Changed vote thanks to livestream hint, hopefully we could get Mehmed II and his 'Fall of Constantinople' ability but Firaxis may just stick with Suleiman. A sort of trade/militaristic civ with a bit of naval side-focus
100% confident that the unique governor will be revealed next week
Pretty sure the UD is the Cothon for Phoenicia, and Ottomans get a governor in replacement for the UI otherwise Eleanor won't get any UC, which doesn't really make sense
Pretty sure the UD is the Cothon for Phoenicia, and Ottomans get a governor in replacement for the UI otherwise Eleanor won't get any UC, which doesn't really make sense
I'm going to repeat my guess that the Ottomans will be the warmonger rep for the expansion. They probably have the unique governor, which I see going one of two ways:
1) Loyalty boosts to occupied cities
2) Some sort of naval bonus (if going for the pirate angle)
The current governors are largely useless beyond their loyalty bump for warmongers. I'm assuming the UG will replace Victor since they're aggressors, not defenders, but they could also replace Magnus, since he's the most domination focused default governor.
Either way, it should be interesting. Really hoping they don't double down on the corsair angle that tanked in Civ V.
I don't think there's any reason to assume Eleanor will get a UC. Of them, the UU makes the most sense because she'll replace Victoria, but it's not really necessary. It all depends on how good the ability is.
I don't think there's any reason to assume Eleanor will get a UC. Of them, the UU makes the most sense because she'll replace Victoria, but it's not really necessary. It all depends on how good the ability is.
I had thought that Eleanor would get a unique component, but I was corrected in that both Gorgo and Chandragupta only received a unique ability. I doubt Eleanor would break the precedent, but of course happy either way.
I get the feeling the Ottomans will get the Janissaries, Eleanor none, and Phoenicia will get a naval UU. I think the Ottomans will get a naval ability to make use of the raiding bonus they mentioned in the stream (would be surprised if Phoenicia got it).
I get the feeling the Ottomans will get the Janissaries, Eleanor none, and Phoenicia will get a naval UU. I think the Ottomans will get a naval ability to make use of the raiding bonus they mentioned in the stream (would be surprised if Phoenicia got it).
Why would you be surprised? Phoenicia has a far more tradition of naval pillaging and piracy if I'm right. Giving raiding bonuses to a heavy-naval focused civ would make more sense for me than to put it in a great empire that did other things than being pirates (yes, I know saying that Ottomans are more than pirates is quite an heresy, but I stick to it).
Why would you be surprised? Phoenicia has a far more tradition of naval pillaging and piracy if I'm right. Giving raiding bonuses to a heavy-naval focused civ would make more sense for me than to put it in a great empire that did other things than being pirates (yes, I know saying that Ottomans are more than pirates is quite an heresy, but I stick to it).
I would hate it if they pass over the Janissary, but this would be the optimal scenario if they absolutely must put a nod to Barbary pirates into the Ottoman civ. I don't want it incorporated into the LUA or CUA like it was in V.
I would hate it if they pass over the Janissary, but this would be the optimal scenario if they absolutely must put a nod to Barbary pirates into the Ottoman civ. I don't want it incorporated into the LUA or CUA like it was in V.
It might be fun to have the unique governor that you place in city states, but allows you to build ships with them and attack other civs without directly attacking them.
Why would you be surprised? Phoenicia has a far more tradition of naval pillaging and piracy if I'm right. Giving raiding bonuses to a heavy-naval focused civ would make more sense for me than to put it in a great empire that did other things than being pirates (yes, I know saying that Ottomans are more than pirates is quite an heresy, but I stick to it).
I'd just be surprised because from my perception Phoenicia was more concerned with trading than raiding, I've never gotten the impression that they were out for more than that (Carthage though I know was more militaristic). But my knowledge of them certainly isn't deep enough.
I know the Ottomans have a rich history though, and it would be nice to see multiple aspects of their empire be highlighted particularly with Suleiman leading them.
Why would you be surprised? Phoenicia has a far more tradition of naval pillaging and piracy if I'm right. Giving raiding bonuses to a heavy-naval focused civ would make more sense for me than to put it in a great empire that did other things than being pirates (yes, I know saying that Ottomans are more than pirates is quite an heresy, but I stick to it).
Well you aren't right. They exercised their relative monopoly on the maritime but they were far more renowned for settling distant lands and trading with local cultures in a relatively peaceful manner from North Africa to Britain.
If they participated in any form of pillaging and piracy, it was just a consequence of their maritime dominance. They also engaged in slave trading as did any other culture of their time. It doesn't make them notorious for being slave traders.
IF they implement raiding as part of a bonus to Phoenicians, it would be a consequence of maintaining that maritime monopoly, but I have a very hard time seeing them have any form of raiding on land as that was essentially nonexistent, and given that Norway pretty much has coastal raiding covered, I'm going to pretty much lean towards the Ottomans as having additional benefits to pillaging and piracy as they are actually pretty notorious for that whether on land or sea.
Just ask the descendants of the Phoenicians. The Ottomans pretty much almost pillaged Lebanon's cedars to extinction and plundered their food imports, essentially starving half of their population to death during World War 1.
Anyway Firaxis has been mostly on-point with these civs (in my opinion) and so I'm sure whatever they do will make sense.
I predict Dido will start out at sea like Kupe. I remember them mentioning several times in the Maori livestream that other leaders could have that ability...
That would be a fair argument if Phoenicia's leader were anyone other than Dido, who famously fled across the Mediterranean and founded a new kingdom on a different continent. If there was any reason to pick Dido over anyone else, I would think it was because of that.
I'd also like to remind people that BERT had two aquatic-borne civs, while simultaneously adding the generic capabilities for such a start. In the Maori livestream, Ed used exactly that language when talking about the Maori's aquatic start.
I get the feeling the Ottomans will get the Janissaries, Eleanor none, and Phoenicia will get a naval UU. I think the Ottomans will get a naval ability to make use of the raiding bonus they mentioned in the stream (would be surprised if Phoenicia got it).
I agree on the above that this is the likeliest of scenarios. Although I like the idea that a naval raiding bonus or a corsair UU would be tied to a governor promotion. That could still be a possibility along with the janissary if that was a miscount on the number of UUs as well.
The only reason I don’t think these bonuses would go to Phoenicia is I beliebe they aren’t glong to make it a warmongering civ to differentiate it from Carthage.
I could possibly see this especially since there isn’t much to go on as a leader ability for Dido called “Founder of Carthage”. Of course this is only if her capital would be Carthage, which I am leaning towards it not being.
The system you're referring to was Devshirme. Christian boys were taken from their families, converted to Islam, and raised by the state to serve primarily in civil or military roles. Some went to the Janissaries, who were, indeed, as specific and distinct a military unit as you're likely to find.
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(I still get the hat, jaja)
