.

I don't get the point of this (civics/techs) scaling district cost. It's not deterrenting quick overexpansion, but effectly spoils possibilities for slow expansion.

 

[Atlas627]

I don't get the point of this (civics/techs) scaling district cost. It's not deterrenting quick overexpansion, but effectly spoils possibilities for slow expansion.

I think its a general anti-snowball for civs which tech up too fast, without allowing other civs to just rubber-band back into first. So you can unlock lots of stuff, but then your costs get more expensive so you can only make a few of the unlocked things.

Unfortunately, not being allowed to produce stuff has been an extremely common complaint in this game. I've modded my game to scale district costs based on how many of it you already have, and that feels much better to me. Specialize cities but generalize the empire.

 

[Ziad]

It scales based on relative number of districts compared to the average. How does it punish slow expansion?

 

[Atlas627]

It scales based on relative number of districts compared to the average. How does it punish slow expansion?

It scales based on how many techs/civics you have researched/boosted. There's an extra (flat percentage) cost for districts you have more than average for the other civs.

So yeah it doesn't punish going wide in any way whatsoever, except making colonies (sad). What it does do is punish the player that does nothing but research, and slightly punishes the player who doesn't generalize their districts (and therefore specialize their cities).

 

[Scaramanga]

I think it's the right call to go by the scaling district cost when it comes to repairing. Pillaging for yields and combat bonuses vs the city centre and then getting the district back up and running in a few turns would be too powerful. And it does it in half the time as a similar city building the same district. If a city has been completely pillaged it's a quagmire.

 

[Victoria]

I think it's the right call to go by the scaling district cost when it comes to repairing. Pillaging for yields and combat bonuses vs the city centre and then getting the district back up and running in a few turns would be too powerful. And it does it in half the time as a similar city building the same district. If a city has been completely pillaged it's a quagmire.

Pillaging value is way too high, this is half the issue, no-one wanted pillaging this high. I just pillaged a bank, market and district for 1k gold with a 7 move LC that could arguably do twice as much in the same move.
A science district may make 20 science per turn but I can pillage it for 1000 science?
Repairing buildings takes a few turns... so my argument is this...
I pillage the buildings for 600 science and repair them in a few turns, so your argument does not hold because you can abuse it by not pillaging the district.
It would be simpler to make the district not able to be pillaged or drop pillaging values because the cost of repairing districts is damn annoying, especially in a coastal city.

 

[Scaramanga]

Pillaging value is way too high, this is half the issue, no-one wanted pillaging this high. I just pillaged a bank, market and district for 1k gold with a 7 move LC that could arguably do twice as much in the same move.
A science district may make 20 science per turn but I can pillage it for 1000 science?
Repairing buildings takes a few turns... so my argument is this...
I pillage the buildings for 600 science and repair them in a few turns, so your argument does not hold because you can abuse it by not pillaging the district.
It would be simpler to make the district not able to be pillaged or drop pillaging values because the cost of repairing districts is damn annoying, especially in a coastal city.

Then the other bonus from districts must have implications (that it is effectively a support unit for the city centre) not to mention any government cards or legacy bonuses. There seem to be less for the actual buildings so district pillaging is more serious for the target and anyone trying to capture more districts. I can understand your point I'm just trying to see the designer's view first.

 

[King of Prussia]

i'd be happy with faster rebuilding of districts with a large hit to the "income" to pillaging of said districts.

 

[Victoria]

I imagine the designers though that late game when your district repair cost is high then fix a few mines and off you go, but the 10:1 scaling cost of districts vs 4/5:1 of production is incorrect but it is the coastal cities that suffer most.
How long is the intent for repair of a district as opposed to the buildings within?
I just think the value is off, this thread sho was I am not alone and they now appear to have recognised the issue.
They wanted an example with a save and I have provided one, and it’s not even one of the horrible coastal ones when you lose everything tona hurricane and it says 126 turns to repair your harbour, or campus or IZ... and I have lost all 3 and all fishing boats are destroyed and all my production comes from the IZ and the Harbor. That is the real issue here, friggin storms total many coastal cities, much more than IRL.

 

[Scaramanga]

I imagine the designers though that late game when your district repair cost is high then fix a few mines and off you go, but the 10:1 scaling cost of districts vs 4/5:1 of production is incorrect but it is the coastal cities that suffer most.
How long is the intent for repair of a district as opposed to the buildings within?
I just think the value is off, this thread sho was I am not alone and they now appear to have recognised the issue.
They wanted an example with a save and I have provided one, and it’s not even one of the horrible coastal ones when you lose everything tona hurricane and it says 126 turns to repair your harbour, or campus or IZ... and I have lost all 3 and all fishing boats are destroyed and all my production comes from the IZ and the Harbor. That is the real issue here, friggin storms total many coastal cities, much more than IRL.

