Why Do Great Nations Fall ?

[Ahovking]

The Ancient Greeks, The Roman Empire, The British Empire and The U.S.S.R.....

As far as i see it they all make the same mistakes... they turn their back on the principles that made them great.

what do u think ?

 

[member66170]

The ancient greeks were never a Nation.

And its not that simplistic. If anything, its the opposite, failing to adapt to changing circumstances. Also, building a great empire requires some luck (if only having a few generations of great generals/politicians in a row), after a while the streak runs out and somebody else hits the jackpot.

But seriously, in hundreds of years of literature there is no agreement on why any of those in your list fell, so claiming that there is a simple ideological cause underlying them all is, at best, childish.

 

[madviking]

Dynastic cycle pretty much.

- New nation is created, with powerful statesmen.
- Those statesmen power the nation through expansionary phase.
- The next generation continues expansion/enters peace and prosperity.
- Peace and/or prosperity begins to whither away.
- Increasingly incompetent leadership rises to the helm.
- Those incompetent leaders become very unpopular.
- Revolution/rebellion occurs.

 

[innonimatu]

The Ancient Greeks, The Roman Empire, The British Empire and The U.S.S.R.....

As far as i see it they all make the same mistakes... they turn their back on the principles that made them great.

what do u think ?

You couldn't get it more wrong. Everything changes, and there's no avoiding it. Even the romans already observed that, the theme of the unavoidable changing of the world goes back at least as far:
"nec manet ulla sui similis res: omnia migrant, omnia commutat natura et vertere cogit"
(nothing remains as it is: everything changes, everything is transformed as nature wills. Lucretius)
and was later retrieved into literally fashion during the renaissance again...

The roman empire lasted as long as it did because it changed to fit new conditions. Several times. Those who refuse to change, or want to go back to the "old ways"... sink into irrelevance in a world which has changed despite them. Like Sparta getting its ass kicked and turning into a "tourist village".

 

[civverguy]

Did you get it from this commercial?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTSQozWP-rM&feature=related

 

[Masada]

That ad is officially the best thing ever.

 

[Dachs]

The USSR ceased to exist because it adopted Christianity, which sapped the moral fiber of the Russian people, and because they concentrated too much power in the hands of one man, Aleksandr the Great, who was irreplaceable when he died.

 

[aelf]

That ad is officially the best thing ever.

QFT x10.

 

[Joecoolyo]

The USSR ceased to exist because it adopted Christianity, which sapped the moral fiber of the Russian people, and because they concentrated too much power in the hands of one man, Aleksandr the Great, who was irreplaceable when he died.

Really? I could have sworn it was Zheng He and his fleet of flying battleships.

 

[civ_king]

Really? I could have sworn it was Zheng He and his fleet of flying battleships.

You forgot the heroic Polish and Chuck Norris

 

[sophie]

No. The USSR collapsed from fear of the potential to become a potential superpower that Australia possesses.

 

[Dachs]

Really? I could have sworn it was Zheng He and his fleet of flying battleships.

No, he destroyed the Roman Empire. Try to keep up.

 

[Perfection]

When the machines rise up, all nations will fall.

 

[Earthling]

It's because they don't treat their next generations of children harshly enough. Spare the rod, spoil the child, what Socrates said, even ties in to that Chinese ad. Duh-uhhh

 

[Antilogic]

The USSR ceased to exist because it adopted Christianity, which sapped the moral fiber of the Russian people, and because they concentrated too much power in the hands of one man, Aleksandr the Great, who was irreplaceable when he died.

He he he... reminds me of Gibbon. I'll give you a thumbs up for the reference.

 

[Tee Kay]

Don't forget how they nobly sacrificed their empire to stop the Axis Powers.

You couldn't get it more wrong. Everything changes, and there's no avoiding it. Even the romans already observed that, the theme of the unavoidable changing of the world goes back at least as far:
"nec manet ulla sui similis res: omnia migrant, omnia commutat natura et vertere cogit"
(nothing remains as it is: everything changes, everything is transformed as nature wills. Lucretius)
and was later retrieved into literally fashion during the renaissance again...

The roman empire lasted as long as it did because it changed to fit new conditions. Several times. Those who refuse to change, or want to go back to the "old ways"... sink into irrelevance in a world which has changed despite them. Like Sparta getting its ass kicked and turning into a "tourist village".

Exactly.

That ad is officially the best thing ever.

Yes.

 

[r16]

great nations fall when they really start to believe that inevitable decay can be averted by a brilliant series of actions that is only possible within a limited window of opportunity . Not a political intro but take USA getting into Middle East under the guise of denying the oil to China . Not that they have the flying ships , yet even that didn't stop Americans to use their "invincible but fleeting superiority " to get themselves into a mess and ı am interested in real life in a sufficient enough level to see it was far worse for Middle Easterners .

 

[Dachs]

great nations fall when they really start to believe that inevitable decay [rest of post]

 

[r16]

it is so nice to get laughs , you know .

staying in the same area , the very place Americans are now advised to wrap up the Taleban by June . And what they do , they bring tanks ... never minding the previous guys , the Russians whose prowess in handling armour- especially by the guys who started the trade from the environs of Stalingrad- is so misrepresented in the Beast , a Hollywood production that got it wrong about 30 percent or so . Indeed the comparisions are so apt , a country seemingly on top of the world yet mired in economic difficulties ; has world beating possibilities in tech ( Mig29 and the Su-27 and the paradigm shift they are to represent in Soviet military posture ) yet it seems not enough , the world must see how mean the country is and fear accordingly ... Conviniently , one must say , families of Russian advisors are butchered in Herat . Not by the influence of dark forces , not by the instigations of all conquering Western intelligence ; Brezinski and his smug assurance on the contrary is not real . And what did the Russians achieve in Afghanistan ? The theory is so simple when the theorician is so confident of himself . That he is number one , the day is the day and all it takes a kick to bring down the rotten structure .

and to claim American intervention in the Middle East in the 21 century was designed to deny oil to the Chinese is actually quite in favour of US attidutes , won't you say ?

 

[say1988]

Of the four in the four in the OP, the British Empire ended simply because it had no place in the latter half of the twentieth century. World politics had changed since the 18th and 19th centuries and there was no longer a place for a colonial empire. As such, they gradually, and generally peacefully with somenotable exceptions, released their hold on various colonies (starting with the white colonies in the latter half of the 19th century).