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Which God Would You Follow/Worship? (not which civ)

Discussion in 'Fall from Heaven Lore' started by jimi12, Mar 24, 2008.

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Which God Would You Follow/Worship? (not which civ)

  1. Lugus

    8 vote(s)
    5.1%
  2. Sirona

    18 vote(s)
    11.5%
  3. Nantosuelta

    3 vote(s)
    1.9%
  4. Sucellus

    6 vote(s)
    3.8%
  5. Amathaon

    6 vote(s)
    3.8%
  6. Junil

    8 vote(s)
    5.1%
  7. Kilmorph

    10 vote(s)
    6.4%
  8. Oghma

    21 vote(s)
    13.4%
  9. Cernunnos

    4 vote(s)
    2.5%
  10. Arawn

    2 vote(s)
    1.3%
  11. Dagda

    3 vote(s)
    1.9%
  12. Tali

    4 vote(s)
    2.5%
  13. Danalin

    1 vote(s)
    0.6%
  14. Camulos

    1 vote(s)
    0.6%
  15. Aeron

    4 vote(s)
    2.5%
  16. Ceridwen

    3 vote(s)
    1.9%
  17. Mammon

    3 vote(s)
    1.9%
  18. Esus

    5 vote(s)
    3.2%
  19. Mulcarn

    3 vote(s)
    1.9%
  20. Agares

    8 vote(s)
    5.1%
  21. Bhall

    6 vote(s)
    3.8%
  22. The One

    30 vote(s)
    19.1%
  1. mahazel

    mahazel Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Location:
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    So there shouldn`t be the Altar of Luonatar but a PC with Civ4 and FFH. If you want to win altar victory, you must complete the PC from parts, install system, install Civ4, install BtS, and finaly install FFH, and then you can push play button... and you will be a new god of creation ;)
     
  2. megamanx06

    megamanx06 Caswallan

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2007
    Messages:
    322
    Location:
    Orlando
    Oghma, knowledge is power, ftw.
     
  3. Fenboy

    Fenboy Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    686
    Location:
    Ingurland
    Don't forget patching BtS to 0.17 ;)
     
  4. Mailbox

    Mailbox Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2007
    Messages:
    873
    I remembered something that didn't catch my eye at first but now seems kind of funny when I think about it in rereading this thread. Mulcarn had a group of souls frozen in his hell that seemed to be large enough to form an army but not overwhelmingly so. Are these the souls of the people who actually worshipped Mulcarn instead of the many souls who ended up there just as a stop to lower hells. It seems like Mulcarn was never a popular god and perhaps the total number of people that actively worshipped him could actually fit around his throne. That also highlights the fact that he really gets the short end of the stick when it comes to followers and that he might have felt especially "grandfatherly" towards the few people that did follow him and kept them from becoming true demons in the lower hells.
     
  5. Blakmane

    Blakmane Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2007
    Messages:
    447
    I'd worship none of the gods, even The One. The need to worship is part of the taint introduced when the angels fell. By worshipping any god (even The One) I am infact perpetuating the taint which is preventing The One from entering creation safely.

    Acknowledging the original purpose of the Angels without worshipping them seems the more sensible path to me. Before the fall, each Angel was the embodiment of an ideal and (theoretically at least) these balance each other out to create a perfect world/life.

    You'd think I would be a grigori player wouldn't you, but I hate their mechanic =p
     
  6. Mailbox

    Mailbox Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2007
    Messages:
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    This is totally wrong, all the Angels worshipped the One before the fall. Cassiel doesn't seem to realize this however, I guess that he missed something along the way.

     
  7. Blakmane

    Blakmane Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2007
    Messages:
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    That's a fair enough find, but I don't think 'praise' means 'worship' in this case. The One deserved to be praised, as he had created the world and the angels, but he never wants to be worshipped.

    Regardless, angels worshipping the one isn't the same as mortal need for worship, which is what I am referring to. The fallen angels at least worship noone now.
     
  8. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Location:
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    I say that Worship isn't caused by Agares taint, but that it is part of Agares' sphere. To say that Worship is inherently a bad thing is like saying that Hope (Agares's purpose), Peace (Camulos's purpose), Strength (Aeron's purpose), Foresight (Mammon's purpose), Rest (Mulcarn's purpose), Emotional Attachments (Ceridwen's purpose), Passion (Bhall's purpose), or Trust (Esus's purpose) are inherently evil.

