Whats the purpose of lancers? need buf?

[elprofesor]

Lancers don't have a bonus against cavalry, it's the cavalry that has a penalty against mounted units (which is absurd, since -50% gets them mowed by knights!).

As has been said, lancers are cool if you beeline them, but with rifling so close, I'd rather just wait a bit and upgrade my promoted longswordmen for some serious (although slower) butt-kicking. Other than that, they are cool for taking down cannons, crossbowmen, or artillery, for scouting, or for pillaging, but they aren't particularly impressive at this either (unless you are playing with the Ottomans; Sipahis can be a real pain in the neck, go check their bonus!).

In the end, I just use them as meatshield. It would be a completely different thing if cavalry were useful, renaissance is right now completely dominated by riflemen (no need for cannons, no ranged unit, useless cavalry...), just as medieval was completely dominated by longswordmen (if the patch changes this)

 

[civnoob13]

In the end, I just use them as meatshield. It would be a completely different thing if cavalry were useful, renaissance is right now completely dominated by riflemen (no need for cannons, no ranged unit, useless cavalry...), just as medieval was completely dominated by longswordmen (if the patch changes this)

I disagree. I always need siege units to take over cities, and ranged units are always very useful especially on the defence.

 

[elprofesor]

Crossbowmen deal ridiculous damage to riflemen, that's why I say that there aren't ranged units in the late renaissance (I consider ranged units and siege units as different things).

About cannons, the only thing that I can say is that promoted longswordmen upgraded to riflemen are better at taking cities than cannons; adding a riflemen to your army, which can move and attack on the same turn, and won't get mowed during the counter-attack, will generally improve it more than adding a cannon, which doesn't have indirect fire (and is thus very cumbersome to use, it is extremely rare to hit a regular unit with it in my games), unless your army already has ~5 riflemen, which is already a strong enough force to take down most cities.

I'm not saying that cannons are completely useless, I'm saying that you are generally better off with a rifleman. This changes when you hit dinamite, though: artillery hits harder and further than infantry, it almost serves as a regular ranged unit thanks to extra range and indirect fire.

 

[GenjiKhan]

In the end, I just use them as meatshield. It would be a completely different thing if cavalry were useful, renaissance is right now completely dominated by riflemen (no need for cannons, no ranged unit, useless cavalry...), just as medieval was completely dominated by longswordmen (if the patch changes this)

A exception here is you are playing with Russia. Their Cossacks are probably one of the best defensive/counter offensive units in the game. that bonus against wounded units allow them to take down Rifleman and even Infantry in the field and Russia UA allows you to build a lot of Cossacks. needless to say they keep this bonus when upgraded to tank.

 

[thadian]

Rifling works well until the AI gets chemistry, then your stuck until you get artillery and if you can't get it fast enough you might need to wait for flight or infantry.

 

[elprofesor]

Sure, cannons on defense can do some damage. It's just a matter of how many heavily promoted rifles you are taking to the fight