Wonder-Free Game?

[binhthuy71]

I'm playing as China and I'm going to play out the game without building any World Wonders. I'm playing on King level and I want to see whether or not it's possible to win or to at least come close. I stacked the deck in my favor by setting up a Duel, Continents map. I have a decent start; 6 Iron, 3 Cotton, Wheat, and Silver. My second city brought me 6 more Iron and Furs. A couple of more cities will get me Horses, Sheep, and Silk. I can't complain about the setup.

The CS's that share my continent are both Militaristic and I've Barb-hammered my way to an early Friend status with one of them.

Any thoughts or suggestions for winning strategies are welcome.

 

[Tabarnak]

A liberty IW rush start is fine until imm. level.

Tech IW and build cities. Put your last city en route for the 6 iron tile and only build units. For larger maps, do the same but with some lux techs before to suck money from the AI then take the Liberty free GS to bulb Steel. If you don't build wonders, make sure to take some from them!

Edit : Ok i tought you played a pang. map. For cont, maps, just focus on astro and navigation with a fast NC build with a beeline to education and focus on and . Again, if you don't build wonders, put your efforts on useful buildings enhancing units production.

 

[Cheeseisgood]

Personally I can't see how the map size being "Duel" puts it in your favour? That means your only opponent is going to have EVERY SINGLE cultural/military/science/income bonus from wonders, rather than having a few opponents with a few bonuses each like in a normal game?

 

[HappyBuilder]

Interesting. I may give that a try this weekend! Although I'll make it a bigger map than that; I want those wonders spread out as much as possible. I suspect that on King level, it should be easy enough to win the game. After all, you'll be conquering wonders as you go and you'll have more time to focus production on weaponry.

HB

 

[binhthuy71]

Personally I can't see how the map size being "Duel" puts it in your favour? That means your only opponent is going to have EVERY SINGLE cultural/military/science/income bonus from wonders, rather than having a few opponents with a few bonuses each like in a normal game?

I'm going to try and REX as much as possible short of ICS. Having to build units for defense/offense might impede that. I can build a city with a garrison and leave it at that for a while. China gets a nice early Science boost from Paper Maker. I'm going to try and build on that with a a focus on getting Education and then Science-oriented buildings. Yes, a larger map might help. I want to stay focused.

The main reason that I'm playing the game this way is that I feel that I'm bevoming too reliant on World Wonders.

 

[Helmling]

This is weird coming from me, since I am a profligate wonder-whore, but wonders are actually overrated. Channel all the production that would've gone into wonders into well-chosen alternatives and the wonders are hardly necessary. I agree with Cheese that the duel set up will actually add challenge, not stack the deck in your favor.

 

[Rpger29]

I consider the building of the wonders as being little mini-achievements in-game. Although the bonuses are nice, all that production could be going into other things. For me, there is only really a core of four wonders (HG,HS,ND,PT) that I wouldn't do without, and none that I couldn't do without.

I too am a wonder monger. I usually try to build at least 80% of the WW's on Prince, and 50% on King.

 

[binhthuy71]

Personally I can't see how the map size being "Duel" puts it in your favour? That means your only opponent is going to have EVERY SINGLE cultural/military/science/income bonus from wonders, rather than having a few opponents with a few bonuses each like in a normal game?

Turned out that you were right; I got steamrolled.

Now I really am going to throw a money wrench into the AI; Normal size map, Archipelago, and Raging Barbs. Think that I'll play as the Ottomans just to hedge my bet.

 

[Tabarnak]

Personally I can't see how the map size being "Duel" puts it in your favour? That means your only opponent is going to have EVERY SINGLE cultural/military/science/income bonus from wonders, rather than having a few opponents with a few bonuses each like in a normal game?

You can always finish him off soon enough anyway. A beeline to Navigation on a cont. map is more than enough.

 

[jtb1127]

I think it sounds like a reasonably challenge. I've gone games without them, although that was on a lower difficulty.

 

[binhthuy71]

Okay, so far the score is AI:4, Me:0.

I am going to try Tabarnak's suggestion to beeline Navigation on a Continents map.

One thing stands out so far; I have been using World Wonders to paper over weaknesses in my game play. Doing without them has compelled me to look deeper into how I might compensate for their absence. That is improving my game by leaps and bounds. I intend to keep on with this until I can win decisively, or at least not lose decisively.

 

[KillingMeSoftly]

Are you building National Wonders, or skipping them? I find they're the backbone of my Empire especially when playing on Emperor. Getting a certain wonder isn't guaranteed unless you've got a Great Engineer ready to pop, or you're ahead of everyone (which is unlikely unless you're going hard science). So I try to aim for only a few World Wonders in my games, just the ones I really, really need for my desired win. The others are useful for distracting the AI (so they build them hopefully instead of the one you want). Plus if you're going Domination the AI can build the wonders for you.

In normal games where you aren't trying a specific challenge, consider picking ~3 or so World Wonders-- only the ones you really need for your win-- and only build those, if you think you're relying too much on WWs.

 

[binhthuy71]

I'm building National Wonders. I consider them fair game because every civ can build them. If I could win at any level above Prince sans both World Wonders and National Wonders I would consider myself capable of winning on Deity.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

The advantage of Wonders is they don't cost any gold to support (unlike Units+Buildings)

Early focus on Settler/Worker/Military for rex

Move to Military/Building focus.

Make sure you have enough gold

Use the military advantage.. the other way to beat the AI

 

[binhthuy71]

The advantage of Wonders is they don't cost any gold to support (unlike Units+Buildings)

Early focus on Settler/Worker/Military for rex

Move to Military/Building focus.

Make sure you have enough gold

Use the military advantage.. the other way to beat the AI

I guess I'll have to sharpen up my modest warmongering skills. I tend to try for Cultural or Science victories and absent the ability to build World Wonders attaining either of those Victory Conditions at King or above is just beyond my abilities.