    Like all the evil angels' aspects it has been greatly corrupted by the fall and we must treat them very carefully, but abusus non tollit usum.


    Note that Cassiel was not around until after the fall, and that his knowledge of The One is entirely second hand.
     
  9. Micky Onimusha

    Micky Onimusha Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
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    Firstly, like zup, I could never follow "The One".
    One grand "divine plan", omnipotence, omniscience, etc. they're all concepts I detest. Whilst I don't recall the exact quote (nor can find it scouring the internet), a line from Dogma sums up my feelings on God's 'mysterious ways' and 'grand plan':

    "What was wrong with my plans?"

    I consider myself to be a believer (or unbeliever) in dumb luck, coincidence, chance and so forth. In a way, "The One" is a bit like how I do see a possible God. One who created, and then shut off all links to the world he created and let it get on with itself (much like a child's science experiment, which after grading by a teacher, is placed aside and forgotten). In that way, if "The One" does lack a grand plan, doesn't intend to re-enter creation (as Cassiel otherwise implies) and intends to let what happens 'happen', then in his own way he is both the God I would believe in yet simultaneously not believe in. Almost like believing in his existence but not placing any faith in him, since he's there and not there at the same time.

    Going over the Fall From Heaven Wiki (which sadly does have some empty areas with little-to-no information on some of the Gods), I find myself siding with Tali more than any other 'God'.
    Despite the first quote almost sounding like the description you'd find in a dating advert, I think Tali most embodies my view on existence (and certainly how I would see existence within Erebus). It is chaotic, with seemingly no path or destination. When chance opens up a path or destination, it is as quick to close it off; whether you have only just seen it, been walking it for years or have nearly reached it.

    This to me is the ideal religion. With one's own life being so short in the grand scheme of things (and undoubtedly shorter in Erebus), why devote it to the praise and worship of a god? For a place in their heaven, hell or vault? I'm not one to believe in such assurances of an everlasting eternity. My focus would be on the present. Whether I'd truly "believe" in Tali is questionable, I'd be more likely to refer to him as "luck" and curse and praise his name (or luck) depending on whether it swings in my favour or not.

    Of course, my narrow view on life being a short-term thing may well lead me to fall into Mammon's hell, whether intentionally or unintentionally (and from the sounds of things, he would be happy for me to be an unintentional follower). Whilst the tale of his hell makes for a good story, I heavily doubt I would wish to spend my eternity in there (good thing I don't believe in eternity, right? :lol:).

    I'd say all of the above stems from my own philosophy and if I were to role-play the idea that I do not know for sure that the God's have their own eternal heavens/hells/vaults for their followers. If I were to be told beforehand with an assured guarantee that following X God would lead to Y eternity, I'm sure my faith would be much easier to swing. After all, I would see a purpose in devoting my time on Erebus to the praise of a God if the end reward was a place in their lovely heaven (raising the question of whether I would end up with Mammon, as noted by others here - following the God for the reward, rather than true belief).

    From an RP perspective, I most certainly see myself following Tali more than any other God, and if I were to be slung into Erebus, I think he is the God that would earn my favour (and disfavour).

    From a bit of a metagaming perspective:
    - I find myself sympathetic to Mulcarn, one who is necessary yet unappreciated for his necessities and seen as cruel (like the needle to a cure - the needle hurts yet the pain from it is necessary in order to receive the good, and so the needle shouldn't be hated). Whilst I don't think I could truly follow him, in his own way he is a sympathetic villain and I could see myself swayed to his side.
    - Danalin seems the most caring of all the Gods. One with such great care for his people that their fall caused him great sorrow, leading to a lengthy/eternal sleep. A God that shows that much emotional attachment and care for his followers would be more than capable of earning my favour. Almost like a loving Grandfather figure.
    - In a similar way, I think I could be swayed by Sirona too, who innate well-meaning and kindness would draw my favour. The wiki quip: "Most of the gods see Sirona as a sweet little sister, whose opinion doesn't really matter" does seem to also fit how I would see her as well however. She exercises mercy, forgiveness and redemption to such a great extent that it's both a virtue and a weakness.
    - Kilmorph too seems a caring and compassionate God, though her religion is far from flawless. Nonetheless, she seems like a God who has a heart, and whilst is reluctant to intervene, is willing to when she sees those who she cherishes in deep suffering (evident by the Mithril Golem for example).