I think Firaxis' response was a bit muted or cryptic. I think they've noticed districts take more time to repair than buildings. Maybe they will come back with scaling building costs .
I don't have Gathering Storm so I would need to know if hurricanes occur only near the equator during normal climates; maybe it is some attempt to punish cities in otherwise advantageous locations. There is a yearly hurricane season so it can't be that far off the mark.

 

[Victoria]

There is a yearly hurricane season so it can't be that far off the mark.

The worst US hurricane was Galveston which took 10 years to recover from. How many game turns is that?

 

[WorkAccount963]

I have found this pretty game breaking on Marathon/Deity. The AI seems susceptible to having their districts pillaged by barbs, even through the medieval era. I think the cause is a combo of spawn rate and barbs seem more likely to spawn closer to your border and prioritize pillaging in GS. I suspect the AI gets caught in a vicious cycle of repairing districts and and not having enough units for protection. Let me know if anyone else has had this experience, but 75% of the time, i am able to waltz into an opposing civilization with everything on fire and no walls through the end of the classical era.

I completely agree that pillaging is too rewarding but I think we can all agree the penalty needs reduced, as well as the rewards.

 

[Victoria]

Yes pillage a civ and they just start dropping behind so quickly and you just get 20k faith so easily. Just buy any army you want, anytime.

 

[AsH2]

I think its a general anti-snowball for civs which tech up too fast, without allowing other civs to just rubber-band back into first. So you can unlock lots of stuff, but then your costs get more expensive so you can only make a few of the unlocked things.

Instead of this nonsense, they could have let (especially) Open borders affect science/tech and culture/civics - spreading mostly like loyalty pushes and minor like the tourism mechanics and adding / like eureka/inspirations do.
And, as I replied..

..
In general I think eras (Science/Culture) tend to move too fast, and not a product of game speed but as a product of systems that favor specific strategies to maximize those outputs. I think the game would benefit from turning boosts/inspirations into requirements rather than bonuses.
..

Could be requirements at first acquire and then (if not first) boost.

 

[Minou]

Why do I have the horrible feeling Firaxis is right now coding in that hurricanes will just completely raze cities and pillaging will now award free Builders (captives?) in addition to hundreds of gold.

Honestly the pillage buff wins the award for the ultimate change no one wanted. Devalues production even more? Check. Makes little sense for immersion? Check. Makes peaceful play even less competitive with warmongering? Check. Can be easily abused with pillage / capture / flip / repair? Check. I pray they will just go back to a flat 25 gold/science/etc. eventually.

 

[UWHabs]

I actually think having legit pillage rewards was a good change in theory - I do think that it makes sense that you have a legit choice whether to pillage or not as you conquer, and declaring war just to pillage as a strategy tactic is a very nice option.

That being said, the scaling of rewards is still way off. While the flat 25 science or whatever it used to be was way too little before, the current amount is still too much, especially with the policy cards to boost them.

I do think letting builders/ME be able to repair districts, whether for a charge or not, would be a great change. Also obviously this problem of a district being pillaged to 0 and having to be rebuilt essentially from scratch hopefully will be fixed. As for the rest, maybe it's just a question of balancing things. I think part of the problem is that it's "free" to repair improvements, but districts/buildings cost a lot which creates imbalance. Even if it was a simple change that every repair, whether district/building/improvement, simply cost one builder charge. Combine that with less rewards from actually pillaging, and then you have a system where it's maybe still worthwhile to pillage as you raid, but it won't take forever to rebuild, especially if the pillage came from a hurricane or disaster. Or if you simply used cash to repair everything, then you could even tie it in closer so that essentially the reward you get from pillaging is essentially the same as the cost to repair, so it's never really worth it to go pillage a bunch of mines or buildings before capturing a city if you actually want those improvements to work for you after.

 

[Minou]

Good point that pillaging improvements is “free” versus costly for buildings and out of control for districts. I think maybe a good way to even things out would let Builders or ME repair any improvement, building, or district for one charge. You could then repair a hurricaned city for one or two Serfdom Builders which is still a very real cost but not out of control. The time scale would be good too - about 10 turns with moving maybe, not instantaneously but not 109 turns.

 

[AsH2]

Better make Districts indestructible but considered damaged (not working) if there are damaged buildings within.

 

[Jkchart]

don't get me started on recruit partisans. they should entirely remove that **** from the game

I have definitely complained more than once that it either needs to be removed or made super restricted to either 1) conquered cities or 2) cities with loyalty/amenity issues. Not random modern armors popping up in my most loyal, happy, and developed core cities. Luckily it happens less than it used to.