    Over-all, I definitely see myself as a follower of Talin, if one could even follow a God of his nature (as noted, his believers simply lack the patience to create a true religion about him - which is probably for the best), but being a person who admires compassion and caring, I do feel I could grow an attachment to Danalin, Sirona and Kilmorph were I to feel that they cared for me, and would likewise return their caring for me with faith/devotion.
     
  10. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2007
    Messages:
    15,932
    Location:
    Kael's head
    I find it quite odd that you would consider both Tali and Kilmorph, considering how they hate each other. Fundamentally Kilmorph is the goddess of responsibility, and Tali is the god of responsibility. They both be neutral, but the enmity between them is as large as that between many good and evil gods.

    Tali does have a bit of a religion, but it is a very individualistic one and the shrines are all found in very hard to reach places like the edges of the worlds tallest cliffs. His followers do have the patience and determination to do stuff that doesn't matter at all except that it is cool, but never actual work.



    Sirona, not Danalin, is by far the most caring of the gods. She is the embodiment of caring, kindness, wisdom, and altruism. She is definitely more caring that Danalin, but Danalin does come in number two. Danalin's essence is serenity, tranquility, wisdom gained though a long lifetime of experience and contemplation (no epiphanies), and the love between very old friends. (I think the god who most exemplifies emotional attachments is Ceridwen, but she is mostly about the unhealthy attachments and dysfunctional relationships.) Danalin would be very caring towards those who have followed them for a long time, but you'd probably have to be devoted to him for a very long time before he warms up to you, whereas Sirona would be caring towards even her sworn enemies. Sirona and Danalin were very close friends and allies. Oddly enough, he was also a close friend of Tali, even though their spheres have very little in common. Of course, right now Danalin is asleep and his serinity has been traded for madness.




    People don't go to Mammon's hell for just being short sighted and not thinking of consequences, but for being greedy and seeking to profit at the expense of others. Mammon's follwers think very much of consequence, but only of the consequences they they themselves would face in this life. Ignoring consequences altogether and just living in the moment is more of a Tali thing.

    Kael says that Bhall is passionate chaos represented when a mob sets fire to a suspected witch's house, Camulos is the pointless chaos represented when arsonists pick random targets just to watch the innocents' house burn, and Tali is the chaos without malice represented when a bunch of guys decide one night to paint a random house red, but get distracted and before they are halfway done they start instead painting each other, the nearby farm animals, and a flock of geese, and then once they realize that the geese can't fly since they are drenched in paint they regret it and stay up all night taking care of the birds, until they get hungry and decide to kill, cook, and eat one of them, and then start playing with the feathers, and then wander back around sunrise laughing at each other and completely covered in paint and feathers. Tali has been described as the god of drunks and frat boys. I also tend to think that he is the patron god of Family Guy and Monty Python, and that the hymns his followers sing to him are a lot like "Bird's the Word"




    I probably would follow The One if I knew of him but also revere a few other gods, whom I might worship if I didn't know of the one. The top choices for me are definitely Lugus, Sirona, and Danalin, but I'm not quite sure in what order. These three all get a long very well with each other, so I don't think I'd really have to choose just one. I too would be very sympathetic to Mulcarn, and see a fair amount of myself in him (although that part of me may really be closer to Danalin). In fact, I'd probably even be sympathetic to Agares--not in a way to make me follow him, but so that (like Sirona) I'd believe we should try to redeem instead of destroy him. I tend to think that The One actually intended for all the gods to have the freedom of purpose that Agares sought, but knew that it could not exist while their souls were dominated by one precept, and sought to take away the power of creation so they would give up their spheres and gain true free will. As such I tend to have respect for Nemed and to consider all the gods to be rather hypocritical.
     
  11. Skitters

    Skitters Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Birmingham, UK
    ...I can't help now but picture someone carrying an ironing board up a mountain and getting their chum to take a pic (...perhaps a Discworld-esque Imp-with paintbrush-in-a-box camera) whilst he has his fingers in a 'rock' motif, and calling out "Extreme!!!!"


    Seriously, wouldn't Tali have a major following amongst sailors (and Kuriotate Airship pilots)?
     
  12. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

    Joined:
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    Location:
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    An ironing board? That seems pretty random. Of course, since we're talking about followers of Tali that means it makes perfect sense. I can see carrying ironing boards to the top of mountains being a time honored tradition among Tali-worshipers. Of course, to them time honored probably means it started within the last two weeks and will be considered much too boring, mundane, and legalistic to continue for more than a few more days. The tradition might be able to last a little longer if they use the board to surf down the slope.

    I tend to think that the traditional benediction in Tali's religion is "Duuude...that's AWESOME!!!"
     
  13. Skitters

    Skitters Chieftain

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    Location:
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    Extreme Ironing: - "the latest danger sport that combines the thrills of an extreme outdoor activity with the satisfaction of a well-pressed shirt."

    wikipedia
     
  14. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

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    Very interesting.


    I still think Tali's followers could get board of it eventually and move on to playing the Cello while hang gliding.




    Yes, Tali does have a following among sailors, and other adventurers.
     
  15. Micky Onimusha

    Micky Onimusha Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Yeah, but my following of Kilmorph would be based less on her being responsible and more on her emotion and caring for her followers. I guess I kind of want a God who'll say "You see that cliff? You see that other cliff? I bet you can't backflip from one to the other" and then after landing very painfully, have a caring God who'll say "You shouldn't be so silly. Here, let me patch you up". Of course, if I had to choose, Tali would definitely come first, but a caring God would be nice too. I suppose it's fittingly irresponsible that a follower of an irresponsible God would want a responsible God to pick up the pieces afterwards...but I do get the feeling Kilmorph wouldn't be too partial to picking up the pieces though :lol: But (an awake) Danalin might be willing to, being friends with Tali 'n all... and Sirona seems the type to care for all, even the irresponsible fool who gets himself into trouble.

    Although Sirona may be the most caring (and the embodiment of caring), I feel more closeness to Danalin simply for how deep his caring went (to cause such great depression that he'd fall into dreams of madness). You're right, you probably would have to be a devotee from the beginning rather than him caring for you from the beginning for him to build such an attachment, but I'd like to think maybe if you were born in his lands he'd have an innate caring from you before you even reach an age where you can even become devoted to a God. As I said, he strikes me as a bit of a Grandfather figure. He may think every other kid out there is a little brat, but one of his descendants, he'd see as perfect and adorable in every way.

    Yeah, that's pretty much why I'd follow Tali... Over in one of the other threads I saw myself as a Harlequin... If I was in Erebus, I could easily see myself with a pointy-bell-hat and purple and yellow checkered trousers running up a cliff with an ironing board yelling "surfs up dudes!". In fact, a God who sees that as worship is ideal by me :)

    Also, since I've got my mind on Tali, I'd love to see a small in-game sect devoted to him. He's apparently the patron of the Hippus, and the Balseraphs and Lanun would be partial to him. I could see a minor religion of crazies forming, although they'd have much in common with the OO... only they wouldn't be clinically mad, they'd just be a bit drunk or in the mood for a laugh.

    Could be an in-game event near the coasts - "You come across a couple of idiots/Tali devotees trying to backflip from one cliff to another: Stop them! They could hurt themselves! Let them do it then heal their wounds. Watch and laugh" and a "Join in!" option for the Balseraphs, Hippus and Lanun .... Now I'm actually tempted to post that in the "Ideas needed: Common Events" thread now too :lol:
     
  16. FireBlaze

    FireBlaze Chieftain

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    Now im stuck between Bhall and Tali....

    I think i'll be a Tali follower who really likes fire for some reason =D
     
  17. civ_king

    civ_king Deus Caritas Est

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    Oghma definitely... knowledge is like drugs to me
     
  18. cypher132

    cypher132 Chieftain

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    I would follow Agares. If only a small sacrifice gains great rewards, I could do it. I probably couldn't kill, but if he needed my blood, I got plenty. Might feel a little light-headed afterwards, though. :p

    If not Agares, then Oghma. If following Oghma gave me knowledge of magic, I'd eat up every arcane tome I could get my hands on. I'm an information whore.
     

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